Player Associations Archive
Thread: Force Grouping and the CU
Page 1 of 3
badlandssunrunner
Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:00 pm
#1
Forced grouping just plain suks I dont care what u say its my opinon and
Im entitled to it just as you are to yours. Just becuase I dont want to run
around the game like swarms of street gangs becuase I have to depend
on others to do anything dont make me have any less value in the game
then the players that cant think for theirselves are.
The loot system suks badly if a group is goin after high end content then
the whole group should be rewarded not just one person in the group . It
took the whole group to defeat the problem not just one person . For those
who cant grasp this concept its amoung the core reasons most solo players
dont group others being they dont like to baby sit others......Is that so hard for
you guys to grasp.....
Some people like the thrill of accomplishment of personal quests set up by the
player for the players satisfaction due to lack of content in the game or content
they are interested in.
In the past normal players have been kept out of the loop when it comes to the
good loot in the game or forced to pay out the rear for it on the forums causing
problems with the economy in the game...
As a vet in this game I have earned the right to my opinon and wish to express my
dissatisfaction that one group of people have caused the problems that we face
today and for the developers to redesign the game to heavily rely on grouping is
just another slap in the face to those of us that dont like that kind of playstyle.....
I pay for two accounts like most of you do and feel my intrests in the game should be
protected as much as yours....... Why is this so wrong ?
Lixosskzzo
Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:57 pm
#2
Firstly, and I say this as as big if not a bigger vet than you, veteran status gets you a special color name, a veteran reward, and that's about it. Let's be honest, you say that you have no less value than anyone else, well the reverse is true. Your money is the same as a newb who just bought the game today. Sony wants you to keep playing, but they want new players, too. Thus, your opinion is no more important simply because you are a veteran.
Getting past that, the devs have said that xp rewards are going to be fixed. Currently they are too low. You will not be "forced" to group as you are now in the CU, you will be able to solo. It will simply be slower than grouping. Really, not all that much different than it used to be when there were no buffs, useless chef food, and everyone running around with no armor.
So basically what you are saying is that you want to do everything you can right now without a group. Well, the devs feel otherwise, and I'm inclined to agree. Nightsisters and the Singing Mountain Clan in the EU viewed stormtroopers as "not counting". When Luke mentioned that there were hundreds of stormtroopers in service of the Nightsisters, the witches simply said "They don't count". Why do you think you should be able to take one on all by your lonesome?
Some things should need groups. As it is, there really isn't much point in grouping at all, unless you're doing some horribly difficult dungeon where almost anyone in your group could get killed if something hits them for more than a few seconds. Why should the people that enjoy grouping at lower levels be punished? We've already determined that your money and theirs are the same. Do you really feel that it's fair that they can't find a group since noone sees any point in grouping?
Stemman-Intrepid
Sat Apr 02, 2005 6:03 pm
#3
I wouldn't worry your socks off about the CU... to tell you the truth, and as a fellow vet(been around since launch just never got a fourm account hehe) i have seen all their updates and fixes through my own eyes, and through simple logic i have come to the conclusion:
All their fixes as of now have been 6 of one half a dozen of the other, in which it changed but you basically could do the same stuff you did before... Thus i think this CU will definately change the combat system, but remember, im sure it will be just a new glove for the same hand... remember your "HAM" isnt going to take much of a hit, as a eilete combat master you have around 3000 health in the new system any way(and im sure your 'special' bar goes up too with master) so if anything they are saving us money and helping us ease our player time(right now it takes around 10-15 minutes to 'ready' yourself for combat, now it may be like 'permanent buffs' so there will be less wasted time and more solid grinding time)...
And remember everyone, there is no perfect system, in every system there is a 'flaw' to it and we will be able to do the same stuff we have done in the old system... and if you think about it, its just natural resistance to change, old farts like us that have been playing since launch don't like change, but it always seems to turn for the better in the end.
Ofcource i am optimistic... this could be Dooms Day...
heh
-Stemman
Stena
Sun Apr 03, 2005 4:28 am
#4
badlandssunrunner wrote:
Forced grouping just plain suks Whys this? because you no longer 'uber'?I dont care what u say its my opinon and
Im entitled to it just as you are to yours.Yes you are. Just becuase I dont want to run
around the game like swarms of street gangs becuase I have to depend
on others to do anything dont make me have any less value in the game
then the players that cant think for theirselves are. might be me but im not really understanding what this means.
