Pilot Archive
Thread: No good engines fit in a fighter anymore
Page 1 of 6
NasherUK
Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:29 am
#1
Since the engine nerf, there are no good engines that can fit in a fighter, so now a heavy bomber or MP ship can outrun an A-wing/tie interceptor because it can spare the 50-70k mass for a 90+ speed engine.
We need a greater engine speed boost on all fighters so they can keep up, a 65-70 speed engine in an interceptor makes a totaly useless interceptor because you cant intercept anything....which is totaly opposite to how NPCs are
Message Edited by NasherUK on 12-03-2004 08:32 AM
1st_Viduus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:49 am
#2
Agreed, fighters are supposed to be fast, and bombers/MP ships are supposed to be slow.
Combining Class and Tier systems into one global Mass system was sillyness at best on the part of SOE, I've said as much since launch.
Either boost the speed multiplyer on the fighters *significantly, andhigher for each tier*, or revamp the system to something that makes sense.
The A-Wing for example is supposed to run TWO engines, not one, which is how it acheives the status as the "fastest ship in the GCW".
And I'm not even rebel.
Fast, light, maneuverable, but middling damage and low defenses - the definitionof a fighter.
Heavy, slow to respond, and slow & steady, but hard-hitting - the definition of a medium bomber/all purpose ship.
SLOW BRICK, but capable of taking and giving a pounding to ships 2 and 3 times her size - the definition of a Heavy Bomber, effectively our MP ships.
I would hardly say that the ships in JtL follow these guides effectively.
Craxus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:05 am
#3
1st_Viduus wrote:
Agreed, fighters are supposed to be fast, and bombers/MP ships are supposed to be slow.
Combining Class and Tier systems into one global Mass system was sillyness at best on the part of SOE, I've said as much since launch.
Either boost the speed multiplyer on the fighters *significantly, andhigher for each tier*, or revamp the system to something that makes sense.
The A-Wing for example is supposed to run TWO engines, not one, which is how it acheives the status as the "fastest ship in the GCW".
And I'm not even rebel.
Fast, light, maneuverable, but middling damage and low defenses - the definitionof a fighter.
Heavy, slow to respond, and slow & steady, but hard-hitting - the definition of a medium bomber/all purpose ship.
SLOW BRICK, but capable of taking and giving a pounding to ships 2 and 3 times her size - the definition of a Heavy Bomber, effectively our MP ships.
I would hardly say that the ships in JtL follow these guides effectively.
The Green Highlighted thing is by far the greatest thing I have ever heard. You are a genius. Serioursly I bow before you intelligences.
All they need to do to balance the light fighters is give them 2 engine slots!!!! Then you can add the speeds together for your top speed.
thecolonelcardaks
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:19 am
#4
The problem with having 2 engines, is that we can barely fit one as it is into the chassis.. I started a thread on shipwright forum with my idea for a new system, see what you think.
<a href="http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=profshipwright&message.id=10954#M10954">Click here</a>
thecolonelcardaks
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:20 am
#5
Craxus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:34 am
#6
It will work!!!
check it out.
level 1 engine
p 34.4
y 34.4
r 34.4
speed 42.5
mass 1245
level 1 engine
p 34.6
y 34.6
r 34 .6
speed 45.7
mass 1345
Combine total on the chasis is now
level 1 engine
p 69
y 69
r 69
speed 88.2
mass 2590
Aden_Nak
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:36 am
#7
Craxus wrote:
1st_Viduus wrote:Agreed, fighters are supposed to be fast, and bombers/MP ships are supposed to be slow.Combining Class and Tier systems into one global Mass system was sillyness at best on the part of SOE, I've said as much since launch.Either boost the speed multiplyer on the fighters *significantly, and higher for each tier*, or revamp the system to something that makes sense.The A-Wing for example is supposed to run TWO engines, not one, which is how it acheives the status as the "fastest ship in the GCW".And I'm not even rebel.Fast, light, maneuverable, but middling damage and low defenses - the definition of a fighter.Heavy, slow to respond, and slow & steady, but hard-hitting - the definition of a medium bomber/all purpose ship.SLOW BRICK, but capable of taking and giving a pounding to ships 2 and 3 times her size - the definition of a Heavy Bomber, effectively our MP ships.I would hardly say that the ships in JtL follow these guides effectively.The Green Highlighted thing is by far the greatest thing I have ever heard. You are a genius. Serioursly I bow before you intelligences.
All they need to do to balance the light fighters is give them 2 engine slots!!!! Then you can add the speeds together for your top speed.
Until you realize that you have no mass left for your other gear. By that figure, though, Y-Wings would have two engines, and X-Wings would have FOUR engines. The proper way to do things is to make the engine speed penalty on heavier ships go up exponentially, as opposed to applying a "base" speed reduction and leaving it at that. Clearly, that's not working, since the heavier ships are simply able to drop a huge, heavy engine in there and get insane speeds. Either that or give the "faster" ships a speed multiplier over 1.0.
