Pilot Archive
Thread: ROTW ships: How would you correct them?
Heh, I've been thinking about this a lot, especially in terms of bringing these ships on par with the original ships.
Imperial Guard Interceptor - Fix the box, obviously, and add a second weapon mount to make it superior to Actis/Belbullab. Leave the mass (maybe).
Actis/Belbullab - adjust their mass to suit the size, I think 50k and 60k respectively, since the Belbullab is slightly larger. Leave them both heavily manueverable. Possibly remove 1 gunmount.
Heavy X-Wing - Not much, just tone down the flight characteristics to match it's mass. Shouldn't fly like an agile fighter.
Vaksai - I think this one is balanced, or close anyhow.
Heavy Varients - move them to Tier 4, trim down the flight characteristics to match their increased mass.
Y-8 Umm...fix the freakin' quest. Add more turrets, limit them to asteroids. Allow the mounting of multiple turrets per location, so we can add a mining laser and a tractor beam. Increase the mass to match it's size. Dramatically decrease handling.
Attacca wrote:
Y-8 Umm...fix the freakin' quest. Add more turrets, limit them to asteroids. Allow the mounting of multiple turrets per location, so we can add a mining laser and a tractor beam. Increase the mass to match it's size. Dramatically decrease handling.
Doh, completely forgot this one. Personally, I think 5 million mass is more than enough. Even with an Elite Mining Laser and three Null Bolts with the full array of POB parts, you're still not topping it out.
Frankly, I think 5 million mass on existing combat POBs is artificially high.
Only reason I would increase the mass is you'll need room for the extra turrets - plus the thing is about three times the size of the existing POBs. At that size mass is just silly though, with REd components I don't even come close to filling my Decimator with all level 10 parts. But they are master ships, and it's fun to be able to throw anything and everythign into them without overloading the mass.
The big thing is the handling needs to be severely reduced - if I'm remembering right that thing flies real nice, much better than my combat rigged Decimator. It should be a big slow mining ship, that needs an escort...or something. If POBs ever get their retuning then this will be the one we see in combat the most, since it flies like a fighter.
Unless my memory is bad, in which case...disregard that.
JanuHull wrote:Well, we've b*tched and moaned enough. How would you change them? What would make them "balanced" in your opinion? Lets run this under the "rational" assumption that we're bringing the new ships into line with the old.I'm only commenting myself on ships I've faced personally.Imperial Guard Interceptor: Fix the hitbox locationActis-2: Reduce mass to 60k. I can live with it being small, I can live with it having top performance maneuverability, but having 50% more mass than a ship its 33% smaller than, doesn't fit logic or gameplay balance. Reduce weapons load out to one gun.Bel-22: Same as the Actis.Advanced X-Wing: Reduce mass to 140k or worsen flight performance to match its enhanced mass. 180k puts it entirely too close to a B-Wing's level of loadout with a space superiority level of performance.
Unfortunately they can't be 'fixed' in a way that's fair and who really want the 'Pre-Nerf' item inflation you see on some ground items. The only viable option is to re-vamp the existing ships especially the tier 4 ships that are suppose to be equal or better than these ships. PVE content will likely need a boost to keep up. Personally I think it's the heavy varients like the Z-95 that are making pilot too easy. The tier 4 ships are out of balance but as far as PvE is concerned I don't think they make that much of a difference for a 4333 pilot. PvP is more about the pilot and the loadout than the ship anyway. What would be nice would be to see some parts that could only be equiped on certain ships like the "Elite" Items for POB ships. Like an "Elite A-wing Sensor Jammer" or and "Bomber targeting computer" for TIE bombers, Y-wings, B-wings, and Oppressors that allow even faster targeting locks.
DarthGorilla wrote:
JanuHull wrote:
Well, we've b*tched and moaned enough. How would you change them? What would make them "balanced" in your opinion? Lets run this under the "rational" assumption that we're bringing the new ships into line with the old.
I'm only commenting myself on ships I've faced personally.
Imperial Guard Interceptor: Fix the hitbox location
Actis-2: Reduce mass to 60k. I can live with it being small, I can live with it having top performance maneuverability, but having 50% more mass than a ship its 33% smaller than, doesn't fit logic or gameplay balance. Reduce weapons load out to one gun.
Bel-22: Same as the Actis.
Advanced X-Wing: Reduce mass to 140k or worsen flight performance to match its enhanced mass. 180k puts it entirely too close to a B-Wing's level of loadout with a space superiority level of performance.
Unfortunately they can't be 'fixed' in a way that's fair and who really want the 'Pre-Nerf' item inflation you see on some ground items. The only viable option is to re-vamp the existing ships especially the tier 4 ships that are suppose to be equal or better than these ships. PVE content will likely need a boost to keep up. Personally I think it's the heavy varients like the Z-95 that are making pilot too easy. The tier 4 ships are out of balance but as far as PvE is concerned I don't think they make that much of a difference for a 4333 pilot. PvP is more about the pilot and the loadout than the ship anyway. What would be nice would be to see some parts that could only be equiped on certain ships like the "Elite" Items for POB ships. Like an "Elite A-wing Sensor Jammer" or and "Bomber targeting computer" for TIE bombers, Y-wings, B-wings, and Oppressors that allow even faster targeting locks.