The loot system suks badly if a group is goin after high end content then
the whole group should be rewarded not just one person in the group. You are rewarded, with xp. Alsothe leader can chage thetype of looting the group has so it's fair on everybody.It
took the whole group to defeat the problem not just one person . For those
who cant grasp this concept its amoung the core reasons most solo players
dont group others being they dont like to baby sit others. Or is it you cant work in a group?.....Is that so hard for
you guys to grasp.....
Some people like the thrill of accomplishment of personal quests set up by the
player for the players satisfaction due to lack of content in the game or content
they are interested in. The new combat will give you a thrill taking out a Krayt dragon after the CU will mean something, you would have had to work for it instead of spamming the same old attack with a odd intimidate and healing thrown in.
In the past normal players have been kept out of the loop when it comes to the
good loot in the game or forced to pay out the rear for it on the forums causing
problems with the economy in the game...No normal players have not. all you need is a combat prof and you can get loot. I cannot see how this keeps normal players from getting it. You dont have to have a 'uber' weapon to get loot you just need to use your prof and buffs. and that is what is wrong with the game...you just need buffs. This is what the CU is addressing as well as adding skill to the game and some sence of achivment.
As a vet in this game I have earned the right to my opinon So a newb doesntget the right to have a opinon?and wish to express my
dissatisfaction that one group of people have caused the problems that we face is this not you, you are talking about. because most of the ppl who are not complaning are just normal gamers. If you are complaning that you cannot hunt solo any more (more on that in a sec) than you must be talking about your self here.
today and for the developers to redesign the game to heavily rely on grouping is
just another slap in the face to those of us that dont like that kind of playstyle.....You will only have to rely on grouping for high level content when you are the master of your chosen combat profession. I think some people are taking this out of context, that they wont be able to do anything with out a group, well this is wrong. You will be able to do many things ungrouped but the high level content will need you to be grouped, and to be honest wheres the fun in spamming the same special all day with a /int and heal thrown in every now and then. At least you will have to think about combat.
I pay for two accounts like most of you do and feel my intrests in the game should be
protected as much as yours....... Why is this so wrong ? I also pay for 2 account, whoopy do! This does not make us twice as better as anybody else or twice as important.
The CU is the best for the game and believe it or not the dev's do know what they are doing and they are making the game better.
Sundell
Sun Apr 03, 2005 7:03 am
#5
We may not, and then we just might with good weapons and tatics be able to solo mobs that drop the good loot. I've been in TC5 on and off (more on) since it went up, alot has changed alot is the same. the ability to solo is still there, but untill we get access to the elite professions and work out what works and what doesn't theres no grounds to judge yet. guess it's a wait and see game for now.
badlandssunrunner
Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:49 am
#6
Maybe this will help explain where im comeing from :
Quoted from another server.....
LOL thats funny, so the lack of content is the solo player's fault now?
I started this game together with my brother about 500 days ago. After a month or 2, he left the game. Not much to do here, and the quests that were in the game were rather easy and stupid, and the rewards are worthless or not worth the trouble.
I stayed and started holo grinding, not much more to do. Because i played alot, and on european daytime, i played alone very often, and found out that you would advance faster, when playing solo. After 23 profs i unlocked, and again i had to play solo cause of the tef, and later BH missions.
So tell me, who's fault is it that this game became a more and more solo player oriented game?
The devs designed the game, they made it so that playing solo was/is more rewarding, and when you unlocked a jedi toon, they forced you to play solo.
The lack of content in the game is the biggest problem here, the good loot drops from high level mobs (except maybe DWB) and the quests are just stupid and not rewarding.
Lets say ppl need pearls after CU, and they go kraythunting, and lets say it takes a group of 15 ppl to take a krayt down. The droprate for pearls is what, 1 out of 4 or 5 krayts? So it will take the group 60 to 75 krayts, before everyone just has 1 pearl. Good luck with that.
badlandssunrunner
Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:21 am
#7
Lets try this from a diffrent perspective:
You have 3 types of players here..
A- PvP players the ones who think the game is all about them and their world who
sole existance in the game is to grief people leagaly thru what they call the sprit of
competition reguardless of how other people in the game want to experince the game..
