Pistoleer Archive

I am not getting into the details again of this b/c ive posted this several times before. But FYI

BH has more accuracy using a pistol then pistoleer

BH has more speed while using a pistol then the pistoleer

How is that possible?

The way I see things is that Bounty Hunters are obviously meant for PvP, whether or not the game actually allows them to hunt other live players yet. All the skills a bounty hunter has for every one of their weapons are supposed to be the most proficient PvP skills available, thats why they are given the Eye Shot, and the Fire DOT on Torso shot and all that.

A Pistoleer is MUCH better at combating monsters and other mobs than a bounty hunter is, because all the skills are geared towards just totally owning them. If you guys think about it, a Bounty hunter Should suck more at fighting monsters, but be totally proficient in taking down human targets, and thats exactly how the skills are set up for them. A pistoleer is not a master PvPer, but it leaves room to add medic or whatever the heck else you want. Even another whole weapon tree.

A Pistoleer and a Smuggler would be better at PvP than a regular Pistoleer because of the need to defend himself from people constantly hunting him. All this makes total sense, and a Bounty Hunter Should be able to defeat a smuggler because 95% of his skill points are put into PvP.

Most people dont realize that Bounty Hunters are the PvP class. Its what they are designed for, to be people killing machines. BUT a pistoleer/BH should kill a master BH because he won't have a single point left that didn't go into his pistol abilities. That's just the way I see all of it.
Pistoleer > MOBs ... BH > Player Characters.


Slacker, Lowca

"BH has more accuracy using a pistol then pistoleer"

**WRONG**

"BH has more speed while using a pistol then the pistoleer"

**WRONG**

Have you even looked at the actual numbers? They're both even.

That is the thing. I agree you are definitly right, But Why is a bounty hunter just as accurate and fast as a pistoleer with a pistol? A bounty hunter is like a jack of all trades. Should be good the area's required of that profession. I have no problems with bounty hunter being good with a pistol. Even close to par with a pistoleer. But a pistoleer should have some sort of edge in the pistol area. The defence skills give that .... kinda. But put it like this. Pistoleer vs a Bounty Hunter, both using pistols exclusivly, and using all their skills given with that weapon. Melee defense don't really help yah much in that situation, As for the other resistances. What skills in the bounty hunter pistol tree we really require said defense skills? Bounty hunters are a mean class. They are good with all weapons and have special weapons awarded to their profession. Pistoleers have 1 weapon (its not that great either). They are pretty even in accuracy and speed, but thats the problem. they shouldn't be even. Then you have the balance issue. If a bounty hunter is slower or less accurate it is still balanced. Pistoleers are limited to using pistols to b as accurate and fast. Bounty hunters have 2 other weapons (good weapons at that) they can use wich makes them more versatile being able to attack different ham bars for the situation and at different ranges.

Both professions are even. I would say neither is better than the other in the way of pistol proficiency. However, BH has several several drawbacks.. This is why they are given so much power per skill box. While a BH is extremely powerful NOW, try and compare them later to someone who has fully applied their 250 skill points into several professions for a deadly combo. The BH is all about offensive power so they lack the versatility that a pistoleer for example can easily achieve with their leftover skill points.

