Pistoleer Archive
Thread: Pistoleer Issues Designer responses
This is insane, this class is HIDEOUSLY abused and and overpowered yetyou people are griping that it needs to be better? All you losers do is spam pistol whip. Bounty Hunters, creature handlers, and TKAget nerfed to complete crap, they leave you pistoleers nearly untouched and yet you piss and moan.
Issues I have
1. Pistols are too fast for the damage they can be made to be 1.7 speed and 200+ damage?????
2. PISTOL WHIP ISCOMPLETE BULLCRAP, why did the Bounty Hunter get nerfed?
3. Pistoleer/Doctors, thats all theres going to be
omg you guys are the bomb i'm so there with pistoleer!
4 of your 6 issue is manini crap lol **edit** is this the only class that isn't broke?
Bounty Hunters, that's all there is.
hey Wes, I went to the range this morning, I couldn't wait. And I had so much fun I'm going again tomorrow, LOL. I found that duel weild has it's pro's and it's con's and implementing it will not be so easy. Below is what I have found and how I beleive it should be implimented into the game.
1.) At far range I found that my main hand was not as accurate as if I was shooting a single pistol. Also, I do not believe I hit anything with my offhand 
duel weild in-game should have a penalty at long range, say 30m and beyond. If we only have a 30 percent chance of hitting our target, we should now have a 20 percent chance of hitting our target with our main hand IF we're duel wielding at the time. Offhand weapon should have a 5 percent chance of hitting target (even a dog can have his day right?)
2.) close range was fun. I was able to hit each of my target's with no problem. However, precision shots were a problem for me (barrel sighting isn't easy, and that's even with me knowing how to do it from all the competitions I have shot in). In order for me to make a precision shot I would have to stop and aim before I shot.
In-game should have duel weild give good damage within it's ideal range. This does mean more DPS, This also mean's your up close and personal with your target (if an animal you could be in a world of hurt). However, if using a special move there should be some type of a delay factor or extra function. Perhaps using our already implimented AIM function first before we can perform a special move. As for our accuracy, I suggest a 5 percent drop only, 10 if we find it to overpowering.
3.) multiple target's (the funnest part ) This is where I have found duel weild to shine the most, honestly. It's really neat because your actually consentrating on doing two things in the same time, so it does take a bit of getting use to, sort of like chess also, trying to plan out your next move. I have found that although good with accuracy, i can now pick off target's a bit quicker since I'm shooting at one target and my second hand move's to the next target. Once I'm done with the first taget, I can turn my head and shoot at my second target while my main hand is moving in the direction of my third target. This makes me quicker in taking down all the target's compaired to having to stop, search my next and swing my arms all the way over to the next target, ect.
In-game Dual weild should really shine here as well while using the point black area 1 or 2. (I don't have two yet so I might be off with that one, but 1 for sure) There is no increase in damage, at all. There is an increase in speed, however, the reason why is stated above, think of an arc, you start with your arms open wide and close that arc down the middle. With single, you don't stop at the middle, you have to continue going. Should we be able to execute that move twice as fast? NO, but there should be a bump in the speed if we have duel pistol equiped.
In the end Duel weild will only help in PVP IF you can get close enough to your target, if you don't get close, your bantha foder! PVE will enjoy it as a finishing move, while your target is running away (some large animals) or when that pirate is almost dead and you want to do that tough guy charge. Dual weild will hurt our accuracy in long range, and a bit in close range with the only real benefit is in close range. So this will be a situation combat style. The weapon should be the same, you cannot duel weild different weapons. This skill should belong solely to a Master Pistoleer, so if you want it, you have to go all the way up. Those are my findings, if I left something out please ask me and I'll answer what I can.
P.S. if you ask what I think, I say it sounds like a great idea and it would look really good and exciting. Will I use it? Sometimes, it seems like a very situational combat style that only really shines while shooting multiple targets, and does good damage if you try to do a suicidal run toward your target. I'll probably stick with a single weapon untill I am confronted with one of those two instances.
We've been hearing so much about the BH vs Pistoleer issue I thought I'd contribute my oppinions. Yea yea we all know oppinions are like A-holes, everyone's got one and they all stink.
First of all I think it should be mentioned that although BH's spend a lot more skill points many of those initial skills are still quite useful. It's not like once you reach BH your no longer a master scout. Secondly I feel like most of the community has delusions of grandeur when it comes to the BH profession. Not every BH in the books was as good as Boba Fett, in fact he was the best BH and there was only one of him. Most of the BH's would certainly be considered dangerous and good in a fight, but not to the extent they are now. Many of a BH's skills would be in tracking, investigation, perhaps stuff like underworld connections too, although currently SWG doesn't support that. My point is BH's are more diverse than just extremely good killers, that sounds like an assasin class to me. If you want to play a master of combat, go for commando or something. Bounty hunters track and capture bounties, they aren't simple hired killers. Thirdly, and I apologize in advance for my extreme geekynessfor knowing so much SW lore, but perhaps the most feared "gunman" in the galaxy was Gallandro, obviously a pistoleer. He was your classic wildwest quick draw artist. Simply no one was faster than him with a pistol. He would be a Master Pistoleer. Jaegen88 stated it so eloquently when he said something to the effect, "Why should we be Master Pistoleers in title alone?" I couldn't agree more. Give the BH's other neat toys, like maybe lasso shooters to entangle fleeing aquisitions, but give us our pistol mastery. I'm not sure SWG could support a more dynamic combat environment, but it would be nice. Like a pistoleer would win a pistol duel, but in an all out firefight commandos would come out on top as a pistol master wouldn't have the skill to operate heavy guns.
