Pilot Archive

1. In the above situation with the RE'd borstel, instead of reducing the shields to nothing in one hit, the 3200 damage would be reduced to 1587, and shields would drop down to about 1000.


2. Assuming the pilot manages to restore 1200 points before the next shot, shields will be up to 2200, however Deflection Intensity is reduced in proprtion to the shield as it was in my first idea, so the shieldsdeflector intensity (SDI)is now down to 43.4% So now only 1388 points are deflected, with 1800 passing thru, reducing shields to 400, and SDI is now 7.9%.


3. Even with another CtSS before the next hit, since most of the cap energy is now gone, shields will only be up to 1000 or so, with a SDI of 19.7, so the next hit is reduced to 631, with shields being completely eliminated, and almost 1600 points of damage applied to the armor/components.

After the 3rd hit damage is applied in the same way it is now effectively, as shields wouldn't be able to be brought back to a high enough level to mitigate much damage, and after shields are down, you're likely to be destroyed in the next shot. This I have no problem with.

Now, what is currently a 1 maybe 2 shot situation is now at least 4, with stategic use of things such as CtSS and carefully timed shots so as to not waste cap charge become even more important than it does now. This system is also a way to improve survivability of MP ships...

In the case of a ship with dual massive cannons, the first hit essentially becomes the first and 3rd hit in the above, with 1600 damage making its way thru to the armor and components. Possible for a 1shot disabling, less likely for a one shot kill, even with heavy fighter on heavy fighter (which now is pretty much a guaranteed one shot kill)

Introducing the new shield upgrade! Deflection Intensifier!!! This baby increases your SDI, but at a cost! Deflection Intensifiers are quite heavy. So heavy in fact that the mark 5 upgrade weighs4 times as much as the shield itself! Lower end Deflection Intensifiers aren't too heavy, but only increase SDI by a small amount 3-5%, however the larger ones can enhance SDI by as much as 45%! Standard mark 5 shield generators max out at only 45% SDI, however with perfect resources and a mark 5 Deflection Intensifier upgrade, the SDI can reach as high as 90%! However mass of this shield will be approximately 200k mass, making it entirely unsuitable for anything other than light transport ships or larger. Those monster heavy fighters with thier massive guns will have quite a hard time whittling down these shields. And the SDI will stay high for quite a while as shield intensity is lowered. Even monster cannons in the 3-5k range will be reduced to 350 shield damage after SDI reduction and vs shield modifiers. The Z95 assaulting the VT-49 would be doing marginal damage, as they should, while the VT-49 would still be able to one shot the Z95, as thier SDI would not be significant enough to mitigate that much damage. Heavy fighters or other large MP ships with large guns would be required to take out FOB ships, while FOB ships would still be able to easily take down light fighters who cross thier gunhairs.

SDI will NOT be added to existing shields automatically. In order to get SDI added you must turn your shield into a chassis dealer for an upgrade. During the process of this upgrade the dealer will check for any illegal modifications. The devs would impliment a maximum allowable shield intensity for front and back combined, and if the shields are found to be out of of specification (i.e. exploited) they will not be modified, and they will not be returned. Shields without SDI will continue to function in the same manor they do now, with an assumed SDI of 0%. Sheilds modified for SDI will be given a default "average" SDI value. Shields without SDI would still be able to be RE'd with shields with SDI, the system would just assume a 0% for non SDI shields, so it would take the best SDI from the shields with the value. Perhaps make the chassis dealer accept 2 shields to upgrade, one existing RE'd shield, and one loot shield with an SDI value, the chassis dealer would apply the loot shields SDI to the existing RE as a free one time only upgrade.

NPC damage would not have to be adjusted in this system. Since NPCs use a different method to determine if they hit, NPC damage could just bypass SDI entirely, making PvE the same as it is now. SDI would be PvP reduction only and would address the following issues, nearest I can tell, entirely:

1. One shot kills for everybody - Not likely under SDI, unless you are flying an extremely light ship, or caught in a large PvE encounter with your shields already largely comprimised.


2. Exploit shields - trade in program would identify them and eliminate them. People could still use them, but without the benefit of SDI, thier effectiveness is VASTLY lowered, since there would be no need for a PvP reduction.


3. MP ship viability - with massive SDI, they will be able to sustain far more shots before shields drop, and with thier larger faster regen capacitors should be able to keep shields up a good while still able to return fire.

