Pilot Archive
Thread: JTLS PVP INSANITY BALENCE
Lotridus
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:25 am
#53
I have .256 spd weapons in my firespray... that = almost 4 shots per second... so if I hit you 10 times in 3 seconds, that is still better than 1 shot 1 kill.... At least you have a chance to make 1 or 2 turns before I blow you to smitherines.
I recommend everyone watch the Obi-won vs Jengo Fettspace battle in Episode II.
I fire about as fast as Jengo does in my firespray (Looks like he has .200 spd weapons). Obi-Won was ducking and dodging the whole time in tight circles and loops. He only got hit maybe 5 times the whole time. When he got to the ground, his ship had like 3-4 Burn marks where he got torched. He survived in his little ship... so why can't we?.
LoNe-R
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:32 am
#54
This is a post to all those faction grinders to stop whining. Faction grinding in space is beautiful. Especially since it's faster than ground and it's fun as all hell. But I just read some garbage about how some would like the system changed to the ground version of PvE and PvP overt. That is complete BS. If you want to dine on the fat sow that is space faction, then you better be on the look out for people like me and the other great pilots who regularly post over here.
Stop whining. It's all that when you say all you want to do is faction grind but a real pilot comes and takes your clueless self out. If you don't want to die in space, stay on the ground. If you want to faction grind and enjoy JTL's benefits, learn how to really fly. Because right now, a change over to the ground way of thinking would kill space.
PvP in space can last for minutes with GOOD PILOTING. You button spammers with your melee stackers or just plain lazy people better step up or leave.
Tumbler2002
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:44 am
#55
LoNe-R wrote:This is a post to all those faction grinders to stop whining. Faction grinding in space is beautiful. Especially since it's faster than ground and it's fun as all hell. But I just read some garbage about how some would like the system changed to the ground version of PvE and PvP overt. That is complete BS. If you want to dine on the fat sow that is space faction, then you better be on the look out for people like me and the other great pilots who regularly post over here.Stop whining. It's all that when you say all you want to do is faction grind but a real pilot comes and takes your clueless self out. If you don't want to die in space, stay on the ground. If you want to faction grind and enjoy JTL's benefits, learn how to really fly. Because right now, a change over to the ground way of thinking would kill space.PvP in space can last for minutes with GOOD PILOTING. You button spammers with your melee stackers or just plain lazy people better step up or leave.
I think you're in the wrong place cause no one is talking about faction grinding. But thanx for letting us know you are one of the great pilots that post here.
Message Edited by Tumbler2002 on 04-04-2005 10:56 AM
fendius
Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:17 am
#56
you have no idea what we are talking about, we are looking for ways to enhance the dogfighting and not make it even close to ground combat, just trying to make ships that have 400-800 max damge weapons not kill in 2-3 shots like a 2400-4000 max damage would, besides why post at all unless you have something negative to say.....
LoNe-R wrote:
This is a post to all those faction grinders to stop whining. Faction grinding in space is beautiful. Especially since it's faster than ground and it's fun as all hell. But I just read some garbage about how some would like the system changed to the ground version of PvE and PvP overt. That is complete BS. If you want to dine on the fat sow that is space faction, then you better be on the look out for people like me and the other great pilots who regularly post over here.
Stop whining. It's all that when you say all you want to do is faction grind but a real pilot comes and takes your clueless self out. If you don't want to die in space, stay on the ground. If you want to faction grind and enjoy JTL's benefits, learn how to really fly. Because right now, a change over to the ground way of thinking would kill space.
PvP in space can last for minutes with GOOD PILOTING. You button spammers with your melee stackers or just plain lazy people better step up or leave.
Tumbler2002
Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:13 pm
#57
Ducimus wrote:
Tumbler2002 wrote:
Lotridus wrote:Here is an idea.If a player fires upon another pilot in PvP and hits, Cut the damage in half or cut it to 1/3. This would only apply in PvP combat and PvE would be normal. That way, it would at least take 8 -10 shots to kill someone... Instead of 1
Well that is another solution...that most people don't want yet..
This is exactly what some people (including me) don't want.
My longest dogfight was rougly 15 seconds. It took that long for someone to score a SINGLE hit. Now consider that a player can shunt about the every 15 seconds on the average with a decent DC. Taking 8 to 10 shots to make a kill? No thanks. Reducing PvP damage effectively turns space into the ground, only it will be impossible to die.
Assuming players stop using weapon overload 3 once it's fixed you can expect to see a major step down in damage per shot from people who want to fire more than 6-10 times before cap is gone. That will affect cap to shield shunt as well. Some might use WO2 which gives a smaller boost and takes less cap but that is still a large step down in damage.
When will they fix this bloody thing?
quadpers0n
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:35 pm
#58
you don't need to give bonuses for anything. you need roles for individual fighters that aren't determined by their shield strength.
you do that by fixing the POB ships. capital grade shielding for them would create a use for the heavy fighter, in turn creating a use for the light fighter.
there's no reason to modify anything otherwise. plenty of pilots fly around in heavy ships now without bonuses and do just fine. pvp isn't the realm of light fighters only, that's just another myth like "one shot pvp".
