Pilot Archive
Thread: Decayless PvP in Deep Space? Sorry.. I don't Buy It...
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NajaPallida
Mon Jan 10, 2005 2:13 pm
#1
Decayless PvP? Get over yourselves....
If you drive your car off of a hillside and turn the chassis intoRuffles Potato Chip, you can (possibly) straighten it out. The chassis will not be as strong after being repaired... simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply.
If you're foolish enough to drive your car off of the same hillside, and again turn your chassis into a Ruffles Potato chip, you may or may not be able tostraighten it. Thatis simply a fact of life. Again, simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply. The more times you stress a structure beyond its normal load specifications, the shorter it's lifespan will be.
I ought to know.. I have destroyed several automobiles, and a couple of airframes, in my long and (somewhat) checkeredlifetime.
Time for a "reality check", kiddies... Fractures andwarping in steel, aluminum and copper can only be "repaired" so many times... after which, all one can do is "buy a new chassis"... or "buy a new vehicle."
In a simulation where there is an economy specifically designed to mimic the realities of a growing (or in our current case a "stagnating") gaming economy (to include a complete branch devoted to repair and refit of starships), whiningabout decay on ship chassis and components in a such volume and timbre that the Developers "give in to the Mob Mentality"... well it simplymakes me sick.
/rant on
What I have seen is a bunch of children that always have to have it easy... children that never thought, for a moment, that the game has something to teach... For that manner, children that never think... period.
"Boo hoo.. It's too hard to make exp... Make it easier,,,"
"Boo hoo.. I dont have time to make the credits required to repair my ship... make it easier..."
"Boo hoo.. I can't possibly make enough credits to replace components after PvP... Take PvP Decay AWAYYYY!!!"
"Boo hoo.. I don't understand... explain it to me in words of two syllables or less..."
"Boo hoo.. I can't... will you do it for me?"
/rant off
Grow up kiddees... if you dont do it now, then you'll eventuallydiscover that realitytend's to be extremelyharsh and uncaring.
Sheesh... Now I'll have to listen to all the flames, snide remarks and downright hostility... Oh well.. nothing that i am not inured to.
so.... "bring it".
ssssssssssssssssssssssSSS(:-<
Message Edited by NajaPallida on 01-11-2005 10:23 AM
rexan
Mon Jan 10, 2005 2:23 pm
#2
NajaPallida wrote:
Decayless PvP? Get over yourselves....
If you drive your car off of a hillside and turn the chassis intoRuffles Potato Chip, you can (possibly) straighten it out. The chassis will not be as strong after being repaired... simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply.
If you're foolish enough to drive your car off of the same hillside, and again turn your chassis into a Ruffles Potato chip, you may or may not be able tostraighten it. Thatis simply a fact of life. Again, simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply. The more times you stress a structure beyond its normal load specifications, the shorter it's lifespan will be.
I ought to know.. I have destroyed several automobiles, and a couple of airframes, in my long and (somewhat) checkeredlifetime.
Time for a "reality check", kiddies... Fractures andwarping in steel, aluminum and copper can only be "repaired" so many times... after which, all one can do is "buy a new chassis"... or "buy a new vehicle."
In a simulation where there is an economy specifically designed to mimic the realities of a growing (or in our current case a "stagnating") gaming economy (to include a complete branch devoted to repair and refit of starships), whiningabout decay on ship chassis and components in a such volume and timbre that the Developers "give in to the Mob Mentality"... well it simplymakes me sick.
/rant on
What I have seen is a bunch of children that always have to have it easy... children that never thought, for a moment, that the game has something to teach... For that manner, children that never think... period.
"Boo hoo.. It's too hard to make exp... Make it easier,,,"
"Boo hoo.. I dont have time to make the credits required to repair my ship... make it easier..."
"Boo hoo.. I can't possibly make enough credits to replace components after PvP... Take PvP Decay AWAYYYY!!!"
"Boo hoo.. I don't understand... explain it to me in words of two syllables or less..."
"Boo hoo.. I can't... will you do it for me?"
/rant off
Grow up kiddees... if you dont do it now, then you'll eventuallydiscover that realitytend's to be extremelyharsh and uncaring.