Comments, concerns?

Message Edited by Eaca on 02-16-200501:10 PM

Message Edited by Eaca on 02-16-2005 01:11 PM

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Eaca wrote:

1. In the above situation with the RE'd borstel, instead of reducing the shields to nothing in one hit, the 3200 damage would be reduced to 1587, and now the shields take 1587 damage, and 57% sdi?and shields would drop down to about 1000. so the pilot takes 1500 damage? or 587?


2. Assuming the pilot manages to restore 1200 points before the next shot, shields will be up to 2200 this is where i lose you completely, how much sdi does the ctss restore?, however Deflection Intensity is reduced in proprtion to the shield as it was in my first idea, so the shieldsdeflector intensity (SDI)is now down to 43.4% So now only 1388 points are deflected, with 1800 passing thru, reducing shields to 400, and SDI is now 7.9%.


3. Even with another CtSS before the next hit, since most of the cap energy is now gone, shields will only be up to 1000 or so, with a SDI of 19.7, so the next hit is reduced to 631, with shields being completely eliminated, and almost 1600 points of damage applied to the armor/component
   

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Ivon wrote:

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Eaca wrote:

1. In the above situation with the RE'd borstel, instead of reducing the shields to nothing in one hit, the 3200 damage would be reduced to 1587, and now the shields take 1587 damage, and 57% sdi?and shields would drop down to about 1000. so the pilot takes 1500 damage? or 587?


2. Assuming the pilot manages to restore 1200 points before the next shot, shields will be up to 2200 this is where i lose you completely, how much sdi does the ctss restore?, however Deflection Intensity is reduced in proprtion to the shield as it was in my first idea, so the shieldsdeflector intensity (SDI)is now down to 43.4% So now only 1388 points are deflected, with 1800 passing thru, reducing shields to 400, and SDI is now 7.9%.


3. Even with another CtSS before the next hit, since most of the cap energy is now gone, shields will only be up to 1000 or so, with a SDI of 19.7, so the next hit is reduced to 631, with shields being completely eliminated, and almost 1600 points of damage applied to the armor/component
   

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:/ im stupid

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SDI is subtracted before any damage is applied to any components. Adjusted Damage = Damage * (1 - SDI). Adjusted Damage is applied to shield points and armor/HP as it currently is. SDI = max SDI * current shield / max shield. So at 100% shielding, SDI is whatever the max SDI rating of the shield is, at 0% shielding, SDI is 0.

1. 3200 * (1 - 0.504) = 1587
   So 1587 damage is taken out of the shields, dropping them down to about 1000 like I said. Pilot takes 1500ish damage to thier shields. After this hit the SDI is down to 19.7


2. SDI is based on the max SDI rating of the shield, and the current "strength" of the shield. CtSS restores SDI in proportion to the % sheild it restores. If the CtSS restores half of the total shield strength, then it recovers about 25.3% SDI.

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Eaca wrote:

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Ivon wrote:

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Eaca wrote:

1. In the above situation with the RE'd borstel, instead of reducing the shields to nothing in one hit, the 3200 damage would be reduced to 1587, and now the shields take 1587 damage, and 57% sdi?and shields would drop down to about 1000. so the pilot takes 1500 damage? or 587?


2. Assuming the pilot manages to restore 1200 points before the next shot, shields will be up to 2200 this is where i lose you completely, how much sdi does the ctss restore?, however Deflection Intensity is reduced in proprtion to the shield as it was in my first idea, so the shieldsdeflector intensity (SDI)is now down to 43.4% So now only 1388 points are deflected, with 1800 passing thru, reducing shields to 400, and SDI is now 7.9%.


3. Even with another CtSS before the next hit, since most of the cap energy is now gone, shields will only be up to 1000 or so, with a SDI of 19.7, so the next hit is reduced to 631, with shields being completely eliminated, and almost 1600 points of damage applied to the armor/component
   

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:/ im stupid

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SDI is subtracted before any damage is applied to any components. Adjusted Damage = Damage * (1 - SDI). Adjusted Damage is applied to shield points and armor/HP as it currently is. SDI = max SDI * current shield / max shield. So at 100% shielding, SDI is whatever the max SDI rating of the shield is, at 0% shielding, SDI is 0.

