Pistoleer Archive
Thread: usually i dont do this..but...
8.66% novice CH
6.76% novice pistoleer
2.58% novice BH
2.11% novice Doc
2.01% novice merchant
1.98% novice rifleman
1.47% novice carbineer
yes, i know you guys are borked, but guess what, so is every single other profession in this game. forgive me if im wrong, but your shots dont take up 200 action per shot, or take up 200 mind(unhealable) per shot. all of us are borked, and in most other cases, even more than you guys.
as for CH's, we all know why novice CH is so big, its pretty much a required skill now-a-days.
now onto pistoleer. i frequently read, along with the rifleman board, the BH and pistoleer boards to keep up on your arguments(yes, theyre funny 
). you guys far from suck, trust me. iv had pistol IV in the marskman line since i began, never even touched pistoleer, and guess what i have? a krayt 350 max damage fwg5.
i see no reason why a pistoleer weapons should have the same damage as rifle weapons, specifically the heavy reapeater T-21. currently on chilastra, our T-21 come out at 348dmg and 7.5 speed. krayt tissues do barely anything for this baby. yet on fwg5's, a few easy to get componets can powerup this suckerup to insane amounts of damage, rivaling the T-21. granted, the T-21 has AP3. yet at novice skills for both professions(comparatively), you guys dont have to wait 7 seconds per shot. you guys also dont suffer any type of melee penalty, which most mobs in this game do(PvE).
now we know that not every BH has the pistoleer lines to support him, which is even worse. but for this, lets say that all BH's(2.58%) have novice pistoleer lines, and take that away from pistoleer(because of special cases). we are now down to 4.18 pure novice pistoleers. yet still, you guys outnumber rifleman 2 to 1, and carbineers 2.8 to 1. This right here tells you what hte general public thinks of pistoleers. why go carbineer or rifleman? pistoleer has every advantage, and more. combine that with BH skills, and you have an unstoppable PvP combo.
when i was leveling rifleman, i used my krayt fwg5 about 75% of the time, only using my rifle 25% of the time. why? because its just so easy, and does insane amounts of damage. i have tested this numerous times, with both pure pistoleers, and the famed pistoleer/BH combo. stopping shot is a 1 hit wonder. period. granted, it doesnt always kill in 1 hit, but aroudn 40% of the time, it DOES. if it doesnt do it in 1 hit what then? whoops! next second! you miss! next second BAM theyre down. 3 seconds is all it takes for a semi-unlucky PvP encounter. you would have owned a rifleman with 3 skill boxes up any rifle tree. why? we still have that 7.5 rifle, remember? lets speed slice it, now were down to 5.5. you still have killed us while we have only gotten 1 shot off. i know personally how poweful pistoleers are, combine that with a krayt fwg5, or even worse, a krayt scatter, and nothing in pvp can stop you.(with exception to and if your a retard and gets close enough to another LLC BH or FL commando).
lets not get into this armor issue, because currently its a killer to rifleman and carbineers alike. why? because then i use 200 mind per shot. that means i can only use 5 shots before im useless. you can spam away, then use a quick stim.
so yes, i think your fwg5, whether bug or not, should be nerfed. pistols are not meant to be the sole weapon. they are meant to be sidearms. IMO, you should be limited to within 25m, but of course, rifleman should be limited to 45-70m, and carbineers accordingly. there is no reason why you should rival every other (ranged)profession with nothing more than a simple krayt fwg5 weapon.
tell ya what! i say you can keep your krayt tissues in your fwg5's if the devs give rifleman and such accordingly powerups for our weapons. what good does a krayt do to a fwg5? powers it up about 30-50%. i have seen numerous krayt 100+ damage tissues, and that is of course what is used, and duped to get such killer fwg5's and scatters. what good does it do to a T-21? nada. why? you need 11 identical tissues, with that you can make 11 scatters/fwg5's. give the T-21( and other powerful weapons) precise powerups that powerup our average max damge 30-50%. if not used in power handlers, make it so you only need one of them. the main problem with the krayt fwg5 vs krayt T-21 is that the T-21 requires 11 times as many tissues, which is quite rare, much less the uber tissues. give us something of equal percentage increase that you also only need 1 of.
A I M E S Hope you brought your flame-retardant suit.
Why is a riflemen complaining about speed? You shoot as fast as us. A 7.2 T21 hits speed cap at +87 speed.
You have AP3 and AP2 weapons, for the love of God stop complaining.
You are getting 1 shot killed because you are not wearing armor. Good. Learn you idiot. Learn.
A pistoleer needs to ATLEAST pick up smuggler to be as effective as a riflemen/carbineer.Those extra points could go into medic/doc, but don't worry, soon you will be TKA's with ranged insta kills.Thats if patch goes live. I'll sure to dabble in it, just for spite.