B- Role Players people who want to experince the game from both sides of thecoin who
want to use the enviroment and all it has to offer to create and play in a seperate reality with
like minded individuals . These people tend to work together to create senairios that are fun
and entertaining leaveing the door open to all to join without forcing there agenda on others...
C- Solo Players people who want to enjoy the game at there pace with self set goals whos
achiements may or may not require a group to complete. Most solo players are more than
happy to join in group activities on their own terms not forced into the issue, They do not
require nor for the most part desire to play in group activities as it doesnt fit within their playstyle
or the content they wish to explore for the satisfaction of completeing goals for self-satisfaction
or not haveing to be baby set or haveing someone hold their hand through a problem these
people in real life tend to be trend setters not followers....
Now haveing said this lets take another look at SWG. Where has most of the griefing complaining and
exploiting occured ? Give you two guesses and they arent B and C...
So here we have one group of players who think they should be the dominating force in the game and
everyone should play by their rules and playstyle....
Now becuase the developers want to have high end content that requires groups to tackle, and create a
spirt of teamwork. They have created a problem with the rewards of that situation. No matter how lg or
small the group only one person is rewarded while the others in the group are suppose to say ok we
accomplished the task and oh yeah one of us gets a nice gift due to all the work of the rest of the team..
How does this encourage others to want to group and go at it again oh johnny got something now we
got to do it all over again so Jane can get something.... Well Johnny got his and is tired of that situation
and is ready to move on too something else thereby requireing him to stick around and do it again and
agin and agin to be sure the others in the group walks out with something too.
Herein lies the problem Johnny is bored dont feel like going thru it over and over and over again he wants
to move on to some other area in the game or just relax and play with the new toy or call it a night the
thrill of the experience is over and boredom sets in he dont really want to be there and doesnt give 100%
becuase why ? Hes allready done his part and wants to move on....
So in all fairness everyone that has completed the task should recieve something they all put the same
amount of time and risk into it and should be rewarded equally for their participation . I fail to see how the
current system that rewards one person for a groups efforts encourages anyone to want to group and have
to keep doing the same task repetitively (SP).. As it stands at the moment this not only encourages solo
questing it practiacally demands it fix the loot system and rewards and you will see alot more group situations
less complaing and a better chance of the game fullfillin everyones expectations...
Stena
Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:27 am
#8
MMORPG - Massively Multiplayer Online Role-playing Game. A game played by MANY people. Not solo. You dont have to blitz though everything to get what the people in your group want. You can take your time over it and if you help somebody and then they dont want to help you, you should choose your friends better.
When the CU comes out people wont want to group but they will, over time, come to see grouping is a good thing and you will find people that will happly help you out and help you get what you might need.
Also grouping will only be required for high end content, somethings will be a lot harder solo but they willbe doable just easier in a group. You are only being 'forced' to group for high end content. But grouping should be something that is fun to do in any MMORPG, if you dont like the fact you will have to group and heaven forbid talk to people and be sociable then this game is not for you. (i'm not having a stab at the poster, just in general)
Edit: Also you do all get rewarded, it's called experience gained, yes it might not be the kind of reward you can sell but it will sure be helpful. Also as well as the experience points you gain you also gain the experience of doing these things. Killing a nightsister or a Krayt should be something to shout about but if you say "I killed a krayt today" to most people they wont care, they wont think WOW, thats an achivement, they will prolly say "Yea, i killed 20 of them the other day, big deal". After the CU, i hope, these things will be something to shout about and add to my in-game experience.
Message Edited by Stena on 04-04-2005 12:32 PM
Stena
Mon Apr 04, 2005 12:39 pm
#9
badlandssunrunner wrote:
Maybe this will help explain where im comeing from :
Quoted from another server.....
LOL thats funny, so the lack of content is the solo player's fault now?
I started this game together with my brother about 500 days ago. After a month or 2, he left the game. Not much to do here, and the quests that were in the game were rather easy and stupid, and the rewards are worthless or not worth the trouble.
I stayed and started holo grinding, not much more to do. Because i played alot, and on european daytime, i played alone very often, and found out that you would advance faster, when playing solo. After 23 profs i unlocked, and again i had to play solo cause of the tef, and later BH missions.
So tell me, who's fault is it that this game became a more and more solo player oriented game?
The devs designed the game, they made it so that playing solo was/is more rewarding, and when you unlocked a jedi toon, they forced you to play solo.
