Politician Archive
Thread: focused discussion for 1/19 changes (I'm only reading this thread!)
Message Edited by JarrekConell on 01-21-2005 11:33 AM
Scoooter wrote:Lemming,For one comparing pilot at zero skill points to politician is quite different. If you notcie the ground component of that (Shipwright) costs skill points. Making pilot zero skill points was a complete marketing/revenue decision. They are motivated by sales to fix issues with pilot and generate more sales. Their sales would have been severly hampered if skill points were required for pilot. The expansion just would have not sold as well to the existing player base.At zero skill points and the number of people that have politician now make politician very low on the priority scaleI agree whether it was intended before or not the skill point reduction does appear to be something they threw at us to shut us up.I however disagree that we should back down on the maintenence issue. I for one have put too much time and effort into the city I run to have it screwed up because they want to throw in a patch that was not thought out well so they can cater to players that "may" return.
I never said anything regarding the pilot profession, so I'm not sure where that came from. I'm also against the update regarding maintenance, and have stated such in a few posts now, do you have the wrong person?
Also, on another post where someone is saying that it's insane that city slots will be filled, I'd say that I've seen cities started and run by single individuals through the use of cross server exploits (yes, I'm calling it an exploit) and by only a few people using a number of alts or accounts that they're "keeping active" for a friend. It's not hard to scrape together 10+ characters on a whim. It's almost as easy as it is to get a friend to let you teach them ranged support a few times for the AP that some people seem to think will hinder the masses from getting politician.
It all seems to break down to the possible negative side effects outweighing the benefits of this change. As it stands you can be both a mayor and a perfectly capable combatant, crafter, or entertainer. I agree that this is just them trying to throw us a bone, quite possibly to distract us from the dagger in the back which is the maintenance change. I just question what it will lead to. The developers haven't always exhibited the best foresight on these matters...holocrons and jedi come to mind...
I would like you to please clearly post the exact problem 0 skill points will cause and in detail please describe the detrament they will have on the game and the community.
TheLemming wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
Lemming,
For one comparing pilot at zero skill points to politician is quite different. If you notcie the ground component of that (Shipwright) costs skill points. Making pilot zero skill points was a complete marketing/revenue decision. They are motivated by sales to fix issues with pilot and generate more sales. Their sales would have been severly hampered if skill points were required for pilot. The expansion just would have not sold as well to the existing player base.
At zero skill points and the number of people that have politician now make politician very low on the priority scale
I agree whether it was intended before or not the skill point reduction does appear to be something they threw at us to shut us up.
I however disagree that we should back down on the maintenence issue. I for one have put too much time and effort into the city I run to have it screwed up because they want to throw in a patch that was not thought out well so they can cater to players that "may" return.
I never said anything regarding the pilot profession, so I'm not sure where that came from. I'm also against the update regarding maintenance, and have stated such in a few posts now, do you have the wrong person?
Also, on another post where someone is saying that it's insane that city slots will be filled, I'd say that I've seen cities started and run by single individuals through the use of cross server exploits (yes, I'm calling it an exploit) and by only a few people using a number of alts or accounts that they're "keeping active" for a friend. It's not hard to scrape together 10+ characters on a whim. It's almost as easy as it is to get a friend to let you teach them ranged support a few times for the AP that some people seem to think will hinder the masses from getting politician.
It all seems to break down to the possible negative side effects outweighing the benefits of this change. As it stands you can be both a mayor and a perfectly capable combatant, crafter, or entertainer. I agree that this is just them trying to throw us a bone, quite possibly to distract us from the dagger in the back which is the maintenance change. I just question what it will lead to. The developers haven't always exhibited the best foresight on these matters...holocrons and jedi come to mind...
As long as your mayor abilities is about granting zoning rights and change taxes it doesnt worth the invested SPs.
You cannot do anything against a citizen, you cannot designate the exact locations of buildings. You just can ask and talk.
If you live with nice people (thank God, I am lucky in this), you will manage. If someone misplaces a building or not obeying the city's rules, you can't do anything. Not even if the whole city wants him to go. We need a rewamp. This 0 SP thing just shows what politician worths now. Nothing, 0 sp. Thats all.
Much like pilots, I think that since Politician is a skillset that only affects a small portion of the game directly, it shouldn't take away from people's combat/crafting very much.
As far as the maintenance change goes...that's definitely a two-sided beast. One one hand, you won't see your houses burn down. You'll be able to save them if they drop--and actually your bank account will automatically pay for it for a while. It's only condemned if you have a bankroll of 0.
BUT...it means that houses will clutter up cities until the player is deleted and their structures disappear along with them (however many months that takes).
I would recommend keeping the change, but added a check where if the account the house belongs to is not active...destroying it instead of condemning it. Only allow active players the benefit of a continued house existence.
Jaaan wrote:
For some sp they can do the same...
As long as your mayor abilities is about granting zoning rights and change taxes it doesnt worth the invested SPs.
You cannot do anything against a citizen, you cannot designate the exact locations of buildings. You just can ask and talk.
