Pistoleer Archive
Thread: AP2 ON A PISTOL?#%#!% Are you CRAZY?
We have no function in high end combat as it stands. a TKM is more viable punching a krayt dragon than we are shooting it with blasters... many times so.
lol, you know if they ever do fix pistoleer we wont get the opportunity to have all these **edit** sessions. I have heard people come onto the pistoleer forums just laugh at us bitching. We are funny, but it is a real issue.
From what I read in this topic...Pistoleer is supposed to suck at everything, and a few of you are happy with that. 0_o
Why don't we just remove all classes but one and have one gun and one special. Then everyone would be the same, then there would be no reason for jack arses to whine and moan that they are not as strong as the other class. Classes are meant to be different, with different strengths and weaknesses.
A pistoleer standing next to a rifleman the rifleman should outdamage them everytime. If you think a gun should do as much damage as one 3 times or more its size then you have no clue.
And you can't say you are not a pistoleer, I have been every combat class with pistoleer the longest. Pistols should not have AP2. You have to play to the strengths of your class to get it to work.
There is nothing wrong with pistoleer, aside a few specials but name one class that doesn't have that.
"--Michael Stackpole, RS IRC
Halyn wrote:
As someone who has some real-life experience with firearms, I think I can speak.
If you want to continue to use real-life comparisons, you also need to understand something. Rifles are virtually impossible to aim accurately while moving. They're hard enough to aim while standing without a rest. And that's a light rifle, like a .223 or a .250. The heavier rifle you get, the longer it takes to aim and fire accurately.
Pistols, on the other hand, are easier to aim and shoot quickly. Why? They're smaller with (generally) less recoil.
Oh, and whoever said, "If you shot a pistol with heavy rounds, you'd break your wrists," I suggest you watch Avatar-'s SWG video. It distinctly showed him (as a rifleman) running around one-handing a T-21 and wasting his opponents. Apparently T-21s can be one-handed, firing AP3 rounds, without harm to the rifleman.
Seriously...pistoleer needs some revamp.
(Apparently I'm a sucker for weak classes- master creature handler and 4-3-4-3 Pistoleer, working for master)
Correct. Rifles should be horrendously inaccurate while moving and while close up. The reason being that rifles are a whole lot of mass to swing around quickly to acquire targets. Pistols, on the other hand, are more like an extension of a trained user's arm. They really are basically point-and-shoot (that's not nearly all the training you need to be considered an expert, but that's basically what target acquisition comes to).
This is why I recommended in couple of other posts to remove the AP damage bonus, but keep the AR damage reduction, and to remove most of the rifle's general accuracy and put it in a new skill mod called "Accuracy while prone" I'd also like to see carbineers get a special pose that slows down their speed, but increases their accuracy, where the carbine is brought up to the shoulder and the eyes are looking down the sights, in a proper "infiltration" stance for CQB. That might help them a lot too.
Halyn wrote:
Oh, and whoever said, "If you shot a pistol with heavy rounds, you'd break your wrists," I suggest you watch Avatar-'s SWG video. It distinctly showed him (as a rifleman) running around one-handing a T-21 and wasting his opponents. Apparently T-21s can be one-handed, firing AP3 rounds, without harm to the rifleman.
creature handler and 4-3-4-3 Pistoleer, working for master)
I addressed this the first time I posted. The reason he can run around and 1-hand the T-21 is because it has less recoil than an AP3 pistol would. Because the T-21 is very large and heavy, it is much harder to move. Therefore, the force from firing the AP3 round doesn't produce as much recoil. Now, firing the same AP3 round from a 3 lb. pistol is quite a different story. It is much, much lighter and, therefore, much much easier to move. This means that the recoil from a pistol firing AP3 rounds would be extremely (bone-shatteringly) powerful.
For those of you who still don't get it and want to flame my post some more, think about it like this...you set a firecracker down next to a foam ear-plug and light it. The firecracker explodes and sends the ear-plug flying. Then you set another firecracker down next to a brick and light it. The firecracker explodes and the brick doesn't move. This is the same thing that happens when you fire a small gun vs. a large gun.
Firing any high power rifle one handed is not a fun experience. Try it to look cool once and tell me how long you have to keep an ice pack on a sprained wrist... Good times, good times. But he is right, when people would saw side by sides down to pistols it took someone with big brass ones to fire it. The control was way out of whack. Thats the nice thing about DE .50 is that they have a gas return which allows it to spill off some that recoil. A .454 is much nastier to fire.
Regardless we are talking about energy rounds which dont have a recoil, so really a AP2 isnt rediculous at all.