The lack of content in the game is the biggest problem here, the good loot drops from high level mobs (except maybe DWB) and the quests are just stupid and not rewarding.
Lets say ppl need pearls after CU, and they go kraythunting, and lets say it takes a group of 15 ppl to take a krayt down. The droprate for pearls is what, 1 out of 4 or 5 krayts? So it will take the group 60 to 75 krayts, before everyone just has 1 pearl. Good luck with that.
Ok, so from reading most of that thats just shows that combat is boring too easy thats why he left the game and thats why we are getting the CU and more grouping will be needed.
Oh and the loot, since when do 15 ppl NEED pearls, thats just gready...what ya do is get a few sell 'em and spilt the cash. There will be less cash in the system after the CU and really it's tough crap. and TBH i dont think it will take 15 ppl to take down karyts thats just people being scared and thinking they will need a group to take down anything and that is just pathetic.
Jutewr
Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:23 pm
#10
If you really don't want to interact or rely on other people, then this really isn't the game for you. Sorry.
badlandssunrunner
Mon Apr 04, 2005 4:55 pm
#11
The whole intention of this thread was intended to hightlight the problems
or forced groupin concerning time and risk vs reward not about helping
people or interaction with other players.
When you can get past preverting the issues maybe you can discuss this
alittle more open mindedly .
Zadioc
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:34 pm
#12
"Forced" grouping does indeed suck. I think that's what guilds are for though, if you wanna group, join a guild and group yourself to death. I enjoy soloing and occasionally grouping, no I don't think I'm "uber" or anything of the sort because I solo, any idiot that can log into the game can solo it's not hard. What most of these game developers nowdays totally miss the boat on, is that games are supposed to be fun to play. Jealousy is what happens though, some player sees another player doin somethin, try it themselves and fail, then proceed to lightup the message boards with rants. Enough rants reach developers ears and then they brainstorm a nerf. It's alot easier for these folks to keep up with the jones' when the jones are always grouped with them. They say this upgrade makes the game more star warsy, yet don't explain how star warsy it is to trip over 20 jedi on your way to the cantina.
They may have built a better mousetrap, but give it a week live and the new templates will be on the web for all to see.
badlandssunrunner
Tue Apr 05, 2005 12:54 am
#13
MMORPG - Massively Multiplayer Online Role-playing Game. A game played by MANY people. Not solo. You dont have to blitz though everything to get what the people in your group want. You can take your time over it and if you help somebody and then they dont want to help you, you should choose your friends better. This works for you and I respect that however
it doesnt work for me why is that hard for you too understand? I dont belong to a guild and have no desire to do so have never been in one from day one they are boreing power trips that I dont care to contribute too . If a guild works for you
great have a blast but dont try to force me into it .
When the CU comes out people wont want to group but they will, over time, come to see grouping is a good thing and you will find people that will happly help you out and help you get what you might need. This is your opinon as stated earlier there are some people that prefer not to have to group why should they be penalised by the ones that do ?
Also grouping will only be required for high end content, somethings will be a lot harder solo but they willbe doable just easier in a group. You are only being 'forced' to group for high end content. But grouping should be something that is fun to do in any MMORPG, if you dont like the fact you will have to group and heaven forbid talk to people and be sociable then this game is not for you. (i'm not having a stab at the poster, just in general) This imflamatory statement is part of the
problem just becuase I dont like to group dont mean I am not socialble or help people . Acutally if you knew me you would
know that I help people all the time on my terms and I talk to people in game but I dont require a group too do it.
Edit: Also you do all get rewarded, it's called experience gained, yes it might not be the kind of reward you can sell but it will sure be helpful. Also as well as the experience points you gain you also gain the experience of doing these things. Killing a nightsister or a Krayt should be something to shout about but if you say "I killed a krayt today" to most people they wont care, they wont think WOW, thats an achivement, they will prolly say "Yea, i killed 20 of them the other day, big deal". After the CU, i hope, these things will be something to shout about and add to my in-game experience. Once a person is a
master experince is mute while some get overly excited about killing a krayt to me and others it means nothing we wasted
our time being there becuase we contributed to an unfair loot system so we dont . As long as this problem of one person
getting anything out of the large or small groups people like me will not be encoraged to participate which in some cases
will drive people to the trade boards and create these overinflated prices that screw the economy .. why is it so hard for
so many of you to grasp the concept of risk and time should be equal to reward ?
Page 1 of 3