Ranger Archive
Thread: Ranger Revamp: Idea Archive (Geniuses At Work)
Mot-Irujam
Thu Mar 03, 2005 6:49 pm
#14
My favorite is Outdoorsman 1. If HTFB's are moved to Master ranger, I would go nuts. I love HTFB's, but I dont have the skill points available to master ranger 
Phenix1050
Fri Mar 04, 2005 3:43 am
#15
Mot-Irujam wrote:
My favorite is Outdoorsman 1. If HTFB's are moved to Master ranger, I would go nuts. I love HTFB's, but I dont have the skill points available to master ranger
Outdoorsman 2 is SO much better =P
Owen-Lars
Thu Mar 17, 2005 8:55 am
#16
UPDATE: 17/3/05
Name: Ranger 2.0
Author: Owen-Lars
Overview: Ranger 2.0 focuses on an anti-scout aproach to revamping Ranger by focusing on 'Knowledge areas'. The skill onion is not a wish list of everything we have thought of but a core set of skills that have a better chance of getting implemented. The roles and interactions of each tier are highlighted throughout and backed up with an array of skills ranging from pathfinding to intel gathering.
Author: Owen-Lars
Overview: Ranger 2.0 focuses on an anti-scout aproach to revamping Ranger by focusing on 'Knowledge areas'. The skill onion is not a wish list of everything we have thought of but a core set of skills that have a better chance of getting implemented. The roles and interactions of each tier are highlighted throughout and backed up with an array of skills ranging from pathfinding to intel gathering.
FourthNail
Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:05 am
#17
agent156 wrote:
Amsaran wrote:Discussion of Ranger as a Lawman
One riot, one Ranger.
I'm a descendent of one of the first Texas Rangers, and related to many since then, including some active right now. Can't help but like the idea.
OUTSTANDING!!! I too am a decendant of one of the first generation Texas Rangers. As a matter of fact, my toon is named after him, Plunk Murray was my great, great, great grandfather. His real name was Newton Harris Murray and he rode with James B. Gillette during the Indian wars in Texas. Gillette wrote the book, Six Years with the Texas Rangers. Plunk got his nickname when he was a kid.
Turns out he was kind of a character as well. Here's some info on him as to who he rode with before he became a Ranger - Newton H. "Plunk" Murray.
I too love the idea of the Ranger as a lawman. That's how I'm working my Ranger within my guild. Iron City Sherrif
Plunk
Message Edited by FourthNail on 03-17-2005 08:18 AM
TKMFelixx
Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:28 am
#18
Im currently grinding ranger couse I thought it would be a fun proffession to go with my TKA template... more fun then even master commando was oneof them also lol
Been reading your post about what you want ranger too be and what you think it is as far as SWG is conserned... ive done some researce and have only came across one starwars char that is mentioned as a master scout and maybe ranger class. his name is Lak Sivrak..
here is the link that tells abit about him
http://galactic-voyage.com/Light%20Side-Characters-Lak%20Sivrak.htm
im sure some of you knew this already but just posting so others can see a starwars ranger template... just one but only one ive found so far....
also some powers that might be cool too make rangers alot better
#1 double the swimming speed for rangers.
#2 smoke bombsor smoke screens confuse them critters coming after us lol
#3 mine astaroids in space from a ship. good for some hard toofind resorces.. besides space is a big place too explore what better place for a ranger.
#4 quest item(Stealth Suit) usable onlyby master ranger or master commando's takes toon off radar and makes him have visable stealth only if you dont attack anything.... cant be detected at all sept faction locator if you have one by a faction HQ hehe new use for a worthless item...
would enable you too get into faction base undetected and disable turrets or somthing like that.....
Message Edited by TKMFelixx on 03-30-2005 08:58 AM
Grendel-I-
Sun Apr 03, 2005 3:05 pm
#19
Wow, it seems someone beat me to this idea. lol I love the idea of rangers getting mission terminals in the larger camps. This alone will make ranger invaluable for group/guild hunting trips. As for the idea of making Rangers like the Texas Rangers......eeck! Isn't the ranger supposed to be like the big game hunt master? You would rather be mobile law enforcement, like a sheriff?
BioEngine
Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:24 am
#20
Ok, I've been away for a couple of days, so now I get to add to my fellow Rangers' plea.
