Pilot Archive
Thread: Ethical to grind out other pilots on an ARC?
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Kazzar
Sat Oct 08, 2005 11:01 am
#1
I'm an old school pilot and I love space. Recently I've been taking members of my guild up in space in my ARC and getting them all their Tier 2 experience in a matter of 10 min. I was wondering if I should be praised or shunned for this activity. I know the cons to helping them is that they wont learn to pilot themselves, wont have to "earn their wings," etc, but I found that a lot of people hate space in the beginning. If you can get people past the sometimes rough first 2 Tiers, and get them their first X-Wing (or Rhykyyyk - sorry can't spell it), they start to find space more fun and are willing to do actually give it a shot. I figure, more pilots, the better. What do you guys think of "xp piggybacking?"
OkigaWona
Sat Oct 08, 2005 11:15 am
#2
I have the same dillema. When i'm not dropping off loot/in deepspace/doing quests in space, I try to help as many people I can in space matters. I'll help any guild people in space, be it grinding or missions, if I have time and the request isn't too outragous. People I don't know who ask are a bit more tricky. There are honest, nice people who are genuinely stumped. In that case, i'll ask "do you use droid commands/know the best spots to gain experience?", and if they don't, i'll point them to the forums and tell them of places to go to grind experience, or help them on their mission if they still have trouble after reading the forum FAQ's. Then there are people who are obviously lazy and just want to get the most skills the quickest, and act slightly rude / impolite. Luckily i've only ever met the odd person like this. In such a case, i'll just tell them to do some work for themselves.
But for guild members, i'd have no problems with grinding help. A guild is there for people to help each other, among other things. As long as the person is polite and understanding in their request, I'd gladly help them.
Message Edited by OkigaWona on 10-08-2005 11:16 AM
KaylBreinhar
Sat Oct 08, 2005 11:46 am
#3
My only rules are to have WO3 and keep up. I don't share loot, I don't share credits, and I sure as hell don't do missions (unless I like you/know you and know you're not using that relationship to make me a goddamned valet). If you're relying on my ass to mule your xp, you cede your rights to loot and credits. That's your penalty when you fly Air Breinhar - we don't have peanuts, and NO, you can't keep your can.
I only needed help twice on my grind, and that was in the first weeks of JTL. Why? Because I did duties and learned how to handle myself in a furball. Nowadays I see people in JSFs and Heavy X-Wings struggling to take out a single group of ten T4s...usually because they never did duties to figure out how to actually avoid fire or maneuver.
I will concur with the anti-ROTW pilots - I do think ROTW was the worst thing to ever happen to space, since everyone who didn't give two cents of a damn about it prior to ROTW got access to it and figured "oh well - might as well get another badge!"
So these people invade the profession and think we're all maids whose sworn job it is to lay out a goddamned red carpet for them from Novice to Master because MOST of them (usually the FWISH FWISH players, hint-freakin'-hint) feel they're entitled to that kind of treatment.
Cut to the new crop of "doitformes..."
"Duties take too long, can't you just wait until I get 10% damage in on this railrunning target?!?!?"
Waaah, waaaah, **edit**ing waaah. I'm getting tired of it.
NOTE: The above is not meant to target those of the "new class" that are actually pulling their own weight.
I only needed help twice on my grind, and that was in the first weeks of JTL. Why? Because I did duties and learned how to handle myself in a furball. Nowadays I see people in JSFs and Heavy X-Wings struggling to take out a single group of ten T4s...usually because they never did duties to figure out how to actually avoid fire or maneuver.
I will concur with the anti-ROTW pilots - I do think ROTW was the worst thing to ever happen to space, since everyone who didn't give two cents of a damn about it prior to ROTW got access to it and figured "oh well - might as well get another badge!"
So these people invade the profession and think we're all maids whose sworn job it is to lay out a goddamned red carpet for them from Novice to Master because MOST of them (usually the FWISH FWISH players, hint-freakin'-hint) feel they're entitled to that kind of treatment.
Cut to the new crop of "doitformes..."
"Duties take too long, can't you just wait until I get 10% damage in on this railrunning target?!?!?"
Waaah, waaaah, **edit**ing waaah. I'm getting tired of it.
NOTE: The above is not meant to target those of the "new class" that are actually pulling their own weight.
Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 10-08-2005 02:47 PM
KaylBreinhar
Sat Oct 08, 2005 11:56 am
#4
Of course, it's a sliding scale - because the more "doitformes" there are, the more "doitformes" they'll create.
Case in point:
"Hey man, how'd you get Ace?"
"Oh, I just had some idiot pilot do my missions for me and do all the damage on targets so I got full xp."
"Oh cool - know any I could sponge off of?"
"Yeah sure, here are some names...."
"Could you help me, though?"
"Nah, I just Aced for the badge, jacket, and to make people THINK I could actually fly."