Sheesh... Now I'll have to listen to all the flames, snide remarks and downright hostility... Oh well.. nothing that i am not inured to.
so.... "bring it".
ssssssssssssssssssssssSSS(:-<
How many times have you been to a cloning center?
Want to talk reality? Lets implement perma-death. That way when you get killed in game, either in space or on the ground, you can re-roll your character.
/sarcasm off
This is a game. Deal with it.
Gruug
Mon Jan 10, 2005 2:24 pm
#3
Although I agree in principle with everything you say I must temper it by saying that this is only an entertainment product. If it were simulating reality then there would be no sounds in space. No explosions. No gravityless spaceflight. Instead, you have to look at this as a game that is meant to be purely and simply an entertainment medium. Meaning....if those that play it are not happy...make them happy. Does this mean that everyone that cries and whines should get their way? No! But, it does mean that if there is a problem that is causing a good majority of players to "not have fun" then that problem needs to be addressed. In this case, PvP decay was done away with because people felt they could not compete against the uber amongst us and therefore could not or should not be penalized. It's not the way it should be but it is the way it is.
Nomolos_UK
Mon Jan 10, 2005 4:17 pm
#5
Good points and you made me smile!
But i think your the other side of the coin there needs to be some damage but at the moment with 2 hits your dead in PvP i can understand why people would get a little urr unhappy!
I think there are so many ideas floating around that hopefully some will be picked up and used and then we are all happy bunnys!
If not game over for most..
..
/smile off
But i think your the other side of the coin there needs to be some damage but at the moment with 2 hits your dead in PvP i can understand why people would get a little urr unhappy!
I think there are so many ideas floating around that hopefully some will be picked up and used and then we are all happy bunnys!
If not game over for most..
..
/smile off
Yarnok
Mon Jan 10, 2005 4:24 pm
#6
Odajja wrote:
Think we have bigger issues than than The decay of a Spaceship.
And yet this is a bigger issue forthen you might think (for Shipwrights anyway)....with no Decay during PvP it cuts buisness for SW's at least in 1/2
Odajja
Mon Jan 10, 2005 4:30 pm
#7
GRRRR See below for pull post!
Message Edited by Odajja on 01-10-2005 04:20 PM
NajaPallida
Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:19 pm
#8
Odajja wrote:
Hmm.. if you are referring to me, your insult iswasted. I am not a Shipwright.
sssssssssssssssSSS(:-<
Odajja
Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:19 pm
#9
Yeah ok Sure it does. Plse. Spare me the SW Whine of that. I go thru ships With ease just helping other players I fly overt all the time and have only been taken by one other overt player Never in Deep Space. Now you want more money Cry for a fix of the Plasma leaks Then youll earn cash.
Odajja
Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:23 pm
#10
NajaPallida wrote:
Odajja wrote:
Hmm.. if you are referring to me, your insult iswasted. I am not a Shipwright.
sssssssssssssssSSS(:-<
Maybe your not but SW have bigger issues as well.
Ducimus
Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:26 pm
#11
Reality and fantasy are two different things.
If you want reality and realism, i suggest finding a hobby other than SWG; which is pure fantasy designed to entertain, not as a real world simulation. On that note, UO might be right up your alley.
If you want reality and realism, i suggest finding a hobby other than SWG; which is pure fantasy designed to entertain, not as a real world simulation. On that note, UO might be right up your alley.
TomoRainer
Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:32 pm
#12
Realism in decay isn't very important when we're talking about PVP. In fact, I'd argue it's completely irrelevant. The original post seemed to say that in real life, sh-- happens; true enough, but by implication, real life often isn't fun--so why, exactly, would we want to duplicate the parts of life that suck when we're playing a game?
There's already no PVP decay on the ground game, which sets a strong precedent for doing the same in JTL, where the mechanics of PVP are even more suited for a decayless system. It's extremely easy to die and when you're going up against another player it's quite likely you could do so in a matter of seconds. However long it takes them to land two shots. With the risk being that great and each encounter lasting such a brief time, where is the fun if your parts are being reduced to uselessness so quickly? Especially when many of those parts are RE'd ones that took weeks to assemble and often can only be regained by remastering a pilot tree?