Tumbler2002
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:44 pm
#59
quadpers0n wrote:you don't need to give bonuses for anything. you need roles for individual fighters that aren't determined by their shield strength.you do that by fixing the POB ships. capital grade shielding for them would create a use for the heavy fighter, in turn creating a use for the light fighter.there's no reason to modify anything otherwise. plenty of pilots fly around in heavy ships now without bonuses and do just fine. pvp isn't the realm of light fighters only, that's just another myth like "one shot pvp".
I think you're right on your first statement. Without a goal for each class of fighter/ship nothing is going to change. But just increasing POB ships shields and armor won't do anything. There is still nothing for them to go after and with only 2 guns they are going to have a really hard time defending themselves. If Those ships could mount cap ship torpedo's or MKIII spacebombs that specifically took out cap ships it might be worth the trouble to try and sneak in and take out the space station or star destroyer.... Course then you have to deal with the fact that killing the space station messes everything up until next server reset. (and the fact that you get almost nothing for all your troubles....)
quadpers0n
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:46 pm
#60
yeah i don't have a problem with capital grade loot across the spectrum for POB ships, in fact, they likely do need all of the above to make them worthwhile.
SandLizard
Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:28 pm
#61
Ducimus wrote:
This is exactly what some people (including me) don't want.
My longest dogfight was rougly 15 seconds. It took that long for someone to score a SINGLE hit. Now consider that a player can shunt about the every 15 seconds on the average with a decent DC. Taking 8 to 10 shots to make a kill? No thanks. Reducing PvP damage effectively turns space into the ground, only it will be impossible to die.
I've been thinking about this argument. At first, it was what I believed, but just now thought of something I'd like to throw out there:
If, hypothetically, damage were reduced to 25% (which I personally think to be too much reduction, but anyway), of course it would take forever for a dogfight between two good pilots in, say, an A-wing and TIE Interceptor to kill the other, providing it took a while between hits for a cap to shield shunt.
Now, what I just realized, perhaps this is a *good* thing, as then, the rebels/imps could call on their pals hiding back with the B-wings/Oppressors (insert bomber here, etc) to come in while the quick fighter is distracted and line up some shots with missles or a quick quad (or triple) blast from the cannons, which would, even at 25% of now, a good quad hit would still be a kill (possibly...?) -- of course, lining up a quad hit on an interceptor....heh...um.. yeah. Go go gadget Image-Rec II I guess....
I dunno, just a random thought I had. Of course, to have this situation be what we want, we'd have to have groups up in space at all time to have good PvP experience. As it stands, anyone in any ship can get lucky, heh. Tell me about it, because I need that luck heh
. I think right now we have a pretty good system, but I haven't seen much for a solution for the bombers/POB ships, I wish they were more viable. I'll just hope for the best.
JediNg
Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:44 pm
#62
What the heck is wrong with space combat being over in 3 hits? Have any of you people who are asking for change, played any sort of flight sim, at all? That kind of change is simply ridiculous.
WhenI dogfight, the fight lasts about 5 mins against a fair pilot. Making it so damage is like 0.25% of normal or whatever it is you want, just means it'll take 20 mins to finish a fight instead of 5 or less.
Do ACTUAL pvp before you whine about change, y'know like actually jinking and getting the enemy into your sights, instead of just flying straight, turning predictably and getting blown to bits in 2 seconds by 6 hits which did not miss you beceause you were too easy to lead and unprepared.
Zaax
Tue Apr 05, 2005 5:28 am
#63
what about this one:
have insta-respawn IN DEEP SPACE only, like in XWA.
yes, i KNOW this is NOT XWA, BUT, if after you are killed, u are respawned exactly in the same spot u spawned in when u entered DS, it would make for much faster and fun PvP.
Now, those who worry about spawn camping, so far, at least on ahazi, i have not seen it, pilots seem to be an honorable bunch, more or less.
Also you will need to rebuff, eeer i ment recharge droid commnads of course, or maybe not, even have it that it stayes the way it was.
now those who are right now crying, "but what about a penalty for losing" - WHY? as it is, if you die in DS, all you lose is some ego, and you need to redeclare overt IF you were faction grinding.
I feel that space PvP is all about adrenaline, and the feeling you get after a player kill, so lets get some insta-respawn!
quadpers0n
Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:15 am
#64
i wouldn't mind instant respawn in DS, or perhaps at least outside the imp claw or the neutral station.
about spawn camping, that was fixed a long time ago. it's not a problem anymore because you are immortal for a few moments after loading into the zone.
Tumbler2002
Tue Apr 05, 2005 8:52 am
#65
Zaax wrote:what about this one:have insta-respawn IN DEEP SPACE only, like in XWA.yes, i KNOW this is NOT XWA, BUT, if after you are killed, u are respawned exactly in the same spot u spawned in when u entered DS, it would make for much faster and fun PvP.Now, those who worry about spawn camping, so far, at least on ahazi, i have not seen it, pilots seem to be an honorable bunch, more or less.Also you will need to rebuff, eeer i ment recharge droid commnads of course, or maybe not, even have it that it stayes the way it was.now those who are right now crying, "but what about a penalty for losing" - WHY? as it is, if you die in DS, all you lose is some ego, and you need to redeclare overt IF you were faction grinding.I feel that space PvP is all about adrenaline, and the feeling you get after a player kill, so lets get some insta-respawn!
I think this is a great idea. I wish that the space station/ISD would allow us to declare overt as well. That way one could head straight to deep space and jump right into things and get everything done there. No extra trip to the space station to declare overt, then fly to deep space station and jump in.
Would be a very good change I think.