Pilot Archive
Thread: New Ship Stats
Maybe this idea is way out in left field but hey, why not...
What if the smaller and faster ships, A-wing, JF, grevious, and interceptors had their speeds icreased to asimilar levels (or just balanced in teh JF case), BUT they suffer a negative increment to their shielding. I know this is already partly the case with their reduced mass (again minus the JF), but by putting that Lower shield effect you would be emphasising the idea of DODGING attaks rather than simply absorbing them. In contrast it may make more sense to give larger ships (mass not tier) a shield Bonus (not a large one mind you) representing their increased durability due to sheer bulk. These are already partly emphasized by hitpoints and mass, but the more fine the distinction the more people will need to decide whether the all out speed of an Awing/JF/whatever is worth the increased risk of having yourbutt blown apart.
Just a thought... flame away lol
) and I think it is a good one. However, what is a small bonus and what not is very hard to define which is why past discussions about this issue did not end with a single solution.You know, there are a number of ways that the system could be changed and refined.
One idea that I just had was that we get rid of caps in mass entirely. Instead, give every ship the old base speed and maneuverability ratings, but instead of having cutoffs on mass (which is absurd, anyway chassis should be limited by volume, not mass) give each ship a very small penalty per kilogram of mass placed in the ship. The tiny, maneuverable ships would have relatively high penalties for mass, the big bombers would have low penalties.
But then, this is all wandering a bit off the topic at hand.
Vegitaa wrote:
Vicotnik wrote:I should not be able to solo the Rebel Station in Deep Space, Rebels should not be able to solo a Star Destroyer...
Well, I kind of agree with you, but then again, I seem to recall someone soloed the Death Star once upon a time in a galaxy far, far away...
lurdanta wrote:
Vegitaa wrote:
Vicotnik wrote:
I should not be able to solo the Rebel Station in Deep Space, Rebels should not be able to solo a Star Destroyer...
Well, I kind of agree with you, but then again, I seem to recall someone soloed the Death Star once upon a time in a galaxy far, far away...
Except, Luke didn't solo the star destroyer. There were POB ships and multiple fighters with him, he just got the money shot... oh, and to dispel any remaining questions... here's the stats on my Jedi Star Fighter
Jedi Starfighter:
- Max Speed 993, 1215 boosted (Without Engine Overload or any droid programs)
- Y/P/R Accel 10.5/10.5/5.2
- Y/P/R (Max) 1.3
- Frt Shield 1037
- Bck Shield 1037
- Recharge 7.5
- Mass 85881.0/90000
- Cap 951.7 Recharge 41.9
The components individually...
- Reactor cert3, 2203mass, 12656 Reactor Generation
- Engine cert8, 24.4k mass, 104.6 spd 75/75/72 YPR
- Shield cert5, 7122 mass, 1037/1037 hps, 7.46 generation
- Fnt Armour 6449 mass, 494 armour
- Rr Armour 7235 mass, 1053 armour
- Cap cert4, 4231 mass, 951 energy, 41.9 recharge
- Booster cert2, 1372 mass, 30.7 acc, 23.4 spd
- DI 495 mass, 14.7 spd
- Gun 1 cert 7, 14528 mass, 1484-2843 dam
- Gun 2 cert 7, 16910 mass, 1986-3071 max damage
- Cntr Measures 895 mass
Still think these ships are balanced? I mean, I don't mind flying this thing in it's current condition if you do. Last night I taunted an AWing player by circling around him for 5 minutes never firing a shot until I finally let 2 bolts out and took his engine. Balanced?
Honestly, I'd think the fastest means to swinging these back into line would be to remove countermeasures and ordenance from all interceptor-sized fighters. No other change would be needed. Fly circles round a target? Sure. But one missle hit and you're done. If it's still unbalanced, leave them without armor. Adjust max-mass down as well, but only as much as would be needed for each component slot you remove. 20k less mass, but no armor slots, for example.
