Ranger Archive
Thread: CU: Master Ranger with Minimal Combat
Even if you could prevent a higher level creature from killing you (using phenacine darts, for example), it is unlikely that you will be able to kill anything much higher than CL 1 due to the creature regen rates (I'll probably try this out a bit more once they put Ranger on the frogs as I'm interested to see what Master Ranger/Novice Marksman can do but I don't really have time to get there without a frog). I do believe higher than CL 1 will be possible, though (I was soloing purple cons with little trouble while traps were still broken, although the xp rate was lower than what I could get soloing whites or blues).
I'm assuming you want this to be solo progression. Grouping could increase the rates. If so, the same is probably true with medical xp. Even though they get the CL increase and such, I don't think the medical professions will be able to advance much faster if only because DPS will limit them (I am interested to see if a Master Doctor/Master Combat Medic or something similar can really kill stuff of the correct CL and, if so, at what sort of relative speed).
Trapping xp will probably be much easier than scouting xp after you get the phenacine dart and adhesive mesh traps. You don't actually need to kill the creature to get the trapping xp so snaring and rooting the creatures would probably be the method of choice for trapping xp with the given constraints. But this consideration only works if you are trying to grind the profession and not just use it for fun.
Other professions currently require other players in order to level (for example, dancer and musician and previously for all the medical professions). It could be argued that a Ranger with no combat profession should fall into this category (even if I don't agree).
Current xp rates seem to indicate that combat professions will get on the order of 1k xp per kill as they progress up their trees. This would put an elite mastery (not including the marksman/brawler prereqs) at 125k + 3*(175k + 250k + 350k + 450k) + 1000k xp = 4800 kills. This places an elite weapon mastery on the same order as doing Ranger scout requirements with only CL 1 combat skills. Although I'm tempted to believe that the xp amounts will go up as you progress up the tree (I just am quoting the 1k amount from a post I saw on another forum citing a similar problem in which I did not see an explicit statement of how far up the tree they were able to confirm this xp rate--I can't test this myself as I haven't had the time to get into an elite combat profession much less into a high level xp range).
I'm sure I'm missing something but I can't think of anything else right now.
This is really great work WildBil - Bravo!!
Message Edited by Vorpaks on 04-11-2005 09:25 AM
Vorpaks wrote:
I do not have maskscent on TC yet - does the xp you get from maskscent depend on Creature Level the way that harvesting does?
This is really great work WildBil - Bravo!!Message Edited by Vorpaks on 04-11-2005 09:25 AM
Most of the time, it doesn't seem to give any xp
.
Actually Chubas are roughly CL5. You must fear the mighty Chuba for it shall eat you and spit out your bones if you do not. A new player is now an exterminator without either a flyswatter or a can of Raid. They are limitedto trying to squash bugs... very small bugs.
WornTraveler wrote: Hm- that is so sad. Just think of the carnage: thousands of chubas must die!
Nemo0 wrote:Most of the time, it doesn't seem to give any xp
Vorpaks wrote:
I do not have maskscent on TC yet - does the xp you get from maskscent depend on Creature Level the way that harvesting does?
So far, I haven't gotten any XP from maskscent, but another thing I noticed is that there's no icon or state effect in my HAM bar to show that I have MS on, or when it disappears. I tried stretching out my HAM bar to see if it was obscured or something, but I still didn't see any icon to let me know that MS was activated.
Sorry to get off topic, but I couldn't find the original CU thread for scout/ranger related issues.
Nemo0 wrote:
*snip*
Current xp rates seem to indicate that combat professions will get on the order of 1k xp per kill as they progress up their trees. This would put an elite mastery (not including the marksman/brawler prereqs) at 125k + 3*(175k + 250k + 350k + 450k) + 1000k xp = 4800 kills. This places an elite weapon mastery on the same order as doing Ranger scout requirements with only CL 1 combat skills. Although I'm tempted to believe that the xp amounts will go up as you progress up the tree (I just am quoting the 1k amount from a post I saw on another forum citing a similar problem in which I did not see an explicit statement of how far up the tree they were able to confirm this xp rate--I can't test this myself as I haven't had the time to get into an elite combat profession much less into a high level xp range).
I'm sure I'm missing something but I can't think of anything else right now.
Ok, here's what I've been able to determine. If a Rifleman wanted to solo all the way to Master Rifleman, and assuming your right and the current "Whit Con" max remains the same (currently 800ish xp / kill). Here's the quick and dirty:
Master Rifleman Requires: 4,891,000 Rifle XP / 800 XP = 6,113 solo kills at CLs 1 through whatever the max is for Rifleman alone. (this will cover the combat xp requirement as well. Of course any healing done in the process will slow things down.)**
For those watching at home, 
, that means in order to MASTER a Combat profession you need to have fewer dead creatures than you need in order to Master a non-combat "Ranger" profession PLUS you still need to raise 4 tiers worth of experience (both survivals and both trapping).
