Ranger Archive
Thread: FAO Calc, re:combat revamp
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DaveG
Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:32 pm
#1
Something occurred to me, which I thought was worth putting on here, as it is a relavent point.
"SWG is an MMORPG (massively multiplayer online roleplaying game), not an MMOG (massively multiplayer onlinegame). What's the difference? Role Play of course. Therefore, those people(Rangersfor example) who choose to role play a lone hunter, are going tohave their chosen play style totally wrecked if the devs introduce too much group dependency in the new combat revamp. As the game currently stands, pre-revamp, people are free to solo or team/group as they please and thus nobody's play style is inhibited. Please don't spoil this and consequently inhibit lone hunters."
Message Edited by DaveG on 10-26-2004 04:48 AM
Trobon18
Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:38 pm
#2
I disagree. I think that rangers and others who RP the lone hunter will have some more problems, but they can still do what they do. If you want the resources you are used to getting, then yes it will be a lot harder, but that is the point of the rebalance.
I doubt that the rebalance will be so drastic that you won't be able to hunt alone. You just wont be able to solo nightsisters and (I will never say this is right) Krayt Dragons.
Not to mention that rangers shouldn't try to focus on hunting. It is a plus for us for sure, but the main point of our profession is the fact that we can move in the wilderness like no one else. Give us more of that and I would give up selling resources for ever. My view is rangers don't need money.
DaveG
Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:46 pm
#3
(This is not a flame)
Trobon18 wrote:
I disagree. I think that rangers and others who RP the lone hunter will have some more problems, but they can still do what they do. If you want the resources you are used to getting, then yes it will be a lot harder, but that is the point of the rebalance.
Which would thus reduce the enjoyment of the game. If you're enjoying it less, why keep subscribing?
I doubt that the rebalance will be so drastic that you won't be able to hunt alone. You just wont be able to solo nightsisters and (I will never say this is right) Krayt Dragons.
Personally I never have tried that. The biggest thing I've tried bringing down was Dune Kimoliga's, and that took long enough as it was, and cost me several stim packs to compensate for the already high HAM costs of rifleman specials (/concealshot in that case).
Not to mention that rangers shouldn't try to focus on hunting. It is a plus for us for sure, but the main point of our profession is the fact that we can move in the wilderness like no one else. Give us more of that and I would give up selling resources for ever. My view is rangers don't need money.
While I agree that Ranger should be free to adapt to one of several different roles, I thus inherrently don't agree that hunting shouldn't be a possible focus. Hunting is something that we can be very good at, and we shouldn't be denied that opportunity if we choose to take it.
Message Edited by DaveG on 10-26-2004 04:47 AM
Trobon18
Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:52 pm
#4
Not to argue, but I think you misuderstood. When I said that getting the resources you are used to will be harder I did mean it. However, as it is now we can get the best materials which allow us to sell to doctors, who in turn make the best buffs, which have been shown to hurt a lot of things in the game.
The point of the rebalance is to stop all of these people from being able to solo all of the high level creatures. The truth is that, while you wont be able to kill Rancors solo, you will probably be able to kill a lot solo still.
SolrFlare
Mon Oct 25, 2004 8:53 pm
#5
Well, that is what the sandbox will be for, to tune out the revamp. But I can say that I truly believe, in my opinion, that SWG needs more grouping. It needs a lot more grouping. It is severly lacking in group encouragment and dynamics and the overall game and community suffers horribly from it.
Now I do agree that they could go too far with this and end up with things being like EQ where if you don't group, there is no point. But I do think much more grouping is needed in this game and playing solo needs to be more difficult. Because right now its a walk in the park as long as you've got buffs and armor except in maybe 2 or 3 dungeons in the whole game.
DaveG
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:04 pm
#6
I understand what you're saying, and at one point, I'd have said the same thing. However, I realised something in the last couple of days.
As SWG is now, people are free to solo or group as they like. There is no penalty for grouping (not withstanding our 40% harvesting hit), so people can group up as much as they like. So I think the game as it is, in those terms, can't get any better, everyone is free to play the game as they please.
So the game allows you to freely choose how to play. Therefore, if the game as it is now has more solo players than grouped players, then that means one thing: The Majority of players want to play solo, and while this may be true, I'll say again, grouped players are free to group.
So, if the combat revamp forces people to group more, then the devs will have succeeded into steam rollering people into a mode of play they don't want. If this happens, it will be unfair and very bad for the whole SWG community.
For the record, I'm a lone hunter and I don't use doc buffs. I carry armour, but I only put it on when I'm being attacked. Most the time, I will roam the land, no buffs (except brandy), and no armour, just me, my droid and my rifle.