It's a lot easier to have high manuverability and speed when you scarifice protection, and vice versa. Look at an A-10, for example. The Warthog's a flying armored bath tub built around a huge weapon. Slow and ponderous, but can gake a beating and dish out all hell from its cannon. (which sounds insane when fired, btw).
To change the topic briefly- Anyone seen a Grevious fighter comparted to the Jedi Starfighter? I'm curious to know if they present the same target size... hate to be a cookie-cutter...
Message Edited by KaiRan on 05-13-2005 01:03 PM
Vegitaa wrote:
lurdanta wrote:
Vegitaa wrote:
Vicotnik wrote:I should not be able to solo the Rebel Station in Deep Space, Rebels should not be able to solo a Star Destroyer...
Well, I kind of agree with you, but then again, I seem to recall someone soloed the Death Star once upon a time in a galaxy far, far away...
Except, Luke didn't solo the star destroyer. There were POB ships and multiple fighters with him, he just got the money shot... oh, and to dispel any remaining questions... here's the stats on my Jedi Star Fighter
Jedi Starfighter:
- Max Speed 993, 1215 boosted (Without Engine Overload or any droid programs)
- Y/P/R Accel 10.5/10.5/5.2
- Y/P/R (Max) 1.3
- Frt Shield 1037
- Bck Shield 1037
- Recharge 7.5
- Mass 85881.0/90000
- Cap 951.7 Recharge 41.9
The components individually...
- Reactor cert3, 2203mass, 12656 Reactor Generation
- Engine cert8, 24.4k mass, 104.6 spd 75/75/72 YPR
- Shield cert5, 7122 mass, 1037/1037 hps, 7.46 generation
- Fnt Armour 6449 mass, 494 armour
- Rr Armour 7235 mass, 1053 armour
- Cap cert4, 4231 mass, 951 energy, 41.9 recharge
- Booster cert2, 1372 mass, 30.7 acc, 23.4 spd
- DI 495 mass, 14.7 spd
- Gun 1 cert 7, 14528 mass, 1484-2843 dam
- Gun 2 cert 7, 16910 mass, 1986-3071 max damage
- Cntr Measures 895 mass
Still think these ships are balanced? I mean, I don't mind flying this thing in it's current condition if you do. Last night I taunted an AWing player by circling around him for 5 minutes never firing a shot until I finally let 2 bolts out and took his engine. Balanced?
First, I never said it was balanced.
Second, I was just trying to breathe a little humor into the mix.
Third, lighten up a bit, will you? I'm not arguing with you.
In fact, I agree with your point, it isn't balanced. It's a game about Star Wars where some people come to play out the dream of single-handedly defeating the Death Star. Nothing in the canon or the common suggests this game should (or could) reflect a balanced real world. It's more comic book than anything else.
I don't know, you're bumming me out...I see this kind of funny opening to point out the absurdity of things and you take it all too seriously. Yes, you are right. Yes you know more than me. Yes, you are better than me and I should just shut up.
Feel better? I hope so, for I didn't mean to bum you out, I just saw an opportunity to make a funny comment, since it is true Luke did make the mother and father of all one shot kills, which kind of is funny to consider in the middle of this debate, but come to think about it, it does point out one way the game could be balanced that isn't being considered and that is fatal flaws. If I had to point out one flaw in all the ships is there really isn't a flaw to balance out the advantage. For example, why not give the small ships a flaw like being unable to carry shields or armor? Rather than make all ships balanced to each other, which is tantamount to cutting down all the trees in the forest to two foot stumps, balance each ship to itself. If a ship has bigger mass and is slower, make it tougher to kill. If a ship is quick and hard to hit, make it's armor/sheilds weak. This would seem to me to be a better approach since it would foster diversity in play, not end up in some space based version of everyone is a Master Rifleman/CM in composite using a T21.