Even with good armor, a riflemen can 1-shot kill.
Reason why NOVICE pistoleer is so popular? Because both BH's and smugglers dabble in it.If you are a weapon smith/armor smith, you normally choose pistoleer for low HAM costs. So they can kill the nunas and chubas around their harvesters
"you guys far from suck, trust me. iv had pistol IV in the marskman line since i began, never even touched pistoleer, and guess what i have? a krayt 350 max damage fwg5."
I rather not trust a novice marksman with pistols IV.
"why go carbineer or rifleman?pistoleer has every advantage, and more. combine that with BH skills, and you have an unstoppable PvP combo."
Wow, lol. Every advantage? Maybe in bizzaro world.
You go Carbineer for ranged KD,All state effects,high damage,AP2 weapons.
You got riflemen for insta-kills,AOE damage,AP2-3 and 1 second shots.
"combined with BH skills..." lol so now we need to master marksman/scout and get the BH pistol line to compete with the riflemen.Thats great.A pistoleer/BH pistols 4 is now on par with the 92 skill point spending riflemen.Who can still master doctor, mind you.We also can't heal ourselves.While you guys on the other hand can get a some poke-mon(word gets edited for some reason lol), or you can go master doctor.Thanks for proving my point.
With that said...NEXT
as for CH's, we all know why novice CH is so big, its pretty much a required skill now-a-days.
Actually no it's not. I've killed practically every mob in the game without a pet tanking for me. It's not hard. It just takes imagination. There's actually very little skill in yelling pet attack. In fact, there's no skill involved when you start adding pets into the mix.
My current template is Master Pistoleer Commando 0-4-4-0 and Smuggler 0-0-4-0 and Assorted Medic, the person I group with the most in pvp/pve is a master rifleman/doc/tka.
Lets skip the newbie junk and get to the good stuff.
The FWG5 is a fantastic pistol in alot of regards good high end damage, good speed, pretty good accuracy, and yes it can be made pretty darn powerful, of course this is kinda moot in an armored engagement, where decent armor is gonna quarter the damage than half+ it again. Against unarmored opponents I've seen 1-2 shot kills. Unarmored, no buffs nadda.
Most other good pistols are in the same boat, the Scout Blaster the DH17. The DX2 isn't terribly good on most servers, slow (and speed matters for a non-bh pistoleer), inaccurate, and low max damage range, albeit with a fairly tight hitting pattern.
Rifleman have a pretty good range of weapons for dealing with most circumstances
On Radiant the T-21 doesn't exist so I can't comment on it.
The Laser Rifle, has a higher damage range than you mention the T-21 having, stock factory guns are 43-409 Speed 5.7 Medium Armor Piercing. HAMs are sorta high, but you quoting off the speed, at Master Rifle vs Master Pistol speed hardly matters, 90-95 speed vs 74-79 Speed. I would agree that sub master you guys are at a disadvantage 1 vs 1 but at master you can hit faster with bigger Armor Piercing guns.
Now speaking of Armor Piercing =P The Jawa Ion Rifle generally speaking doing stun damage cuts right through composite armor like it doesn't exist. Even tho the damage isn't great, Advanced Strafe 2 or Expert Headshot 2 will cut most anyone down armor or not in a matter of seconds.
Now as for the super gun FWG5 comparison hey you guys can make some pretty sick DLT20a's right about the same max damage with a better low end damage than the FWG5 and again requiring but one Blaster Powerhandler you can get those 4-500+ dmg sliced rifles. The DLT20a will cut down people just like the FWG5 albeit with the same limitations of no-armored opponents as the FWG5.
I will admit that below Master Rifleman the Rifle is generally slower, generally less accurate than Pistoleer in PvP, in PvE Rifle and Pistol meet at a lower point, but given that pistol has no 2.5x Melee it is again an easier profession. At the top end tho Pistol vs Rifle, rifle compares favorably to pistol, not superior in all regards, but definatly strong.
As for Carbine being shafted, I cannot count the times I've been put on the ground and sprayed to death by the Laser Carbine of a BH+Carbineer who can fire faster than me with a harder hitting gun and lots of status specials.
HAMs yes the HAMs of Rifles and Carbines is worse, should this be? I really can't tell you, but it can be managable. My friend as a Human Rifleman, can fight in Advanced Composite Armor with self buffs (can't buff his mind) and is still able to Advanced Strafe/Bleed/Headshot without a super heavy drain, no he can't heal it like I can heal my action stats, but its not as terrible as you make it out to be. Carbineer can heal most of the HAM that hes taking from his specials just like pistoleer so the argument is kinda moot unless you don't have medic.