Trobon18 wrote:
...However, as it is now we can get the best materials which allow us to sell to doctors, who in turn make the best buffs, which have been shown to hurt a lot of things in the game...
I agree, but that is no reason for a combat revamp. It is, however, a reason to nerf doc buffs, it's simple and more to the point.
Message Edited by DaveG on 10-26-2004 05:10 AM
Trobon18
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:08 pm
#7
Most people want to play Solo for two major reasons:
1. You get mroe money.
2. You get more xp.
some people are:
3. You actualy enjoy hunting alone and don't want to be bothered by a large group.
#3 is great and It most likely wont change. However, they will nto be able to hunt Rancors (sorry this is my main example of the night)
Trobon18
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:21 pm
#9
so am I. I just can't take the idea of people being able to Solo Rancors when Luke had to use some nasty tricks to do it. THEY ARE BIG AND MEAN.
Vorpaks
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:25 pm
#10
I don't think it is beneficial to group. My friends and I used to group hunt. Creatures were so hard that everyone got xp, every one was useful, and everyone was happy. Gradually we noticed that this was less and less the case. We were just hanging out with each other and walking around practically one-shotting things. Even Endorian spiders and Merek Battlelords were no biggie. The person who gets the most shots off first gets all the xp.
It became that if we wanted to actually level, and not just hang out with each other (which we could do at the guild hall), we had to go solo. Even after we were through leveling there was nothing a Master Rifleman, a Master TKA Stacker, a Master BH, and a Master Doc/TKA could hunt together that was any where near challenging, and not camped. If you want to have a fun and challenging time as a group there are only a few places you can go - and then you have to compete with others for loot or just plain space. So if you want to have fun, you have to do it solo. The most fun in game I've had recently is hunting with my Master ID. Its a challenge to stay alive (and a challenge for my group members to keep her alive!
). But even the Master ID was able to easily walk across Yavin with only one bodyguard. And as much as I enjoyed not dying, it still seemed wrong.
So no, its not choice that is keeping us solo, its the fact that nothing can challenge us when we are grouped.
But frankly I think everything I said doesn't matter much, simply because we don't know what the CB will entail. We know what we hope it will do (different things I know
), but until we know what "it" is, is it really worth worrying about? When we start to get info and an inkling of what they intend to do then we can start our arguments. And I'm sure there will be many. 
Luckily we are all calm and logical debaters here, right??? J/k
Its actually nice to have something to debate about.
It became that if we wanted to actually level, and not just hang out with each other (which we could do at the guild hall), we had to go solo. Even after we were through leveling there was nothing a Master Rifleman, a Master TKA Stacker, a Master BH, and a Master Doc/TKA could hunt together that was any where near challenging, and not camped. If you want to have a fun and challenging time as a group there are only a few places you can go - and then you have to compete with others for loot or just plain space. So if you want to have fun, you have to do it solo. The most fun in game I've had recently is hunting with my Master ID. Its a challenge to stay alive (and a challenge for my group members to keep her alive!
). But even the Master ID was able to easily walk across Yavin with only one bodyguard. And as much as I enjoyed not dying, it still seemed wrong.So no, its not choice that is keeping us solo, its the fact that nothing can challenge us when we are grouped.
But frankly I think everything I said doesn't matter much, simply because we don't know what the CB will entail. We know what we hope it will do (different things I know
), but until we know what "it" is, is it really worth worrying about? When we start to get info and an inkling of what they intend to do then we can start our arguments. And I'm sure there will be many. Luckily we are all calm and logical debaters here, right??? J/kIts actually nice to have something to debate about.
DaveG
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:43 pm
#12
Yeah we can debate calmly
As for what you said, I kind of agree what you were generally talking about is indeed a factor, but I still think choice is a big factor, being a ranger I'd hope you'd recognise this more than others. There is still challenging content for groups in the game. Krayts (especially Ancients), and the corvette to name but two.
In the last debate we had about the combat revamp, I said I thoughtthe revampwas a waste of time and that some number tweaking was the answer. Specifically, nerf doc buffs, and reduce armour encumbrances, so that you don't need doc buffs to wear comp. Think about it, if this was done, then a lot more of the group-orientated content would be a lot more challenging simply because you're not in a doc-enduced god mode.
Message Edited by DaveG on 10-26-2004 05:45 AM
Trobon18
Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:48 pm
#13
But a lot of professions also need twiking... oh wait thats not the debate sorry I got flared up. =)
Anyway... Rangers will still have a place. However, like everyone else that place will be with lower lv creatures if you want to still solo.
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