Please, I do not want to only have to master 2 trees to get Ranger. I enjoy every tree of Scout, and I need every tree of scout as they build upon the ones in Ranger. If anything is to be done to scout, then condense all 4 scout trees into 2 Ranger prerequisite ones and make 2 pre-Creature Handler trees (which is what happened to Medic in respect to Doctor and Combat Medic.)
Let us obtain the health bonuses from Ranger skill boxes and Scout skill boxes. We have to hit, to damage, and defense bonuses, and on top of that our traps always start combat when thrown. The only defensive abilities we have as a class feature are Camo and Mask Scent, and their purpose is to avoid combat with the creatures we are intended to fight with our bonuses to hit and damage.
Give us a Ranger Hat. I think that this is past due, and it is not at all difficult to integrate. Let us show our pride for having mastered a profession that many do not. I believe that, since dancers have leotards, doctors have sidebags, and crafters have tool sets, why can't we have some item that helps with our crafting, fighting, or camouflage abilities? Even a +5 would be nice, nothing big or overpowered. Tailors have been asking for a new hat to be able to make, and I think that this would appease both of our professions.
Give us at least one weapon certification. Hunters rarely use traps. I have gone hunting with my family on many occasions, and I have never seen any one of them chase and kill an animal with their bare hands. Traps only affect the target, and bring them to you (out of anger, or wishing to make close combat attacks.) Even if the weapon could only be made from creature-dropped pieces, that would only make it a grander idea for Rangers because we could be proud of the efforts we went through to hunt down the creatures and make the weapon ourselves (or have a weaponsmith make it.) It would only put that much more value into it.
If we can't have a weapon certification, then at least let us make weapon powerups that we can attach to our weapons which have limited uses (severly limited even) but have the exact same effect as traps upon the target. I know that logistics would restrict that from energy weapons, but since I'm a Teras Kasi, some rangers are swordsmen/pikemen/fencers, and Rifles can be non-laser ammunition types, this is an acceptable alternative.
I am not sure why we got the "all-around" armor proficiency, but we should get the higher bonus to kinetic as that is the only type of damage that creatures can deal of the two considered in new armor types. I do not understand why we were given the average protection type, but I do believe that it will become a problem for us in the future.
Tracking is awesome. There is no argument there. I would like to know, however, why we are able to track players. Is this a way around the Rifleman ability to drop off the radar? I would hope so.
Foraging? The box that states "you have a chance at foraging a rare item" is not functional. It either needs to be fixed, or have that description removed.Foraged items, in general, do not offer any beneits that can match those of a novice chef's. I would assume that at higher levels of Ranger we could forage more foods, or have a chance to forage better foods, but this is not the case. We need to either have better foragable goods at Ranger or have more of the same goods foraged at one time. Also, the benefits of foraged foods do not reflect the stomach-filling stat. These items fill too much of our stomach to be of any use. We should be able to eat many items before our stomachs fill, but I have only got up to 3 before it filled, and this should not be the case since it is in no way a possibility to exploit. Are there any foragable items that regenerate instead of buff? I have been forced to drop Novice Medic because I don't have enough skill points to keep it, Master Ranger, and Master Teras Kasi, soI would like to think that they could prove a little more useful than they are now, even if you had to make them only edible by Rangers to prevent people from taking advantage of it. The durations are also in need of review.
With our creature to hit bonuses, we will be in demand for hunting groups. However, with the CU and changes to creature HAM and armor, we will not be able to stand our ground in a fight equal to our group's level if we do not have 3K health. That bonus to hit and damage will not last long.
These are my thoughts. Take them for what you will.
Rabideko
Ranger_dude
Mon May 09, 2005 9:14 am
#21
At the momentRanger isthe ONLY elite profession in the game that requires the mastery of a novice profession. (Master Scout).
Why do we get the LEAST bonus to Defense/Offense of ALL the combat professions?
Even a squad leader has their own weapon, We don't deserve a special Ranger rifle?
Traps need to work better on higher level animals. as they are an important part of being a Ranger. Same thing with Concealment.
Our camps should provide some kind of protection against creatures. As it stands creatures walk in and out of the camp and attack the campers.
Leafgreen
Mon May 23, 2005 11:21 pm
#22
The abilities and 'feel' of a bounty hunter, commando, combat medic, etc are based on contemporary models, mostly from games.
Ranger is underpowered.
Squad Leader is pretty underpowered too.