Both the bounty hunters and the pistoleers have a good argument. I am a pistoleer myself, and I must say that it does bother me a little bit that BHs are simply as good with a pistol as we are, if not better. The numbers are NOT the same, by the way - look them up. A BH gets +50 to pistol speed and accuracy. Granted, now, the Pistoleer will be better at running and shooting, as well as the better bleeding attacks (yes, they are good in PvP - believe me). However, the BH will simply be better at killing people. This is absolutely fine with me - I have no problem with Bounty Hunters being able to snuff out most anyone in PvP. My biggest problem, however, is that Bounty Hunters are also just as good in PvE (if not better) as a Pistoleer. They also have access to a Pistol that the PISTOLeer does not have access to. Stop saying that the names have nothing to do with the professions, because they do. However, to the BHs defense, to even become a novice BH it requires 150 Skill points (and most of the scout tree is wasted, believe me) and to become a master BH it requires 207 skill points. However, the strength of the pistoleer is that we require 35 skill points to become a novice Pistoleer and 92 to become a master Pistoleer. Myself, I am going to be able to be both a Master Pistoleer, Master Squad Leader, and be able to be a Novice Medic with 1 full medic tree, and 1 3/4 medic tree. The Bounty Hunter is SPECIALISED in his ability to kill others. The Pistoleer is not as specialized, and is able to branch out into other things - even a BH if he wants (hint to all those angry Pistoleers out there, you have more than enough skill points to become a Master Pistoleer and get all 4 BH pistol skills). However, I do sympathize with all the pistoleers out there, so I do suggest that something be done about making defense actually useful, and making some of our other skills (disarm anyone?) also viable. And one other thing, the pistoleer should have weapon certs (besides the DX2) that other people simply do not have access to. I believe that this would allow the Pistoleer to be a specialized PISTOL class, and not a specialized DEATH MACHINE class.

I think an important question that needs to be asked is:

Why does a BH have to pay so little pistol xp to reapsuch huge rewards?

If you add up all the pistol, carbine, rifle, and heavy weapon xpto make Master Bounty Hunter it is still less experience points than a pistoleer needs of JUST pistol xp to make Master Pistoleer. (these numbers were obtained from the character builder at: http://swgcb.yogn.net/swg-cb.php?prof_id=1). And when you factor in the combat xp a Pistoleer needs too (which is WAY higher than a BH needs) you have pistoleers spending a LOT more time in combat than a Master BH will by far.

I agree that BH's have very few skill points left to play with, but that doesn't mean they should get their skills handed to them for free. xp to reward ratio just seems really out of whack...

BTW, I didn't verify the character builder numbers against the game, so they may be off in which case this argument is worthless...

Draege Have you even looked at those numbers yourself?

"BH has more accuracy using a pistol then pistoleer"

**WRONG**

"BH has more speed while using a pistol then the pistoleer"

**WRONG**

Have you even looked at the actual numbers? They're both even.

I believe this is what you stated..... and here is the math I have..

Novice Pistoleer has +5 accuracy and +5 speed. The Entire Pistol Marksmanship tree adds up to +30 in accuracy. Then the Master Pistoleer adds +10 accuracy and +10 speed. So far that means we have a GRAND TOTAL of +45 accuracy.... u still with me? Ok now lets move onto speed.... Pistoleer Special Abilities has a grand total of +24 Speed. Now total that up with Master Pistoleer and Novice Pistoleer and you have a grand total of +49 Speed.

Ok lets review this... we have +45accuracy and +49 speed....

Now lets move onto Bounty Hunter Pistol Specialization.... Specialization I gives you + 10 accuracy and +10 speed.... Specialization II gives you +10 accuracy and +10 speed... Spec III gives you + 20 accuracy +20 speed and Specialization gives you +10 accuracy and +10 speed now Master BH you get +10 accuracy.... did you write all that down? Ok this now gives us....

+ 60 accuracy and + 50 speed for Bounty Hunter....

Well from what I see the accuracy and the speed of BH is MORE then that of the Pistoleer.... now I did not add on to pistoleer accuracy while moving or accuracy of other sorts. So comparing just accuracy and just speed the BH is better then the Pistoleer.

So from what I see I was indeed right.... disagree still?

Well since Im both a Pistoleer and a BH I can see both views here. I think that a BH should have a little better speed and accuracy due to the fact that he is a master of all ranged weapons so to speak. BH's do have to be Master Marksman while Pistoleers just need to Master the pistol line. However Pistoleers get more special attacks than a BH does. I think a BH gets like 3 or 4 special attacks for pistols and Pistoleers get 10 or 11? [ To lazy to actually look for sure but Im pretty close ] So by this Pistoleers get more abilities to use and BH's get more speed and accuracy. Also Pistoleers get +'s to accuracy while moving and while standing. They also get +'s do defense while the BH does not. I think thats all that I can think of right now.