Jorik
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:45 am
#8
I agree with Aden_Nak, the best way to make this more realistic is to increase the speed multiplier on the lighter ships. I worked hard to cram an 88 speed engine into my Kihraxz (with no armor I might add), and anyone with a bomber can use a 100+ speed engine that ways more than my entire ship. Interceptor pilots are probably more angry over this since they are supposed to be blindingly fast and manouverable.
1st_Viduus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 10:53 am
#9
"Gah!"
I did not mean to suggest that this should be implemented.
You are correct, implementing this with the current system would be a disaster at best. The current system was not thoroughly thought through IMO. Revamping it at this early stage would be best, but we all know that won't happen.
IF the ships were properly built by SWU standards, then:
- Engines on a ship would be part of the hull, not a component that is interchangeable
- "Customization" of engines and other static component parts would need to be achieved through "parts upgrages", making the system too complex.
- Certain weapons would never fit on certain ships
- Speed and Accel/Decel would increase/decrease as you added/removed mass from the ship
- Empire ships would NOT be customizable in any way, shape or form (property of the empire, not the pilot)
- Empire pilots would not have to pay for ships or components or ammunition
- Privateers would probably have to pay twice as much for parts and chassis', but would be able to get any ship or component available, including "rebel" and Imperial parts/chassis.
- Rebels would be like Privateers, either getting any ship in the game at greater cost and using that, or like Imperials, flying an un-modifyable "Rebel-Provided" ship, for which once again ammo, ship, and parts would be free. (repairs for imps and rebs would also be free).
- the list goes on......
As you can see, this will never happen, nor should we want it to.
HOWEVER
As previously stated, separating the TIER system from the MASS system is, IMO, a necessary change, unless SOE can figure out a way to balance Ship Classes, of which we really have 4, in such a way that customization is still possible, within the limits of a classes performance extremes.
NEVER should an 8-man multiplayer ship be faster at base speed than even the slowest fighter. Period.
The way they've got it working now, the only ships capable of drastic speeds are the very ships which are supposed to be slowest.
Craxus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:02 am
#10
You guys aren't reading it right.
LIGHT FIGHTERS WOULD HAVE 2 ENGINES!!!
is a xwing a light fighter.......no!
is a ywing a light fighter.......no!
IT would work and your keep saying that you wouldn't have any place for your other gear.
Yes you would unless you tried to stick 2 level 6 engines in or something.
If you added 2 engine slots to the LIGHT FIGHTERS you could increase the speed of them by combining 2 LOW MASS engines.
YOU would NOT HAVE TO HAVE2 engines just the ability to put 2 in.
Think about it and refer to the example I posted above.
Message Edited by Craxus on 12-03-2004 11:03 AM
1st_Viduus
Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:07 am
#11
Right, and what about TIEs? Are you proposing 2 engines on them as well? They're meant to have one, more powerful engine, but such a low mass that the acceleration is insane. Where would you put the 2nd engine? Duct-tape it under the hull?
There's reasons why 2 engines (and 4 for x-wings, as they should - can't do one and not the other) other than just "MacGuyvering" shouldn't be done.
NasherUK
Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:18 am
#12
Jorik wrote:
I agree with Aden_Nak, the best way to make this more realistic is to increase the speed multiplier on the lighter ships. I worked hard to cram an 88 speed engine into my Kihraxz (with no armor I might add), and anyone with a bomber can use a 100+ speed engine that ways more than my entire ship. Interceptor pilots are probably more angry over this since they are supposed to be blindingly fast and manouverable.
I agree with Aden_Nak to, this is the easiest and best way to do it. Like this you could use a light engine in a light ship and get the same speeds (or faster) as using a really heavyengine in a heavy ship, the only problem would be the reward/loot engines from before the nerf, but I wouldnt mind it getting wiped if they would sort out the ship speed and engine balance.
Message Edited by NasherUK on 12-03-2004 10:19 AM
BionicHamsterTurd
Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:24 am
#13
This may be a silly or redundant question, and I agree that the sw should be able 1 to craft engines that are better rounded with less mass. But my question is this. I was led to believe that if you Reverse Eng an engine for example it takes on the best stats of the components(engines) being joined. If this is the case then why arent the SW doing this? and why are we grumbling? I keep getting all kinds of loot that i keep throwing away for credits because i cant get a sw to help me out and re-eng them for me? every night i come accross some 70+ speed engine at the same time i find some other cruddy one with low mass and same tier, but i have given up with trying to get help re-eng so now i just sale them and have for the first time since galaxies was realeased im a multi millionaire!
This brings me to my second issue, if im correct about the re-eng thingy, then why are we bitching at soe? it sounds to me that our sw can make choice, fast, light engines if they worked at it? My personall opinion is that we were given the 90+ engine, then it was taken and now that type of uber loot is not dropping anymore but then all it takes is a sw if im correct to re-eng the stuff dropping to make at least a decent lightwaite engine. But I agree the need to be able to craft faster engines.
I may be wrong on all this and if so please dont flame me, Im just trying to get the best for my ship too, Im no sw, and i appoligize if i offended, but i cant get a sw to give me an answer online
Page 1 of 6