But... why do rangers get rescue? Shouldn't that go instead to Squad Leaders? Honestly, why give a rescue ability to a class who is mostly solo... (i didn't say EVERYONE goes solo with ranger!)
And yet, when you think of a ranger, don't you think of the old hermit/straggly/loner/trapper type with a personalized elephant gun that lets him kill nearly anything, but is slow? Do they ever miss? They don't NEED speed if they almost always hit for massive damage.
Oh yeah, I left out that rangers skin/eat their kills, so they do have a better than average idea of WHERE to shoot a critter at - that should be worth some type of damage bonus.
But also when you think of a ranger, don't you think of them being closer to wilderness,knowing the wildlife and being able totame a normally wild creature if they so choose?
I'm actually glad that we get to choose our weapon type - squad leader is forced to take pistols. Of course, some weapon bonuses would be nice too.
Give rescue to Squad Leader. Give Ranger minor Creature Handler (tame) abilities. GiveRanger some damage mods (i suggest with a rifle). Give rangers a master level rifle that is worthwhile. Give rangers a master level rifle that is worthwhile. Give rangers a master ........
Serraphin
Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:48 am
#23
In regards to a revamp, an upgrade, or just a mod to our profession trees I think we need to remember that there needs to be a give and take. For example Ranger + (Combat Profession) should not be equal to (Combat Profession) + (combat Profession) in terms of overall combat ability. Why? The combat stacker should be superior at combat because that is what they have to offer a group. The Ranger + (Combat profession) should be somewhat stronger than it is currently but we also brings traps (State changes, Roots, Snares, and de-buffs), Tracking, Harvesting, Group Harvesting Mods, etc to the group. Our utility must come at a price. We can't have our cake and eat it too. Now the problem we have is that our utility does not yet compensate for our lack of combat ability when compared to a pure combat stacker. To alleviate this using the current system (Post-CU) I would offer the following general ideas, please let me know what you think. This forum has been great for developing proposals and perhaps someone would be willing to help me along with these general ideas.
Wayfaring
--GeneralRanged & Melee Accuracy & Speed Mods
This line should offer some General Accuracy and Speed Mods spread throughout the tree. I actually like the way the 0004 tree in Squad Leader handles these mods. It should offer a slight benefit to improve melee and ranged combat ability without being overpowering).
--Camo
Camo should be treated as a short term CL buff with a refresh. This would allow camo to work as the Ranger community has intended (and perhaps within a level of dev acceptance). For example, if a Master Ranger (CL 80) applies camo to himself on Dathomir and the camo gives a +40 CL bonus (when applied by a Master Ranger) then during the buff the Master Ranger would be CL 120 in terms of agro. This would shrink the agro range of the Camo'd Ranger significantly against all mobs, NPC and Creature alike. This would then provide a substantial benefit to the Ranger and his group as we could then provide agro mitigation.
Camo should also involve the crafting community in the following way. Bioengineers should be able to craft Camo enhancers or an additive to allow us to buff our camo when crafting it allowing for longer duration or higher CL rating. Chefs could make food that would reduce the cool down timer in between camo use.
This line should offer some General Accuracy and Speed Mods spread throughout the tree. I actually like the way the 0004 tree in Squad Leader handles these mods. It should offer a slight benefit to improve melee and ranged combat ability without being overpowering).
--Camo
Camo should be treated as a short term CL buff with a refresh. This would allow camo to work as the Ranger community has intended (and perhaps within a level of dev acceptance). For example, if a Master Ranger (CL 80) applies camo to himself on Dathomir and the camo gives a +40 CL bonus (when applied by a Master Ranger) then during the buff the Master Ranger would be CL 120 in terms of agro. This would shrink the agro range of the Camo'd Ranger significantly against all mobs, NPC and Creature alike. This would then provide a substantial benefit to the Ranger and his group as we could then provide agro mitigation.
Camo should also involve the crafting community in the following way. Bioengineers should be able to craft Camo enhancers or an additive to allow us to buff our camo when crafting it allowing for longer duration or higher CL rating. Chefs could make food that would reduce the cool down timer in between camo use.
Trapping
(Roots, Snares, De-buffs, State changes)
--Every tree should have at least one trap and this is easily changed by reallocating all traps from scout thru ranger over the range of both professions
--Traps should rely on the trapping skill to use them but the CL rating to apply them (because traps are by their nature combat oriented).