1. 3200 * (1 - 0.504) = 1587
   So 1587 damage is taken out of the shields, dropping them down to about 1000 like I said. Pilot takes 1500ish damage to thier shields. After this hit the SDI is down to 19.7


2. SDI is based on the max SDI rating of the shield, and the current "strength" of the shield. CtSS restores SDI in proportion to the % sheild it restores. If the CtSS restores half of the total shield strength, then it recovers about 25.3% SDI.

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ah ok cleared that up then...

I like this idea, a lot =)

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Eaca wrote:

So I'm reading another thread when I see this:

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1st_Viduus wrote:

1. <<>snip<>>
2. Deflector shields that don't deflect is what we have in JtL. They take damage as Star Trek shields would, which is to say Kinetic Shielding, taking damage as if they were a solid object. Star Wars shields are Deflector shields, meant to throw off damage by bouncing it off. So bounce it off, already! Fine by me if a 3500 hit to my shields blows them wide open, but the damage should still have been deflected. Meaning it shouldn't do 2555 to the shield to wipe it out + 1445 to my armor to wipe that out as well. That excess should be disposed of, and the next shot make to penetrate armor, and once armor is gone, chassis and components. "Cap2Shield" you're going to say... yes. That means that you'll need your skill to score those hits consecutively, not just a lucky shot here and there. Even using only C2S-2 takes 30 seconds on a Pre-Fix DI, so you will have an opportunity to land those hits.

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But something about that idea just didn't sit right with me... I mean, where does deflecting stop and damage begin? Shields recharge a set amount every second, so after that first hit, if you manage to dodge for a few seconds, does a CtSS, and gets his shields back up to say 1200, should the next hit be completely deflected too? That's not exactly fair. How much should be deflected if his shields only regen to say 100? And what if somebody is shooting at you with two linked guns? Ok one gun blast is completely deflected, but the other shot passes thru, and you're still effectively one shotted, even tho it was technically two bolts.

That got me thinking, what if shields DID deflect damage, but the ammount deflected was based on the shield charge to begin with. We'll say we're using the 2555 reward shield vs the borstel reward gun, which we'll say does 3200 damage in a PvP shot. Current system this drops shields completely, and does 645 damage to armor. Lets take shield capacity pre-hit, measured in percent, and turn that into a deflection value. Shields still take "normal" damage, but any damage that gets thru is reduced by this deflection value. So the same scenario with deflection, the shields absorb 2555 points of damage, but since they were full to begin with, the remainder of the 645 damage is deflected, and no damage is done to armor. Similarly if the pilot manages to get thier shields up to 1200 before the next hit, shields absorb 1200 points of damage, but 1200 is only 47% of 2555, so only 939 points are deflected, with the remainder of the 1061 points being applied to armor and components. Shield only recharges to 100 before the next blast? 100 is absorbed, 121 is deflected, and 2978 are passed along. Sounds good? Bleh, no I don't think so, sounds awful. I mean lets face it, this isn't really fair either. Do you honestly think a pilot in a Z95 strafing a MP ship, that's shooting at it with L10 guns that do 3x more min damage than the Z95 has armor, shields, components, and chassis HP combined? That Z95 should be dead in a flash. Also this doesn't solve the problem with double blaster hits at all, one blaster takes out the shield, the other takes out the rest of the ship, still one-shotted.

BUT!

What if we deflected damage BEFORE it was applied to shields!!! Now obviously the initial deflection ammount can no longer be 100%, or we'd all be invincible. What if instead shields were given another stat, "Deflection Intensity". Deflection intensity would be a percentage less than 100 that would be used to determine blaster damage before applying it to shield and armor the same way it is in the current system. Deflection intensity would also be based on shield level, with higher shields having much higher deflection intensity than lower level shields. I'm thinking about 5% per cert level would be a good "average" level, with 7.5% per level being the max for "legendary" loot drops (not counting RE bonus). Lets see how this system would work...

Assuming the L8 reward shield RE'd with a slightly above average 48% shield. After RE bonus we're looking at a shield with 2555 front/back and 50.4% deflection.

