Ranger Archive

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Tarnak_Archvold wrote:
The entire MMO gaming expense is becoming too much like real life. And this is just one more step in that direction.

A few weaks ago my brother send me this link, witch is yet another case of mmo's infringing on our real life.

I play this game to have fun, not to get a 2nd income. Moreover, if I play along side some who play to make RL $ then that takes away some of my fun. Why, well because to them I become nothing more then an asset to use in making money.


If such a system is only implemented for some servers, then the EBay trade will still continuo as before on the rest, as there will still be players playing there whom want to buy something for RL money. After all most of the buyers are normal players who just do not have enough time to get the in game items they want, they are going to play on normal servers and interact with the normal community.

So either it this scheme will be a big flop that has no bearing on the game, or it will have to be introduced on all servers.

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If SONY really wanted to stop this, what's to stop them from going after ebay?

Here's the thing that I think seems to be missing from Sony's thought process. If they begin to sanction the sales of these items, then they need to begin guaranteeing the items availablity and its status. If an item is removed from the game due to balance issues, they become responsible for any money that was spent in aquiring that item.

If I spent $100 for an in game item, and a week later they declared that item to be a bug, then SONY owes me the money I gave them and the player auctioning the item. It brings the EULA to a higher level as it opens up a level of ownership that had otherwise not existed.

Imagine SONY decided your TV was bugged and said... ok now you're going to have to give it back. No refund!

Of course they can't do that! Realistically, since their now treating these in game items as actual property, they would be responsible for the product. If the item is bugged it would need to be recalled and replaced not removed or nerfed.

One way that they can control the manner in which items are priced (in RL) is to open up their availability. Don't restrict them to powergamers but instead control their enterance into a gameworld.

Rather than dynamically generating items (which their code obviously can't control -see T-21s that do 4k damage) they should be statically generating items with a variety of implementations and then locking them to players.

What most SONY forgot when dealing with SWG was that the game was intended to be an RPG environment. Players enter and play their roles, other players then benefit from that. A player driven economy is what makes an MMO invulnerable to these EBAY players. If the best weapons in game could be created by crafters with enough experience and luck ... then through proper use of skills and ranomly generated luck they had the ability to perform above their stated dimensions, the RL value is moved away from items and into skill ... which you cannot buy.

Think about it like this. If the best T-21 in game did 500- 1000 damage, and then the character template could increase that, would you be buying the T-21? NO!

Now let's take that a step farther. Lets say that any character template, at max, was capable of adding 100 damage to that max but the players ability to play the game (ie tactics) could increase the value of that damage would players be buying the pre-generated char templates? Maybe... but if the root of the templates power came from the player the template would be pretty much standard and not worth selling really.

But players want Legendary abilities? If you build a game that is made for exploration (like SWG was intended) than players add that legendary quality by going out and doing what they need to do to be recognized. PvP, leading squads against PvE, building a continuing storyline in which the player becomes immersed, etc.

Anyway...Fight the problem, don't add to it.

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Jolandir wrote:

Before you get to upset with this, look closely at what it says. They will make special servers for this and only those who wish this kind of possibility, and play solely on these servers, will have to honestly deal with this.

So on our normal servers (and so far they are only talking about EQ2) they will still have the same standing policy. So if you and I don't want this on our servers (at least no more than is already going on illegally) then we will play on "clean" servers. You would have to chose this option and you will have to play on those specific servers. So unless they changed it to allow it on any and all servers this is really not a problem for you and I. So don't get to upset about it at this time.

Jolandir

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Ah, yup. But they also say they'll be looking at how popular it is on those servers and keeping their options open for rolling it out across the board.

Reading between the lines, it's going to be on special servers on EQ2 in June, it'll be rolled out across the board after that and, as they're looking for cross-game compatability, we can expect a touch of it ourselves sometime.

Maybe I'll be 'pragmatic' about it, take out an EQ2 account and start selling enchanted tinkers of the cheese or whatever... (Goes off pondering how many of his nephews he can get grinding out high end characters in exchange for a % of the profits)




["You gotta pick a pocket or two, boys"-Fagan]

Someone mentioned UO, and about how ebay gold/items wasn't rampant.

Unfortunately, it ruined UO in many ways.. Like player housing.

Cash for virtual homes (because all housing space was taken, and it was rare that a new one would open up).

Small houses would sell for $75.. $100+ in a prime location. Larger would sell for over $200. Anyone lucky enough to have a castle could easily eBay it for over $1000.