*Ramble mode - Disengage*
Kateel Kuhlvult
Pistoleer/Master Surgeon/Derrier Extraordinaire 
Mistryl Shadow Guard - Lance Corporal in charge of lavatories
Flurry
-PS- Please excuse my spelling, I went to public school.
Gun Twirl? This is meaningless unless it gives me some sort of advantage or bonus. Twirling guns is only useful for looking cool and impressing friends and ladies IRL 
If I dont mention it, I Like it. There are exceptions to that rule tho....
Certifications: Yes! Must have more! Many more.
Dual Wield: *drool* dual wield....mhmmm....Yes. We must have this ASAP. Also, if we are Dual Wielding 2 pistols we should do 2x the damage. There can be some kind of defensive penalty or something if theyre worried about overpowering the class.
I hate to break this to all the bounty hunters, but yeah, BH track down people and kill them for a living... and pistoleers kill people with a pistol for a living.
so why exactly do you so strongly believe thta you should be 'better' than anyone else? Looking at things from one side is immature and it is a great way to try to unbalance the game. BH have special abilities that are powerful that no one else has, and they get good offensive bonus's to their TWO weapon types. They are currently powerful, but not overpowered, as some BH would like it.
the argument "I'm a BH and I hunt and kill people for a living, so I should be able to kill anyone 1 on 1" is bullcrap.
Hey Bolanos - That info's great; it actually sounds right, seems to fit sort of thing. You should post your findings/ideas in a seperate post in case they miss it here
As to all the BHs that are posting on this thread, you really should have read the post by our correspondant; the complaint we have is that BHs are better with a pistol than pistoleers. Admitedly BHs are meant to be good at combat, but as a previous poster stated, it's not their entire skill base- it's that of having contacts andtracking down people. Anyway, I'm getting off track - BHs are skilled in the use of three weapons, pistol, carbine and lightning cannon. They have the bonus of diversity. The fact that a master bounty hunter is not as good as a master pistoleer WITH A PISTOL does not detract from the fact that they can use the other two weapons aswell. If you want to take out a droid, you use an ion weapon. If you want to take out a pistoleer, you use longer ranged weapon. They get close, you can still switch to pistol and chances are they're damaged enough that you then have the upper hand. If not, then you've lost that fight.
People should remember that BHs are not trained assasins (although an elite elite combat class of assasin would be cool), they're charged with bringing in people, some times dead, some times alive. The fact this game does not support them being brought in alive does not detract from the fact. I myself am a bounty hunter, and I'd like to see some changes to BH made. I'll be saving those for the BH board though.
I dont mean for a novice BH to beat a master pistoleer, more that a master BH should be able to beat him. Whats the point in being good with 3 weapons? I posted an idea for an alternate set of skill trees at
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=bounty_hunter&message.id=22867
If they give us something like that or some other persons idea, then I would'nt care if a Master Pistoleer can beat a Master BH whos using a pistol. Thats the way it should be (butit should be an evenfight still ). Because then we would have other ways to deal with it. But when PC bounties come out, how is a BH supposed to take down a master pistoleer mark when he cant win with pistols, carbines, LLCs, or a combination? (Theres no point in knowing 3 weapons if you suck with them all). And if you want is to stop saying we should be better because we have 33 skill points left over, simply get the devs to reduce that number.
I don't understand the BH logic... In straight 1 on 1 pvp they really can't be beat. Between knockdown and eyeshot it's no wonder. Add novice medic to the BH class with good stimpack B's and the BH can often keep going like the enigizer bunny unless we can find a way to tackle his mind. Hrmm, notice mind seems to be the key word? I remember threads and proposals to even out PVP by reducing mind damage in pvp combat due to it's inability for healing. Instead, the devs nerf PVP dmg across the board. What do we have now? Well, 1 on 1 hasn't changed with BH still king. We still can't heal our mind damage but they can heal the damage we do.
About every Bounty Hunter grabs Novice Doctor but they always whine about Pistoleer doctor's or master medics... Well, what else are we to do for pvp? At least I can insure you won't take me down from my health or action pools! Does that change the outcome? Sadly, no. Doesn't even tip the scale much... It's great they made PVP last longer with reduced damage, but **edit** them for not addressing the mind damage side of pvp! The outcomes are largely the same, just in longer intervals. Give us more time to cry over our mind, because that's all we can do. Should stims work for the mind too? Shouldn't each class be able to heal the wound's inflicted on them? How do you really achieve balancing without that?
You wanna leave mind as is, unable to be healed? Fine, leave them their unfair advantage but reduce it's effectiveness in pvp as suggested before. If I can do 100 health damage, let their eyeshot do 50. Why?? MIND CAN"T BE HEALED! The eyeshot is the crutch of every bounty hunter out there... kick that crutch out from under them and they'll hobble around with the rest of us, on an even field.