I don't think pistol is quite as gimped as some people here on this board make it out to be, and I really don't think its as strong as people as yourself think it to be. When it all gets boiled down, its situational. Rifles get alot of heavy hitting, area of effect damage, mind pool targeting, and armor piercing,but lack any status hits of note. If the things from test go through, you will also have the best all around defenses in a ranged fight. Carbine gets the Status hits, the Dizzy/KD, and pretty high damage along with armor piercing, but has fairly high HAM hits unless your a Doctor... Honestly I would never want to be a straight carbineer unless I mix'd it with Doc or Bounty Hunter.
As for Pistol, again I don't think straight pistoleer is so hot, stopping shot isn't great 5x dmg mod single target, rifle has 5xdmg mod multi target, albeit pistol has better accuracy. Good HAM costs, not many status abilities, melee knockdown whopee, if you mix with BH or Smuggler you do get better results, BH higher speed, Eyeshot and Torsoshot which are an effective but not irresistable attacks if you know what your doing, Smuggler Panic Shot is great, Low Blow is nice, and Last Ditch does some pretty good damage.However this is all limited in a vs Armor engagement.
Frankly in PvP I find myself taking up the front, delaying and knocking down opponents and occasionaly using some heavier specials and or my Commando Special Heavy Weapons like the Particle Beam to dish out damage on unarmored opponents, but I leave it to my Rifleman friend to deal the damage. We have our roles, some I do better than he does, some he does better than I do, don't you think this is how it should be?
Alot of classes need help/fixes, frankly I think Melee (minus TKA) needs it alot more than we as ranged combatents need right now, but I don't think any particular class is as lop-sided as the other might think it would be.
I will ignore your comment about Heavy Sidearms IV in marksman thats an insult to pistoleers and rifleman alike, as for CH I don't have experience being a CH and neither do most of my friends to comment in the pve environment minus my probot, I'll take your word for it.
Rifleman should and are being made more accurate, 2.5x Melee I think is kind of silly for any class to have, Take Cover is a useless ability, Master Headshot doesn't really have the modifiers to make it worthwhile.
Carbineers, I really only know the BH Carbine line, can't comment as much.
Pistoleer, I sort of like the gun limitations as far as armorpiercing it gives Carbines and Rifles an Edge as we have ours. I really don't use most pistol specials, Fan Shot I like in PvE but its being changed so bleh, I never used stopping shot after last ditch, Double Tap was always to slow when I had it, Disarming 1-2 were useless by the time I was master, Never liked the Point Blank attacks, Pistol Melee Defense 1 is not useful to me anymore, does 2 even work? 
I think we should have more speed somewhere but I guess that helps Smugglers and BHs a bit much if it was to easy to get extra speed (not that BH needs that much more).
To close I guess I'll say this to zRhyno, if your not master vs master yes some of your comments are valid, as for posting your stats at the amount of novice pistoleers.. you start the game with a pistol, pistol is the easiest newbie gun to use, Pistol helps commando/smuggler and bounty hunter directly. So yes theres gonna be alot of people with pistols. Its not directly indicative to the power curve of the weapon class simply its ease of use.
You should fear pistols if you are underprepared, unarmored, or the Pistol user is mixing his profession with other pistol related professions. However at no point is he/she as unstoppable as you think, and your profession is by no means as weak as you think.
HyperMatrix wrote:
Oh look! It's dead-newbie! The jackass pistoleer that trolls the BH forums.
Oh look! It's HyperMatrix! The jackass that trolls the Pistoleer forums.
Many people take Novice Pistoleer just for the second health bleed that stacks. I know many who only get the Novice box and that's it. They get Novice for HealthShot 2 so they can stack them.
So just because a lot of people only achieve the Novice box and nothing further, people have a problem with it?
lol Hyper, how about you duel me. You win, I'll never post on BH forums.I win, you never post here.Only rule is no pets/outside assistance. Seems fair?-DP
DilatedPeoples wrote:
lol Hyper, how about you duel me. You win, I'll never post on BH forums.I win, you never post here.Only rule is no pets/outside assistance. Seems fair?-DP
I thought the point of my post here was that Pistoleers can beat me, though they shouldn't because I'm a bounty hunter....?
HyperMatrix wrote:
Pistoleers can beat me, though they shouldn't because I'm a bounty hunter.
Boba Fett was a Bounty Hunter, and he got killed by getting hit in the back by a blind man with a stick...
deadnewbie wrote:
A skilled player beats an unskilled player. This is usually how it works.
Panic Shot, Last Ditch, Last Ditch, Last Ditch, Last Ditch, Victory.
Great skill.