Then came Vet accounts with veteran rewards tied to it.. ultra rare items, special mounts and other cool things, only useable by an account with an appropriate age. Several hundred dollars..

Then "businesses" began to open up... UOtreasures, etc.. selling gold and items. A couple of years ago, a new expansion was released for UO that introduced "New Land" for housing. The servers were so swamped with people rushing to log in to place a huge lot or castle, that the servers crashed for days. At the same time, new housing lots were being placed onto eBay with starting bids of +$200.

To some extent, people would've rushed into this anyway -- selling houses for lots of gold... but the lure of real life cash was greater. People bought multiple accounts just to be able to place more houses, and ebay them all -- only to delete their "starter" account a few days later after they sold off the house. Huge real life profit in the thousands for some.


Then again, UO kind of created that environment.. but at least they didn't sanction selling items for cash.

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Anyway, enough of that story.. This sucks, but I'm not surprised.

If you think it won't affect you directly, you're wrong. Doesn't matter if it's a special server, or someone elses server.

The fact is that by allowing this, even if in a limited way, they're legitimizing selling virtual items for real life cash. The argument could be made that it's not wrong to ebay an item, since SOE condone selling accounts, credits, gold, in-game items, etc for real life cash. (as long as they get a cut of it)

Also, think of this... The players that go out and farm... the ones selling in-game items for cash, will be making a profit for SOE on commission of each sale.

Pass me a tinfoil hat if you want, but it would seem a wise business decision to cater to those players.. more uber lewt, rare items, ub3r spawns, and the changing of game mechanics focused on items, rather than players, professions or community.

And for the record, if this makes it to SWG, I plan to sell off all my credits and items, and grind a jedi to sell off using this new service -- then cancel my subscription. Might as well do it while the cash value is still high.

Message Edited by frightwig on 04-21-2005 08:02 PM

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JBMat wrote:

Some boo boo head on my server actually bragged that it was cost efficient for him to buy his Jedi and then pay the guy who originally owned the Jedi to grind it for him. Did the math and everything. Dumbazz.

Said boo boo head got bored with the game and is gone. Good riddance to such a bonehead. He got bored he said. Well no crap Sherlock. Anthing you can get and not earn is not worth a bucket of warm spit.

Welcome to capitalism at it's finest. Or lowest, I am not sure. Granted we all know that communism failed, and socialism is about as freaking stupid (no apologies to Canada and Europe, but socialism is freaking dumb dumb dumb) but this new tack has me questioning the profit and loss motive behind SOE. Wonder what their percentage take will be?

JB

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The entire MMO gaming expense is becoming too much like real life. And this is just one more step in that direction.

A few weaks ago my brother send me this link, witch is yet another case of mmo's infringing on our real life.

I play this game to have fun, not to get a 2nd income. Moreover, if I play along side some who play to make RL $ then that takes away some of my fun. Why, well because to them I become nothing more then an asset to use in making money.


If such a system is only implemented for some servers, then the EBay trade will still continuo as before on the rest, as there will still be players playing there whom want to buy something for RL money. After all most of the buyers are normal players who just do not have enough time to get the in game items they want, they are going to play on normal servers and interact with the normal community.

So either it this scheme will be a big flop that has no bearing on the game, or it will have to be introduced on all servers.

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Creaturetaimer wrote:

not to get into a political arument or anything but the reason communism isn't possable is because Charles Marx didn't take into account that a greedy, brutal, and sorry excuse of a human being could ever get into a major political office. he counted on the good nature of the human spirit.................THAT WORKED DIDN'T IT! lol. good idea that is unworkable because of human nature.

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Rasst wrote:

SOE made wise decision!

Stop complaining and think again: ALL TRADERS WILL BE KEPT FROM SOME SERVERS! No camping for real money - just normal fantasy game! My dream will come true.

And all traders will trade things each other - that make me even happier

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With all due respect. I think you are overestimating the general server population here. The buyers, will not be playing on the special trade servers. They will be playing on regular servers, with the rest of us, they have as little interest in playing on a server full of professional campers as non buyers have. And for that reason there will still be professional campers on the non trade servers, simply because there will be a demand there.

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admiraljz wrote:

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Creaturetaimer wrote:

not to get into a political arument or anything but the reason communism isn't possable is because Charles Marx didn't take into account that a greedy, brutal, and sorry excuse of a human being could ever get into a major political office. he counted on the good nature of the human spirit.................THAT WORKED DIDN'T IT! lol. good idea that is unworkable because of human nature.

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What about Karl Marx? What did he have to say about Communism?

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LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL - could have been worse - he could have said Groucho