Pistoleer Archive

If these happens eather pistoleer gets a huge damage reduction or carbineer and rifles get a huge increase. Since first neather would be able to fight in dungeons, or be affective in pvp the only one that would be would be pistoleers.

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Nifty wrote:

The only solutions are 1) go to range limtations on the specials with the weapons all being 0-65m 2) go with Badger's idea of having the weapons have ranges varied with their CL rating or 3) put the accuracy modifers based on range (if any still exist, if not, add them) back into the UI so we can see them, AND have those accuracy mods affect damage done (as accuracy is part of the damage calculation) as well as the chance to hit.

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As one of the few carbiners still around but to lazy to add to the discussion I just vote:

I want:

1.) range limitations on the (all/some/depends on) specials and all weapons have the same range
and
3.) accuracy modifiers based on the ranges as PRE CU

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I'd have to say #2 may be the fairest of the suggestions. If carbs or rifleman were rooted at least the player would still be able to fire back.

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messiah38128 wrote:

To show these ideas in game there should be a much higher sac cost as well as accuracy and movement reduction for using a special that your'e not proficient with.

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Pug wrote:

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Pug wrote:

Hi, everybody. I've been reading the thread and I've come up with a new proposal. Let me know what you think.

Pistol Certifications

All pistols have a 1-35 meter firing range.
(i.e. You need 30 meters to get the max range of 65 meters.)

Carbine Certifications

All carbines have a 15-50 meter firing range.
(i.e. You need 15 meters to get the min range of 1 meter.)
(i.e. You need 15 meters to get the max range of 65 meters.)

Rifle Certifications

All rifles have a 30-65 meter firing range.
(i.e. You need 30 meters to get the max range of 1 meter.)

Pistoleer Skill Bonuses

Each box of Pistoleer would give +1 meter max range while wielding Pistols.
Master Pistoleer would give +14 meter max range while wielding Pistols.

Carbineer Skill Bonuses

Each box of two trees of Carbineer would give -1 meter to min range while wielding Carbines.
Each box of two trees of Carbineer would give +1 meter to max range while wielding Carbines.
Master Carbineer would give -7 meter min range and +7 meter max range while wielding Carbines.

Rifleman Skill Bonuses

Each box of Rifleman would give -1 meter min range while wielding Rifles.
Master Rifleman would give -14 meter min range range while wielding Pistols.

What else?

There may need to be very small adjustments to SAC and damge costs for pistols, carbines and rifles to make the weapons more distinct. Or else everybody would just go Master Rifleman for damage. There should be balance in that pistols do less damage but can fire longer because of the low SAC. Rifles are the extreme opposite of that. Carbines are a balance.

What does this accomplish?

A profession is encouraged to use that professions's weapons because they'll be able to wield them effectively at all ranges. i.e. A Master Bounty Hunter / Master Pistoleer would be using a pistol because he can fire it from 0-65 meters, but if he picks up a rifle he's limited to 30-65 meters with it unless he has a few boxes in Rifleman which would bring down the minimum firing range.

This still allows for cross-profession dabbling. As a Pistoleer, I don't mind Rifleman using Stopping Shot. I think it should be encouraged. Not knowing what special someone is going to use helps the game's excitement level.

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Reading the Rifleman forum, I found out that this plan would require a few lower CL weapons for each type to be able to level. For example, there would need to be a low CL rifle with 0-65 meter range would be required for new Rifleman grinding. Same thing with pistols. There would need to be (and currently there is) a low CL pistol with 0-65 meter range so that new Pistoleers who can't really take a beating up close could kite a little better.

Food for though. I'm still happy to recieve constructive feedback on this proposal. There are a lot of issues involved.

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Just curious if my suggestion has any merit. I didn't see it inlcuded in the Current Suggestions section of the original post. If I'm missing something obvious, I'd love to read feedback on it. I don't mind criticism. It helps me learn.

Really.. I thought about it since i first posted in this subject.. i believe the corr has the wrong aims.

Minimum ranges are not the answer.. it will just gimp profession for most pve content since the ai is so badly coded..and then all will just have pistols or a melee requirement..

What should be pitched for, is not minimum ranges.. It should be more pistol defence (tied to the weapon to make it only work while said weapon type is in use). -5 sac from the SAC current cap.. to allow pistoleers to take lesser SAC cost and be able to fire more and control crowds easier. An inherant spd boost on pistols.

These three things would make a rifleman long range still.. but a pistoleer the kings of short range. With all tied to the weapon, there would be no carry-over to other weapons like the rifle, so a pistol would have to be used to get the best def and special use at a short range. It seems like a much better plan to insure the role pistoleers were meant for, and would insure a greater balance then guns that do not fire at a minimum range.

For those who mix, and lets face it.. we all do in one way or another.. you would have those who use headshot with a pistol and those who use fanshot with a rifle.. up close.. a pistoleer would have the spd, the acc, and the ability to use more specials to a greater effect.. the rifle would then be a hinderence to use at such close range as opposed to what the pistol could do.

EDIT:

Now by doing this.. it would make the 35m (50m arm) cap needed even more. No way to have that much spd, that little sac cost, or that defence with a guy that has 65m.. and it would not do to have that balance and have a rifle not fire at 35m or lower, the power would already be there..

Message Edited by Logitition on 07-06-2005 11:48 PM

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Logitition wrote:

Really.. I thought about it since i first posted in this subject.. i believe the corr has the wrong aims.

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Though I haven't read all of the posts, I haven't seen any mention of Smugglers. Their primary weapon is a pistol, I carry my Renegade Pistol when I'm just out running around and switch to my T21 for missions and hunting and such. How will a change in the way ranged weapons are used affect the smuggler prof? I must have missunderstood, I thought the CU was supposed to promote dabbling, and mixing of profession skills so everyone would be on the same playing feild.

Bring back the range modifiers to accuracy for all weapons...sure you can fire a rifle at point blank, but in a combat situation it becomes difficult to manipulate a shouldered weapon multiple times at an active target.(i.e. M4 Carbine as CQB weapon versus full length M16 or 14" barrel "Border-patrol" model shotguns versus 22" hunting shotguns as entry weapons) By the same token it is absolutley possible to 10x a target with a pistol at 50+ meters, but the limited sight radius of a pistol becomes a factor in being able to do so repeatedly.

Pre-CU Accuracy Bonus and Penalty... Rifle within 0-35m get Accuracy Penalty, Pistols within 35-65 recive Penalty, Carbines then within 0-10 or 50-65m would get their Penalty! This clairly showes that Carbineers would have the "upper hand" so im not sure if they deserve a higher Accuracy Penalty or any other balance?