That's right, a non-combat profession has to kill more creatures (or at least be present when more creatures are killed) than a combat professional ... and must do it with 1/3 the possible health and then raise 4 more trees of experience.
Again, draw your own conclusions.
Message Edited by WildBil2Me on 04-11-2005 12:04 PM
WildBil2Me wrote:
Nemo0 wrote:
*snip*
Current xp rates seem to indicate that combat professions will get on the order of 1k xp per kill as they progress up their trees. This would put an elite mastery (not including the marksman/brawler prereqs) at 125k + 3*(175k + 250k + 350k + 450k) + 1000k xp = 4800 kills. This places an elite weapon mastery on the same order as doing Ranger scout requirements with only CL 1 combat skills. Although I'm tempted to believe that the xp amounts will go up as you progress up the tree (I just am quoting the 1k amount from a post I saw on another forum citing a similar problem in which I did not see an explicit statement of how far up the tree they were able to confirm this xp rate--I can't test this myself as I haven't had the time to get into an elite combat profession much less into a high level xp range).
I'm sure I'm missing something but I can't think of anything else right now.Ok, here's what I've been able to determine. If a Rifleman wanted to solo all the way to Master Rifleman, and assuming your right and the current "Whit Con" max remains the same (currently 800ish xp / kill). Here's the quick and dirty:
Master Rifleman Requires: 4,891,000 Rifle XP / 800 XP = 6,113 solo kills at CLs 1 through whatever the max is for Rifleman alone. (this will cover the combat xp requirement as well. Of course any healing done in the process will slow things down.)**
For those watching at home,
That's right, a non-combat profession has to kill more creatures (or at least be present when more creatures are killed) than a combat professional ... and must do it with 1/3 the possible health and then raise 4 more trees of experience.
Again, draw your own conclusions.
**this is assuming that our hypothesis that "White Cons will always yield a "set" xp value" holds true.Message Edited by WildBil2Me on 04-11-2005 12:04 PM
Unless the pure Ranger gets help from another combatant. If said pure Ranger just followed said pure levelling Rifleman around, the Ranger would easily get all the required Scouting xp before the Rifle xp (assuming that the rifleman hunted mostly creatures). The same is true if it was a Scout/Marksman working their way up to Ranger/Rifleman. Some balance to both ends of the spectrum is necessary. Your analysis is excellent as a worst case scenario but, unless the scout xp cap per kill drops significantly, one also needs to consider the best case scenario. The best case scenario is on the order of a few hundred kills (I seem to recall scout xp capping at over 2000 xp per kill).
Nemo0 wrote:
*snip snip snip* Unless the pure Ranger gets help from another combatant. If said pure Ranger just followed said pure levelling Rifleman around, the Ranger would easily get all the required Scouting xp before the Rifle xp (assuming that the rifleman hunted mostly creatures). The same is true if it was a Scout/Marksman working their way up to Ranger/Rifleman. Some balance to both ends of the spectrum is necessary. Your analysis is excellent as a worst case scenario but, unless the scout xp cap per kill drops significantly, one also needs to consider the best case scenario. The best case scenario is on the order of a few hundred kills (I seem to recall scout xp capping at over 2000 xp per kill).
I discovered something very disturbing about this tonight actually. Scouting XP appears to be reliant on CL of harvester.
Now... let me say this: Until frogs are on TCEp3 I will be hardpressed to really provide good data (because it requires ALOT of switching between templates) but the information I gathered tonight showed an increase in scouting xp which was very interesting.
I grouped with a lvl 32 char who was scout 4/0/4/0 and I was 2/1/4/1 lvl 14. (about HALF his CL.)
here's where things got funny...
The lvl 32 player was pulling around 460xp / harvest (I don't have the exact on me) I was pulling 193xp / harvest. Now, I'd pulled my numbers from my experiences while harvesting between personal CLs of 7 and 14. Because nothing had changed over the course of those 7 lvls (or over the course of going from 1/0/1/0 scout to 2/1/4/1 scout) I assumed that these were cemented. After my experiences with the lvl 32 group I've begun to wonder.
My initial experiment appears to stand. My initial argument (simply) was that a Scoutbased characterhad to do a significant amount of killing before they could make it to Master Ranger. Now... if I'm right, it doesn't really matter what a character kills... because they're Scout XP may be capped according to their CL.
Because of the new variables and questions I think I have to declare my initial post a bit of a loss. There's an underlying mechanic which I've yet to completely understand or which has yet to be fully implemented.
Balrozgul wrote:
I didn't note when your first post was dated but we need to run this experiment again from scratch, because a few days ago I could swear that I was getting a LOT more scout xp based on the live way of amount harvested.
The goal of the test was to see what the requirements on a CL 1 scout were. I tested again (on TCEp3)last night and the CL1 Scout is still getting 68xp / kill.
The only thing that's really missing is pairing a CL 1 Scout up with a higher CL group. Otherwise all the data appears to be accurate from my experiences.