If you live with nice people (thank God, I am lucky in this), you will manage. If someone misplaces a building or not obeying the city's rules, you can't do anything. Not even if the whole city wants him to go. We need a rewamp. This 0 SP thing just shows what politician worths now. Nothing, 0 sp. Thats all.
If you're having trouble with people dropping structures in the wrong place I suggest you turn on militia and either drop the structures yourself, guide people in dropping the structures, or make your militia aware of the layout you have planned and have them guide the people placing structures. Militia is one of the most valuable skills in creating a good city in my opinion. I also feel that giving up and saying the profession is not worth any skillpoints (a very negative attitude) simply supports the idea of politicians not getting a revamp which would supply more useful skills.
IolasMacLeod wrote:I must state that all these complaints that implementing 0 Skill Points will cause cities to pop up all over the server is INSANE. You really think that a group of 10+ people are sitting around in an NPC city saying "Damn you SOE, if only Politician cost 0 skill points, then we would have the largest city on the server" ?OF COURSE NOT... get a grip
In reaction to your second post, if you read my previous ones instead of using all your energy to try and flame me you would see my concerns over this change. You might consider trying to add to the conversation instead of trying to pick a fight. This thread was started by Pappi to explore the possible ramifications of this publish, not get into a flame war.
Mayorship in SWG is like authority without rights. I am not thinking (or tought) on dropping it, but I pay for the game aswell. Taking my time with processes could be made easier is not a good thing. Managing a metropolis is compsumpting half of my online time (ok, i could make it worser, but i dont want to do so), and yields no reward. Not even friend citizens could see, how much work to run the administration for 101 persons. For change I got some skill decrease. Thats why I would vote on 0 SP (at least until some rewamp).
IolasMacLeod wrote:
I have been a mayor longer than 99.9% of the mayors out there, since December 2003 when the increased the cap size of cities on Naboo. I have never been a Master Politician however that has never really effected my city.
As I stated earlier in this thread 0 SP is a great feature. You speak of it being bad because people will be placing a lot more cities? Hold on there sweetheart.... first of all.. what business is it of ours or anyone for that matter who drops a city? They pay for the game as well and they can do whatever they want. Secondly if you have a group of people who really want a city, trust me they will find a person to pick up politician even if someone has to go out and buy a new copy of the game.
A slap in the face.. despite your remarks i still fail to see how 0 SP will do that to you. I mean lets face it in the grand scheme of things....being a POLITICIAN... you placed a city hall and maybe 3 civic structures, levy some taxes once in a while, throw a trainer and mission term here and there,and control the militia and zoning. Thats all you do as a politician. Now as a MAYORI take great pride and enjoyment in planning out the city layout checking, the maintenance, monitoring vendor upkeeps... but anyone can do that and many people in my city help they do not need to be politicians to do that. The politician profession does give you enough to be worth SP. The time and effort that we as mayors put into the city is payment enough for the skill, we should not have to pay with skill points.
Again I must refer to your final line of explosion of cities on planets? Its none of our business who places cities... and you REALLY think that there will be this mass flock to politician? what will it be the new FOTM?
Its time to accept the 0 SP feature and begin planning for the future. I recommend you all visit this site and start thinking about your templates, i know i have
http://swgcb.yogn.net/swg-cb.php
First off.. don't refer to me as "sweetheart" or any of your other pet names.
What business is it of ours or anyone for that matter who drops a city?
It is not our business, however if 90% of us care enough (like i would think we do)about this Profession and the future development of this profession then we better damn wellstart speaking up and voicing our concerns. Setting the SP at 0 is a COP OUT... plain and simple. I'm sorry, but I have a great deal of passion for this profession. This is a profession that MANY of us that have spent months and some over a year on because we have wanted to. NOBODY forces us to pick it up.. it was our choice. You don't want to spend the SP then don't pick it up.. simple as that. Like you stated above, we all PAY to play the game... so if someone feels they have been "wasting" their SP on this "dead" profession, by all means drop it. Play your game how you want to and quit making those of us that actually care about the future of this profession suffer.
And second off.. don't ever again imply that I don't take pride in my city or everyone involved in the creation of my city. Everyone that knows me on my server will simply state that i am the most well known MAYOR on Gorath. Not because of the pride i take, or the many lost hours of sleep to make sure everything was running smooth around the city.. but because i interact with everyone that enters my city or along my many travels across the galaxy. I'm sorry, but MY personal opinion (and last i checked we are all entitled to our opinions) is that if you get Player A thinking "oh boy, lets go start a city just because (not hard to gather up 10 players).. so these players create their fun little city and all go inactive (worst scenerio case) and viola we have another "dead" city. And honestly, the more i think about it.. I'm not even fully concerned with random players thinking they can drop cities.. i am worried about hostile takeovers. This is being made way too easy to do now.
Don't come in here bashing ppl for their opinions.. what one views as a good idea in their eyes may not be the case for another. As i'm sure all our parents used to say at one point or another "if you don't have nothing nice to say, don't say it at all". 
Chasity
Force Sensitive TKM
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Destinee
Solace City Mayor
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Message Edited by JarrekConell on 01-21-2005 12:53 PM