Pistoleer Archive

While nice.....

They plan to fix EVERYTHING with the "Combat Balance Pass"?

Aside from the obvious complaint about the time-table for that to come around...don't they see that trying to fix every combat profession at once is just a can of worms just waiting for them to open it?

Some things I could see, like weapon changes and the speed equation. But I think at least the specials being broken could be fixed fairly quickly.

I don't know, maybe it's just me...

Marksmen
Pistoleers
Carbineers
Riflemen
Bounty Hunters
Commandos
Smugglers
Brawlers
Teras Kasi
Fencers
Swordsmen
Pikemen
Squad Leaders
Combat Medic
Creature Handler
Jedi?

All at once? Does that not scream trouble?

I agree it does. Remember, this will ALL go to TC first. Is character copy up and running? Even if it isn't it may be worth everyone's time to jump onto TC and get ready to test as much as you can. It doesn't seem like it here, but in the Corr forum if we can present the Devs with real numbers and concerns (not just conjecture and rumor) they do listen.

Message Edited by DiLune on 12-20-2003 01:16 AM

Well you know what, I think it'll be easier for them to concentrate on now that Player Cities, Mounts and Vehicles are live. So I'm keeping my fingers crossed that there is indeed a "master plan"

The Fencers have made the problems with the Dodge animation one of their Top 5 issues, and we will have that problem (which affects you as well) fixed in the publish after vehicles.


Nice to know our top 5 isn't as important as the fencers top 5, here it is in spot number 3 on our list and it gets looked at because the fencers mentioned it and it might just help us also?

Weak.

As far as the combat "fix" goes I agree with the above post, as someone put it in every star wars movie.....

" I've got a bad feeling about this "

If all we ever get are the crumbs we will always be filler proff. Just good enough to squeeze a few boxes out of, not good enough to be our own show.

At least pistoleers will rock in the space expansion, after all thats where all our love went, right? What are we doin in space? I have no idea.

Let's see...WoW will cost about $50 for the CD...that's about 3 months worth of SWG subscription fees...I wonder if WoW will be ready in 3 months...hmm...

Maybe I'm being pessemistic, but I don't find this to be very good news. Translations:

1) Almost all our specials are broken or useless

The combat balance. Disarming Shot will be renamed to "Lair Shot."

2) The DX2 sucks

So what? We'll be adding new pistol schematics.

3) Our defenses don't work

Dodge animation getting fixed. The rest of this is a non-issue.

4) How speed is totally screwed up

How about we nerf speed overall and put more power in the hands of BH/Pistoleer dabblers?

5) We aren't fast enough

Ummm... combat pass? unfortunately, you can't be faster than riflemen because they have a "Dear holocron, a reasonable request from a rifleman..." thread, and carbiniers were asking for more speed, so... sorry. /shrug

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Randonb wrote:

Maybe I'm being pessemistic, but I don't find this to be very good news. Translations:

1) Almost all our specials are broken or useless

The combat balance. Disarming Shot will be renamed to "Lair Shot."

2) The DX2 sucks

So what? We'll be adding new pistol schematics.

3) Our defenses don't work

Dodge animation getting fixed. The rest of this is a non-issue.

4) How speed is totally screwed up

How about we nerf speed overall and put more power in the hands of BH/Pistoleer dabblers?

5) We aren't fast enough

Ummm... combat pass? unfortunately, you can't be faster than riflemen because they have a "Dear holocron, a reasonable request from a rifleman..." thread, and carbiniers were asking for more speed, so... sorry. /shrug

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Pessemistic. Perhaps, but I'm agreeing with your sumation (translation). I don't feel very warm and fuzzy.

Guys, here's the response from the Devs to our Top 5 Issues. They're not perfect responses, and it sounds like we'll have to wait for a while longer, but they agree with us that all of this stuff needs to be fixed. Probably the best short term news is that the Dodge animation is getting fixed next month.

Here aretheir responses:

1. ALMOST ALL OF OUR SPECIALS ARE BROKEN OR USELESS.

I have had internal Quality Assurance (QA) look at your Master specials, Pistol Melee Defense 2, Body Shot 3, and the other specials you mentioned. They have noticed the problems you've reported to us, and we are fixing these specials as part of our upcoming Combat Balance. We know you have been waiting for fixes for quite some time. Short term fixes were supposed to have been in the mix in the last couple of publishes, but the reason they weren't was because the Dev team was switched around and the Dev who was in charge of combat is now working on the Space Expansion. We'll be sure to get everything fixed as part of the Combat Balance.

2. OUR PISTOL (DX2) IS WORSE THAN MARKSMAN PISTOLS AND IS NOT USED BY MOST PLAYERS

We have a “Weapons Balance” that will bring a lot of fun to the game and it will be out in the January or February Publish. I know your first reaction will be, “January or February!?!?”, but consider it. Every weapon in the game will be re-balanced and there will be a lot of progress on many fronts.