1. In the above situation with the RE'd borstel, instead of reducing the shields to nothing in one hit, the 3200 damage would be reduced to 1587, and shields would drop down to about 1000.
2. Assuming the pilot manages to restore 1200 points before the next shot, shields will be up to 2200, however Deflection Intensity is reduced in proprtion to the shield as it was in my first idea, so the shields deflector intensity (SDI) is now down to 43.4% So now only 1388 points are deflected, with 1800 passing thru, reducing shields to 400, and SDI is now 7.9%.
3. Even with another CtSS before the next hit, since most of the cap energy is now gone, shields will only be up to 1000 or so, with a SDI of 19.7, so the next hit is reduced to 631, with shields being completely eliminated, and almost 1600 points of damage applied to the armor/components.

After the 3rd hit damage is applied in the same way it is now effectively, as shields wouldn't be able to be brought back to a high enough level to mitigate much damage, and after shields are down, you're likely to be destroyed in the next shot. This I have no problem with.

Now, what is currently a 1 maybe 2 shot situation is now at least 4, with stategic use of things such as CtSS and carefully timed shots so as to not waste cap charge become even more important than it does now. This system is also a way to improve survivability of MP ships...

In the case of a ship with dual massive cannons, the first hit essentially becomes the first and 3rd hit in the above, with 1600 damage making its way thru to the armor and components. Possible for a 1shot disabling, less likely for a one shot kill, even with heavy fighter on heavy fighter (which now is pretty much a guaranteed one shot kill)

Introducing the new shield upgrade! Deflection Intensifier!!! This baby increases your SDI, but at a cost! Deflection Intensifiers are quite heavy. So heavy in fact that the mark 5 upgrade weighs 4 times as much as the shield itself! Lower end Deflection Intensifiers aren't too heavy, but only increase SDI by a small amount 3-5%, however the larger ones can enhance SDI by as much as 45%! Standard mark 5 shield generators max out at only 45% SDI, however with perfect resources and a mark 5 Deflection Intensifier upgrade, the SDI can reach as high as 90%! However mass of this shield will be approximately 200k mass, making it entirely unsuitable for anything other than light transport ships or larger. Those monster heavy fighters with thier massive guns will have quite a hard time whittling down these shields. And the SDI will stay high for quite a while as shield intensity is lowered. Even monster cannons in the 3-5k range will be reduced to 350 shield damage after SDI reduction and vs shield modifiers. The Z95 assaulting the VT-49 would be doing marginal damage, as they should, while the VT-49 would still be able to one shot the Z95, as thier SDI would not be significant enough to mitigate that much damage. Heavy fighters or other large MP ships with large guns would be required to take out FOB ships, while FOB ships would still be able to easily take down light fighters who cross thier gunhairs.

SDI will NOT be added to existing shields automatically. In order to get SDI added you must turn your shield into a chassis dealer for an upgrade. During the process of this upgrade the dealer will check for any illegal modifications. The devs would impliment a maximum allowable shield intensity for front and back combined, and if the shields are found to be out of of specification (i.e. exploited) they will not be modified, and they will not be returned. Shields without SDI will continue to function in the same manor they do now, with an assumed SDI of 0%. Sheilds modified for SDI will be given a default "average" SDI value. Shields without SDI would still be able to be RE'd with shields with SDI, the system would just assume a 0% for non SDI shields, so it would take the best SDI from the shields with the value. Perhaps make the chassis dealer accept 2 shields to upgrade, one existing RE'd shield, and one loot shield with an SDI value, the chassis dealer would apply the loot shields SDI to the existing RE as a free one time only upgrade.

NPC damage would not have to be adjusted in this system. Since NPCs use a different method to determine if they hit, NPC damage could just bypass SDI entirely, making PvE the same as it is now. SDI would be PvP reduction only and would address the following issues, nearest I can tell, entirely:

1. One shot kills for everybody - Not likely under SDI, unless you are flying an extremely light ship, or caught in a large PvE encounter with your shields already largely comprimised.
2. Exploit shields - trade in program would identify them and eliminate them. People could still use them, but without the benefit of SDI, thier effectiveness is VASTLY lowered, since there would be no need for a PvP reduction.
3. MP ship viability - with massive SDI, they will be able to sustain far more shots before shields drop, and with thier larger faster regen capacitors should be able to keep shields up a good while still able to return fire.

Comments, concerns?

Message Edited by Eaca on 02-16-200501:10 PM

Message Edited by Eaca on 02-16-2005 01:11 PM

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