My main problem with PVP decay isn't that it exists, though it wouldn't bug me if it didn't, but that it's so harsh. 10% each time you die. That adds up fast. A couple weeks cruising around, a handful of PVP events, and it's time to swap out the old stuff. Dropping it to 2-5% would be significantly more reasonable; adding a sector for non-masters like Deep Space is another possible solution, though not ideal. In any event, this game has little enough PVP as it is, and I really don't understand advocating rules that discourage it further. Who, exactly, are you taking revenge on?
There's already no PVP decay on the ground game, which sets a strong precedent for doing the same in JTL, where the mechanics of PVP are even more suited for a decayless system. It's extremely easy to die and when you're going up against another player it's quite likely you could do so in a matter of seconds. However long it takes them to land two shots. With the risk being that great and each encounter lasting such a brief time, where is the fun if your parts are being reduced to uselessness so quickly? Especially when many of those parts are RE'd ones that took weeks to assemble and often can only be regained by remastering a pilot tree?
My main problem with PVP decay isn't that it exists, though it wouldn't bug me if it didn't, but that it's so harsh. 10% each time you die. That adds up fast. A couple weeks cruising around, a handful of PVP events, and it's time to swap out the old stuff. Dropping it to 2-5% would be significantly more reasonable; adding a sector for non-masters like Deep Space is another possible solution, though not ideal. In any event, this game has little enough PVP as it is, and I really don't understand advocating rules that discourage it further. Who, exactly, are you taking revenge on?
Chiwawa
Mon Jan 10, 2005 6:01 pm
#13
NajaPallida wrote:Decayless PvP? Get over yourselves....If you drive your car off of a hillside and turn the chassis into Ruffles Potato Chip, you can (possibly) straighten it out. The chassis will not be as strong after being repaired... simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply.If you're foolish enough to drive your car off of the same hillside, and again turn your chassis into a Ruffles Potato chip, you may or may not be able to straighten it. That is simply a fact of life. Again, simple laws of physics and metallurgy apply. The more times you stress a structure beyond its normal load specifications, the shorter it's lifespan will be.I ought to know.. I have destroyed several automobiles, and a couple of airframes, in my long and (somewhat) checkered lifetime.Time for a "reality check", kiddies... Fractures and warping in steel, aluminum and copper can only be "repaired" so many times... after which, all one can do is "buy a new chassis"... or "buy a new vehicle."In a simulation where there is an economy specifically designed to mimic the realities of a growing (or in our current case a "stagnating") gaming economy (to include a complete branch devoted to repair and refit of starships), whining about decay on ship chassis and components in a such volume and timbre that the Developers "give in to the Mob Mentality"... well it simply makes me sick./rant onWhat I have seen is a bunch of children that always have to have it easy... children that never thought, for a moment, that the game has something to teach... For that manner, children that never think... period."Boo hoo.. It's too hard to make exp... Make it easier,,,""Boo hoo.. I dont have time to make the credits required to repair my ship... make it easier...""Boo hoo.. I can't possibly make enough credits to replace components after PvP... Take PvP Decay AWAYYYY!!!""Boo hoo.. I don't understand... explain it to me in words of two syllables or less...""Boo hoo.. I can't... will you do it for me?"/rant offGrow up kiddees... if you dont do it now, then you'll eventually discover that reality tend's to be extremely harsh and uncaring.Sheesh... Now I'll have to listen to all the flames, snide remarks and downright hostility... Oh well.. nothing that i am not inured to.so.... "bring it".ssssssssssssssssssssssSSS(:-<
Sorry, but RIGHT ON!!!! 5 stars for you!
Cue flames, anyone that has had a space run in with me (quartz, veronas or any of the good masters on farstar)or has traded with me (speak up, all 500 odd of you) knows I abide by the above. I hold my own (most of the time, yes quartz that means you!) in space and am not afriad to pile in even when i know I will die (yes I assist new players in kessel), and my VERY nice ship will get less uber.
Stuff decays, get over it! Quit treating shipwrights like they OWE you a ship and the best they can produce, we dont, it costs money, and costs time and thought and most of all experience. Most of us dont ask much and produce great stuff for you to fight with.
Fed up
Shamai
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