And while there are details, profound details lacking in this game, I think we still need to take a step back and realize two things...it is just a game and it still is a pretty cool game. I dreamed about flying a YT when Star Wars first came out, and even though it really is nothing more than a yacht, I still love flying it.
lurdanta wrote:
First, I never said it was balanced.
Second, I was just trying to breathe a little humor into the mix.
Third, lighten up a bit, will you? I'm not arguing with you.
In fact, I agree with your point, it isn't balanced. It's a game about Star Wars where some people come to play out the dream of single-handedly defeating the Death Star. Nothing in the canon or the common suggests this game should (or could) reflect a balanced real world. It's more comic book than anything else.
I don't know, you're bumming me out...I see this kind of funny opening to point out the absurdity of things and you take it all too seriously. Yes, you are right. Yes you know more than me. Yes, you are better than me and I should just shut up.
Feel better? I hope so, for I didn't mean to bum you out, I just saw an opportunity to make a funny comment, since it is true Luke did make the mother and father of all one shot kills, which kind of is funny to consider in the middle of this debate, but come to think about it, it does point out one way the game could be balanced that isn't being considered and that is fatal flaws. If I had to point out one flaw in all the ships is there really isn't a flaw to balance out the advantage. For example, why not give the small ships a flaw like being unable to carry shields or armor? Rather than make all ships balanced to each other, which is tantamount to cutting down all the trees in the forest to two foot stumps, balance each ship to itself. If a ship has bigger mass and is slower, make it tougher to kill. If a ship is quick and hard to hit, make it's armor/sheilds weak. This would seem to me to be a better approach since it would foster diversity in play, not end up in some space based version of everyone is a Master Rifleman/CM in composite using a T21.
And while there are details, profound details lacking in this game, I think we still need to take a step back and realize two things...it is just a game and it still is a pretty cool game. I dreamed about flying a YT when Star Wars first came out, and even though it really is nothing more than a yacht, I still love flying it.
Sorry if you took my post as directly to you. Didn't mean it that way. I didn't mean to say "I'm right, you're wrong, get back in your hole newb!"
Your attitude of "I'm playing to have fun and do it in a Star Wars based environment" is exactly what I try to do as well. I hate NERF cries, more than anything. I'm happy to see more factional armour and such around. I want to see more and more people enjoying the space game as well.
I don't want to hear from my Rebel oponents (and friends) that they are unwilling to go into Deep Space because of the "Jedi BORK Fighter". Thats my whole motivation.
So no, I'm not "right" and no, you're not wrong. Opinions are like ........ everyone has them and they all stink! LOL! Didn't mean for any of that to come off as a poke at you sir.
/bowrespectfully.
Yeah, those are the numbers. But I'm telling you my impressions, I realize my impression doesn't match what has been stated, and I feel like an idiot posting this. But to me, it feels like a dunelizard, not a Tie Adv.
Kirsha
You're new from the looks of it, never... NEVER let yourself feel like an idiot posting your observations. Most the opinions in here are coming from people who have multiple ace badges and have spent most waking moments in space since JTL launched. We have pre-nerf components, high end gear, and a lot of experience.
It's very possible that with your current gear it may feel sluggish, but if I gave you a high-end re-engineered cert8 engine.. you'd see the difference.
/salute
Nope, not new, I'm not exactly a veteran either, but I have gotten 4444 imperial, and master rebel, so I know a little. I use the reward engine on all my fighters, I've gotten like 4 of those now (multiple characters, mutliple professions).
Kirsha
Hi all!
Just to add my opinion here... i also think that this new ships are way overpowered and makes old ships worthless. I'm allready crying for my Tie Advanced... so many hours invested in tuning him up... snifff 
Message Edited by Joint_Maker on 05-16-2005 05:43 PM
The awing was designed to be the best SF in the galaxy. Not the JSF. But even the awing is balanced. It can be hit with any other ship, even though it is harder, and can be brought down easily with missles.