--Crafting of Traps needs to be modified. Traps offer utility so creating them should come at a price. Traps could have the following characteristics Uses (Quantity), Effectiveness, Duration, Area of effect (AoE traps), Range (?) and (pulse*) for roots/snares. When crafting a trap the quality of resources used would affect all of the stats involved. If a ranger uses poor resources to craft traps then they will produce poor traps. This creates an opportunity cost for trap crafting. Do I use the resources that earn me money to craft great traps, or do I buy my traps from another ranger known for trap crafting. A ranger can use his experimentation points to increase the Uses (Quantity), Effectiveness, Duration, Area of effect (AoE traps), Range (?) and (pulse*). Then there is a trade off with the crafting of traps that makes then rather unique.
--The crafting of traps should involve other crafting professions. For instance the P Dart could require a weapon power up to use (i.e. trap launcher power up--allows the use of Pdarts at weapon range 25 uses) or a trap launching droid. In this way the Ranger either needs the trap droid or the weapon mod for certain traps. Again the utility of the trap can be hampered by the needs for its use. Another example would be an AoE Snare may require subcomponents from aweaponsmith such as a dispersal mechanism (AoE snare could allow a group to run when too adds have agro'd)
(Roots, Snares, De-buffs, State changes)
--Every tree should have at least one trap and this is easily changed by reallocating all traps from scout thru ranger over the range of both professions
--Traps should rely on the trapping skill to use them but the CL rating to apply them (because traps are by their nature combat oriented).
--Crafting of Traps needs to be modified. Traps offer utility so creating them should come at a price. Traps could have the following characteristics Uses (Quantity), Effectiveness, Duration, Area of effect (AoE traps), Range (?) and (pulse*) for roots/snares. When crafting a trap the quality of resources used would affect all of the stats involved. If a ranger uses poor resources to craft traps then they will produce poor traps. This creates an opportunity cost for trap crafting. Do I use the resources that earn me money to craft great traps, or do I buy my traps from another ranger known for trap crafting. A ranger can use his experimentation points to increase the Uses (Quantity), Effectiveness, Duration, Area of effect (AoE traps), Range (?) and (pulse*). Then there is a trade off with the crafting of traps that makes then rather unique.
--The crafting of traps should involve other crafting professions. For instance the P Dart could require a weapon power up to use (i.e. trap launcher power up--allows the use of Pdarts at weapon range 25 uses) or a trap launching droid. In this way the Ranger either needs the trap droid or the weapon mod for certain traps. Again the utility of the trap can be hampered by the needs for its use. Another example would be an AoE Snare may require subcomponents from aweaponsmith such as a dispersal mechanism (AoE snare could allow a group to run when too adds have agro'd)
Frontiering
--Melee and Ranged Defense Mods
This line should add melee and ranged defense mods similar to those added by the 0400 Squad Leader tree. Again offering a nice boost to defenses but not too much of a boost.
--Camping (Combat Recovery)
Camps should provide a degree of safety to allow the Rangers group (or visitors) to safely heal, fix armor/weapons, and recover from the ill effects of spice, etc. after combat.
Mechanics of Camps: Camps should create a CL Zone based on the Camp and the level of the Ranger. For example, a HTFB could add + 80 CL to the ranger level. So a CL 80 Ranger and a HTFB would create a CL 160 zone. This would effectively prevent most creatures from agroing anyone within the camp and in practical terms provide creature repulsion. Obviously if a Krayt, GDK, or NS Elder came wandering along they would still agro as no camp should mitigate against these elite mobs.
--Additionally high level camps such as the HTFB should require sub components from at least 1 other crafting profession as they represent the highest levels of complexity.
--Forage
The forage table food buffs simply need to be redone. Foraged food should provide minimal but functional buffs that make them useful for extremely short duration. Chef food should always be preferable but the foraged items should be functional for when you are in a pinch. Additionally there could be areas that are very difficult to get into that would allow us to forage a power up for some crafted item be it camo, food, etc but that will take quite some time to create as there would need to be a method to prevent exploitation or imbalance to the present environment.
--Melee and Ranged Defense Mods
This line should add melee and ranged defense mods similar to those added by the 0400 Squad Leader tree. Again offering a nice boost to defenses but not too much of a boost.
--Camping (Combat Recovery)
Camps should provide a degree of safety to allow the Rangers group (or visitors) to safely heal, fix armor/weapons, and recover from the ill effects of spice, etc. after combat.