The recent change in the KSF exploited component bugs tells me that retroactive fixes aren't out of the question. They'll HAVE to be retroactive if they're going to fix the Y-8 and add turrets, or those of us with "pre-nerf" Y-8s will be up in arms.
DarthGorilla wrote:
Unfortunately they can't be 'fixed' in a way that's fair and who really want the 'Pre-Nerf' item inflation you see on some ground items. The only viable option is to re-vamp the existing ships especially the tier 4 ships that are suppose to be equal or better than these ships.
I disagree. The advantage to all of the non-heavy novice craft is that they have identical stats. Plus, the exploited gear showed us they could not allow launches of "overloaded" ships. Beefing up all the original craft, plus PvE, to match, will actually make the game much harder on newer pilots--combat will be faster and harder-hitting than it is now, which would be extremely discouraging considering how hard we all had it the first time we did pilot.
My 2 credits on balance?
Actis/Belbullab--drop to 50k mass. Leave high maneuverability, two gunports. (At 50k mass, it's hard to squeeze two guns in.)
ARC-170--drop maneuverability, increase to 180k mass. Should handle like a Y-wing.
RGI--Fix the freakin' hitbox. Then we'll work from there. Might need a *slight* maneuverability or mass hit--after all, at this time period, the A-wing is supposed to be the ultimate trump card for high-speed interceptors.
Advanced X-wing--drop to 125kish mass and leave maneuverability alone.
Vakasi--No idea, never even ran into one in space yet. 
Probably needs a mass reduction to keep it in line.
All heavy novice ships--reduce maneuverability heavily, at least by 50%, better would be 60 or 66%. Mass reduction isn't a viable option there.
"--Michael Stackpole, RS IRC
Halyn wrote:
ARC-170--drop maneuverability, increase to 180k mass. Should handle like a Y-wing.
JanuHull wrote:
DarthGorilla wrote:
JanuHull wrote:
Well, we've b*tched and moaned enough. How would you change them? What would make them "balanced" in your opinion? Lets run this under the "rational" assumption that we're bringing the new ships into line with the old.I'm only commenting myself on ships I've faced personally.Imperial Guard Interceptor: Fix the hitbox locationActis-2: Reduce mass to 60k. I can live with it being small, I can live with it having top performance maneuverability, but having 50% more mass than a ship its 33% smaller than, doesn't fit logic or gameplay balance. Reduce weapons load out to one gun.Bel-22: Same as the Actis.Advanced X-Wing: Reduce mass to 140k or worsen flight performance to match its enhanced mass. 180k puts it entirely too close to a B-Wing's level of loadout with a space superiority level of performance.
Unfortunately they can't be 'fixed' in a way that's fair and who really want the 'Pre-Nerf' item inflation you see on some ground items. The only viable option is to re-vamp the existing ships especially the tier 4 ships that are suppose to be equal or better than these ships. PVE content will likely need a boost to keep up. Personally I think it's the heavy varients like the Z-95 that are making pilot too easy. The tier 4 ships are out of balance but as far as PvE is concerned I don't think they make that much of a difference for a 4333 pilot. PvP is more about the pilot and the loadout than the ship anyway. What would be nice would be to see some parts that could only be equiped on certain ships like the "Elite" Items for POB ships. Like an "Elite A-wing Sensor Jammer" or and "Bomber targeting computer" for TIE bombers, Y-wings, B-wings, and Oppressors that allow even faster targeting locks.
The recent change in the KSF exploited component bugs tells me that retroactive fixes aren't out of the question. They'll HAVE to be retroactive if they're going to fix the Y-8 and add turrets, or those of us with "pre-nerf" Y-8s will be up in arms.
The question isn't "Can they do it?" The question is "Should they do it?". Just changing the mass of the ships would be a simple solution but also a dull and uncreative one. They have show that they can make parts that can only be placed in certain ships as well. A-wings are suppose to have a sensor jammer that is powerful enough to mask their signature against fighters but not strong enough to mask it against larger ships. B-wings and the other bombers are suppose to have very sophisticated targeting systems. None of these are in game. I say adding them would certainly make them more viable options. Just nerfing the new ships is a dull and tired solution.
Attacca wrote:
Halyn wrote:
ARC-170--drop maneuverability, increase to 180k mass. Should handle like a Y-wing.
I KNEW I forgot one - I agree. Leave the mass though, but it should handle like it has all that mass.
Regarding the changes - they need to be retroactive to preserve PvP in any sort of viable form. Regular dogfighters will tell you now how badly these ships have changed PvP.
Heh...ARC-170 in its current form has 125k of mass. If we drop its maneuverability, it needs a mass boost. Besides, a three-person fighter should have a bit more mass to work with anyways, IMO.