3. OUR DEFENSES DON'T WORK

This issue was submitted prior to the last patch, which should have resolved many of the issues you had with your defenses. Philosopher1976 has let me know about some of the new problems you've been having since the last patch. The Fencers have made the problems with the Dodge animation one of their Top 5 issues, and we will have that problem (which affects you as well) fixed in the publish after vehicles. As for the other problems you're reporting, I have sent them to QA and we'll take another look at defenses as part of our upcoming Combat Balance.

4. THE WAY SPEED WORKS IN THE GAME IS COMPLETELY SCREWED UP

We agree that the current system needs to be greatly improved and we will be working out a fix at the same time that we balance the weapons. These two aspects of combat need to be tackled together in order to prevent having to adjust stuff again later on.

5. WE ARE NOT FAST ENOUGH WITH OUR WEAPON AT THE MASTER LEVEL

We agree that this is an important issue. Pistols are supposed to be really really fast. The Carbineers have also raised speed modifiers as a Top 5 Issue, and we plan on fixing all of the speed modifiers as part of the upcoming Combat Balance. We need to tackle this issue along with the broken speed system and the weapons balance in order to avoid having to adjust stuff again later on.

If PMD2 would knockdown (with much less HAM costs), BodyShot 3 would have a muchhigher DPS, the DX2 would haveincreased range, and the Master Pistoleer would have a total of +85 Pistol Speed... I'd be happy.

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Madrox wrote:

I don't know, maybe it's just me...

Marksmen
Pistoleers
Carbineers
Riflemen
Bounty Hunters
Commandos
Smugglers
Brawlers
Teras Kasi
Fencers
Swordsmen
Pikemen
Squad Leaders
Combat Medic
Creature Handler
Jedi?

All at once? Does that not scream trouble?

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Actually doing it "all at once" is far better than doing it piece by piece (or profession by profession) for two reasons:

1. You don't want to work in fixing/balancing one professions while you have massive outcry from the others that they're not getting any attention.

2. Remember when they tried to balance the T21 using hotfixes? They had to hotfix 4 times or more with different changes to that rifle. Speed changes, damage changes, AP changes, everything. They couldn't get it right, because they weren't looking at combat as a whole. If they fix Pistoleers first (not saying they will, just an example) and then turn around and fix Carbineers they may have to rebalance Pistoleers a second time because Carbineer fixes screwed up the balance. So, instead, working on them at the same time allows them to see how they'll balance and interact without stepping on each other's toes.

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nolan007 wrote:

If PMD2 would knockdown (with much less HAM costs), BodyShot 3 would have a muchhigher DPS, the DX2 would haveincreased range, and the Master Pistoleer would have a total of +85 Pistol Speed... I'd be happy.

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+82 speed eh? I have +60 or so carbine speed and I shoot so fast that I incap' myself in less than 3 secs using legshot.... (I shoot so fast I almost use 3 specials every shot. i.e. 3 specs. disappear at a time in the que) If they raise ti more, they better lower HAM costs lol.

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KaernLegorah wrote:

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Madrox wrote:

I don't know, maybe it's just me...

Marksmen
Pistoleers
Carbineers
Riflemen
Bounty Hunters
Commandos
Smugglers
Brawlers
Teras Kasi
Fencers
Swordsmen
Pikemen
Squad Leaders
Combat Medic
Creature Handler
Jedi?

All at once? Does that not scream trouble?

---

Actually doing it "all at once" is far better than doing it piece by piece (or profession by profession) for two reasons:

1. You don't want to work in fixing/balancing one professions while you have massive outcry from the others that they're not getting any attention.

2. Remember when they tried to balance the T21 using hotfixes? They had to hotfix 4 times or more with different changes to that rifle. Speed changes, damage changes, AP changes, everything. They couldn't get it right, because they weren't looking at combat as a whole. If they fix Pistoleers first (not saying they will, just an example) and then turn around and fix Carbineers they may have to rebalance Pistoleers a second time because Carbineer fixes screwed up the balance. So, instead, working on them at the same time allows them to see how they'll balance and interact without stepping on each other's toes.

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I guess what I was trying to say in my post was that, they could fix our broken and non-working specials first. Like, fix before balancing.

Nobody can really know where our profession stands if there are still things that are broken with it. Same with any other profession. I would like it if the Combat Pass were mostly rebalancing because that should be done all at once like you said, but I am wary that it will just turn into Bug Fix '04 and professions will be where they SHOULD be now and not where they should be in the future(content/addition of robustness)

Looks great from where I'm sitting, and the fact that Thunderheart finally posted on our forum makes me feel a bit more secure and confident

One thing though -60% for my initialreasin for getting SWG was for the promise of the space expansion (while on the ground I may be a pistoleer, I'm an Xwing pilot at heart, and alwayswill be). TheDev that was in charge oflooking after pistoleers/combat has been moved to theexpansion? does this bode well for the SE whensomeone who screwed over the pistoleers so much is now running it? I hope to god I'm quaking in my boots for no reason and have misunderstood what's going on, otherwise I may have to run away and cry in a deep dark damp corner.

Btw - anyone know if the Devs intend asking our views on the space expansion as they did with SWG:AED for all those years during its development (ahh, the memories )?