Mechanics of Camps: Camps should create a CL Zone based on the Camp and the level of the Ranger. For example, a HTFB could add + 80 CL to the ranger level. So a CL 80 Ranger and a HTFB would create a CL 160 zone. This would effectively prevent most creatures from agroing anyone within the camp and in practical terms provide creature repulsion. Obviously if a Krayt, GDK, or NS Elder came wandering along they would still agro as no camp should mitigate against these elite mobs.
--Additionally high level camps such as the HTFB should require sub components from at least 1 other crafting profession as they represent the highest levels of complexity.
--Forage
The forage table food buffs simply need to be redone. Foraged food should provide minimal but functional buffs that make them useful for extremely short duration. Chef food should always be preferable but the foraged items should be functional for when you are in a pinch. Additionally there could be areas that are very difficult to get into that would allow us to forage a power up for some crafted item be it camo, food, etc but that will take quite some time to create as there would need to be a method to prevent exploitation or imbalance to the present environment.
Hunting
--Reduce the overall Harvesting mods if the other ideas are implemented (there must be a trade off)
--Extend area track range and fix the blind spots
--Player tracking or tracking of elite mobs needs to be at the Master Level
--Reduce the overall Harvesting mods if the other ideas are implemented (there must be a trade off)
--Extend area track range and fix the blind spots
--Player tracking or tracking of elite mobs needs to be at the Master Level
Looking for any feedback, constructive or otherwise. I am obviously used to both constructive and non-constructive feedback, albeit generally self-inflicted.
Message Edited by Serraphin on 06-03-2005 09:49 AM
Message Edited by Serraphin on 06-03-2005 03:28 PM
***Edited to change Ranged ACC & SPD bonuses to both Ranged and Melee ***
Message Edited by Serraphin on 06-03-2005 06:47 PM
Message Edited by Serraphin on 06-03-2005 06:48 PM
Starson
Fri Jun 03, 2005 5:36 pm
#24
Just remember that all Rangers are not ranged, I myself perfer melee, so mods should be gereral in effect, pls don't force me into a ranged profession.
Leafgreen
Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:33 am
#25
Why should we have a reduced harvest? We're not much higher than scouts as it is.
Also, why not some placeable traps? Some that affect npcs? A dart or gas trap doesn't have to work on just animals.
BlueGlowy
Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:52 pm
#26
Here are some examples of "rangers" from different settings, fictional and real-world. My purpose is to add some food for thought on how an SWG Ranger might be seen by others.
The Leatherstocking Tales (J.F. Cooper's "Last of the Mohicans") depict the life of Nathaniel Bumppo (a.k.a. "Hawkeye"). A fictional hero of early colonial, pre-revolutionary American history. Not only was he a hunter of epic proportion, but he served as a pathfinding scout and sharpshooter. A master of the 'long-rifle'. The era, and the man depicted in the stories as the central character, match the era (and role) of the person acknowledged as the 'first' U.S. Ranger (which predates the founding of the U.S. as a nation, taking place c. 1750s and later). This 'ranger' was a sharpshooting scout.
In the Dungeons & Dragons game system, rangers are represented as (typically) stealthy masters of the wild - and greatly feared in combat in wilderness settings. Having skills with animals (similar but not as potent as say a Creature Handler), and combat bonuses in non-urban settings, the D&D Ranger has both the ability to see - and remain unseen - as well as dealing out death from adistance. These Rangers are snipers - but they use a bow with arrows instead of a Laser Rifle.
The U.S. Army Rangers historically served as long-range forward (and behind enemy lines) scouts *and* typically engage - and take over - tactical and strategic points of interest (modern day, this might be a mission to sieze and control an enemy airfield during the opening stages of a war). In short, they're equipped to fight - not just observe. They are the pointy end of the U.S. military spear.
Currently, SWG Rangers aren't a combat profession. As pointed out elsewhere, they didn't make it onto the CU chart. As a player that's been inactive for more than a year, I've come back to find many changes. Some of which are very positive, but it looks as if the Ranger profession was missed - I would love to see them become a true combat class worthy of the investment of skill points. I very nearly respec'd this char...but didn't have the heart to give up the title. I hold hopes that this SWG profession will one day become worthy of the name it carries.
-signed,
An Eclipse galaxy Master Ranger
Message Edited by BlueGlowy on 06-11-2005 11:07 PM