Case in point:
"Hey man, how'd you get Ace?"
"Oh, I just had some idiot pilot do my missions for me and do all the damage on targets so I got full xp."
"Oh cool - know any I could sponge off of?"
"Yeah sure, here are some names...."
"Could you help me, though?"
"Nah, I just Aced for the badge, jacket, and to make people THINK I could actually fly."
MBK1011
Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:09 pm
#5
Zodiac-B wrote:
I will help with missions, but they must already have tried the mission solo first and I will help with grinding "only" if they have already mastered another squadron. Not only does the grind help you learn how to fly, but it also teaches you mass maintenance on your ships as you slowly progress.
too true some of the people i help grind are completely clueless about space, in which case i prob wont help them beyond tier 1 xp
danno13
Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:50 pm
#6
Right now I'm 4/4/4/4 RSF and I've found that the duty missions do a good job of preparing someone for the missions. Outside of the exit mission (which I just failed after blowing up six of the 12Black Sunsand thinking I was almost in the clear) and a couple of bad run-ins with YT-1300s during a Tier 3 mission,I've found that doing duty missions make the normal missions seem routine and a piece of cake.
Additionally, I've had fun doing duty missions. Taking on large numbers of ships towards the end of missions and winning makes you feel like a hotshot ace (even though they are stupid NPCs, but the feeling is still there). For instance the first time I took on the five Tier 5 black suns at the end of the RSF BS destroy mission and won, I felt a sense of major accomplishment (I know you aces view this as child's play but baby steps are important to us newbies).
People who take the easy grinding with someone's help path miss out on these lessons and simple accomplishments. They do not develop a gradual confidence and do not learn from experience. Essentially, they miss out on being pilots and cannot appreciate that the journey is more fun then the badge at the end.
By doing someone else's grinding work, you may be cheating them out of the piloting experience.
Creaturetaimer
Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:57 pm
#7
i like to take low level players out to kessel so they can get a clue what it's like to kill a tier 5 A-wing. before i help them with anything.
Slysix
Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:59 pm
#8
Go for it. That way they get their ace badge and get a rude awakening when their head is handed back to them on silver platter by a real Ace. It just gives them a steeper learning curve to try to catch up. Before they can reach it they usually give up and go back to the ground. I have to really shake my head when an ace asks me to help them out in taking out a corvette.
In space no one can hear you scream. But I can hear the "it's to hard" whine and it makes me want to chuckle.
In space no one can hear you scream. But I can hear the "it's to hard" whine and it makes me want to chuckle.
Kryxal
Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:00 pm
#9
I tend towards mission help only ... generally, I'll only help somebody with XP for the first T2 box. If somebody's going to stall on XP, that's the place for it.
LeaphChausew
Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:04 pm
#10
Ethical to grind out other pilots on an ARC?
I personally prefer the backseat of my A-wing, but whatever floats your boat.
Ok that wasn't funny. Yeh, thats fine as long as you don't hold these new pilot's hands all the way through their career. Be constructive while you help them. Don't just give an easy 'afk grind' to anyone ...well short of 100000000 credits in payment up front 
erod
Sat Oct 08, 2005 6:50 pm
#11
Personally I love to help out newer pilots. If you can infect them with the awesomeness that is JTL, it just means more people up in space. Im not a big fan of doing missions, but I'll always throw some advice out there. I think its nesecary to help people out a bit just to get them going.
Halyn
Sat Oct 08, 2005 7:27 pm
#12
LeaphChausew wrote:
Ethical to grind out other pilots on an ARC?
I personally prefer the backseat of my A-wing, but whatever floats your boat.
Ok that wasn't funny. Yeh, thats fine as long as you don't hold these new pilot's hands all the way through their career. Be constructive while you help them. Don't just give an easy 'afk grind' to anyone ...well short of 100000000 credits in payment up front
You're just hoping for some good-looking female. If, say, Stark asked to grind in the backseat of your A-wing, you'd be running fast and far. 
I don't like grinding XP for anyone. It's something I hate doing on someone else's behalf, and it's not that hard for a pilot to do themselves. That being said, I've made exceptions, and I don't see it as unethical--I just see it as being detrimental to a pilot's growth.
KaylBreinhar
Sat Oct 08, 2005 10:35 pm
#13
Slysix wrote:
Go for it. That way they get their ace badge and get a rude awakening when their head is handed back to them on silver platter by a real Ace. It just gives them a steeper learning curve to try to catch up. Before they can reach it they usually give up and go back to the ground. I have to really shake my head when an ace asks me to help them out in taking out a corvette.
In space no one can hear you scream. But I can hear the "it's to hard" whine and it makes me want to chuckle.
Unfortunately, the backseating "doitformes" are the ones that yell the loudest for accomodations.
You'd think the Devs would listen to those telling them to make LESS accomodations, and thus do LESS work.
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