So they are masters of ranged weaponry... how does that justify that he should be faster with pistol then the pistoleer? A Pistoleer spends almost 4x as many skill points just working on Pistols... certainly they should be faster or at least EQUAL to the BH in speed and especially accuracy?

Saying that the BH deserves more accuracy and speed is saying that a marine (or navy seal) deserves more accuracy and speed then the SNIPER..... I think thats what you said(i used terms we can relate to IRL). While yes the Navy Seal is better overall because he has a wider diversity of weaponry he cannot compete against the sniper when using the sniper rifle. Agree? Yet why is the BH better accuracy and speed then the Pistoleer? It doesnt make sense.

Yes the Pistoeler does have +to defense and + to move aiming but that does not compensate for a +15 speed difference in favor of the BH. That means if both are standing still the BH will win every time if they use the same weapon....... heck why b a Pistoleer? Just master BH and you will b better then a pistoleer, better then a rifleman(lighting cannon owns) and better then a carbineer.... heck thats 3 elite professions down the drain for the hybrid BH professions... I like that...

LordJunior, are you on crack? Bounty Hunter has ONE speed point over pistoleers, not 15. I also like how you casually ignore the +30 accuracy while moving and +10 accuracy while standing we get as pistoleers. I say that puts us above BHs.

I am slightly... annoyed at the strength of the BH's pistol branch. It takes him 1/4 of the time it takes me to get master pistoleer as it takes him to finish his pistol branch.

In comparison of skills, he has torsoshot which does almost as much damage than bodyshot3 (if not more) AND causes fire damage (which is wounding). So in other words, he has a more specialized than someone who's main profession is based around using a pistol.

A BH's speed mods are also very unfair to say the least.In theentire pistoleer tree, I gain a totalof +44 pistol speed. In a BH's pistol branch, he gains a +50 pistol speed. Again, it is odd to see that a BH is better at using a pistol than someone who uses a pistol day in and day out.

His accuracy is also slightly higher than that of a pistoleer's. After a BH's pistol branch he has a total of +40 accuracy (+50 if he's reached master BH). As a base, a master pistoleer has +30 accuracy. In addition to his base accuracy, he get's an additional +30 accuracy while moving, which only brings him slightly higher than a BH. Or a pistoleer recieves the +15 accuracy if he's standing still, which brings him below that of a BH.

Please also rememeber that it takes a pistoleer 4 times as long to gain the total of those skill mods.

In my opinion, this is unfair. I spend 4 time as long to recieve almost no advantage over him. I've tested most of this (mainly the skills), but not all, as I have not reached master pistoleer yet. However, in theory, this is what will happen. The numbers show that picking up pistoleer was, in retrospect, a poor choice. However, I will continue to grind in hopes that the devs will fix this. When I achieve master pistoleer, I will test again and I will post more on this.

- Protofish (aspiring master Pistoleer)

No im not on crack i simply worded it wrong.... you are right it has 1 speed over pistoleer .... but 15 accuracy.....

No i did NOT ignore any of that and if you read what I wrote i directly said I DID NOT INCLUDE THAT... I am not comparing MOVING ACCURACY to ACCURACY b/c moving accuracy DOES NOT STACK WITH ACCURACY WHEN NOT MOVING.... hrmmm was that obvious enough for you? Ok so we get +10 accuracy while standing... even if we stacked that with the +45 current accuracy that gives us what.... +55 accuracy? Still less then the BH..... yet again. So yet again... inferior to BH


So the only way a pistoleer is better is if he stops to increase accuracy b/c when not moving accuracy isnt as good.... so if the BH happens to be not moving and same with the Pistoleer then guess what... BH will win.... wow what a suprise.... About the speed issue I was simply saying BH's are faster then Pistoleers.... I fail to see if there is a problem making the 2 professions equal at least on ACCURACY and SPEED .... not moving and not standing just overall accuracy...