Pikeman Archive
Thread: Pikeman Concerns III
Hey guys, I'll start this thread as my last duty to the pikeman porfession, for the new correspondent to get build a base for his first message to SOE.
Before posting here, please read this msg: http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=pikeman&message.id=2077 it is the msg I sent off to SOE, so please don't bring up any of the old issues. I believe that SOE is working on them, and they shouldn't be brought up (unless they respond and don't fix what it is you are concerned about in this proffesion). Also Please read every message in this tread before writing your own. Rate the Messages you think are the biggest problem with a 5 star, and the ones that aren't as important, rate them 1-4 stars. Keep your 5 stars only for the most important, because it will help the next correspondent decide on what to report.
For those Posting, I'm adding a few changes here which may or may not be a good idea, though I know it will be better for the Correspondent. Pose your posts like this. 1)One sentance that clearly states the problem, 2)Explanation of what you believe is wrong. 3) Solution to fix the problem.
Ex.
1) HAM Costs are too high. (short and sweet)
2) The mods on the vibro weapons are too high, one does more damage to himself then the actual target. blah blah blah (you get the idea, max 1 paragraph.)
3) Lower the F***ing HAM!!! (lol, no, please be curteous to the other people on the board as well as thenew correspondent. also, one paragraph max.)
Please limit one concern per post. If you have more then one concern, then just submit the first one, then write it down in another mesage. Ok I said that twice, but some people may not have gotten it the first time. 
Khrim...
The rest of the post below is a run-down of skill costs associated with my opinion of what a successful pikeman is based on my own experience and what professions the people on this forum have taken.
Feel free to skip to the end if you don't want the details
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Master Pikeman costs 92 (pikeman tree 63 + novice brawler and polearm line 29).
This leaves 158 points, not bad. However, here's some fairly essential skills that go along with pikeman:
If you want to PVP as a pikeman, you have to get master brawler. Lunge2 is a must with the current system. Plus, intimidate2 allows you to actually take some hits from high end NPCs and creatures that hit for over 1k normally. The rest of the brawler tree is 48 points.
110 Left.
Medic at some level - you really need to be able to heal yourself to solo successfully or stay alive in groups (unless you have a dedicated medic assigned to you). If you buy stims from someone else and go with a bare minimum of healing skills (first aid), then you can get by with 20 points here. Most people get at least First Aid II and Organic II so they can make Stim B's and the basic woundpacks. Lets just say 25 for now.
85 Left.
Scout - you have to have at least novice scout and exploration I. If you don't have that terrain negotiation bonus you will get screwed 90% of the time something tries to kite you because of all the hills in this game, not to mention in PVP. Most people choose to get exploration III but you can get by with I. That's 17 points.
68Left. This is not enough to take on any hybrid profession. At best you can pick up a small amount of another elite profession(max medic and get a little ways into doctor, do the same with scout/ranger/CH, or pick up another elite brawling profession). Combat medic, squad leader, commando, smuggler, and bounty hunter all require MARKSMAN. Some of those professions require unarmed combat, but none of them even use any brawling skills once you get into them. Where are the hybrid pikeman professions?
I would love to have been a combat medic, but master pikeman, master medic, master brawler, and master ranged support in marksman = 246 skill points. No dice. Squad leader would let you pick up novice with 249 skill points used, but what's the point, really? Sending system messages to group, woo! Commando is based around class specific weapons, so it shouldn't go with pikeman, and I can see the reasoning that smugglers use small concealable weapons and fists. Bounty hunting is a tactical type of profession, so having a mix of weapons makes sense, but why does that mix include only ranged weapons?
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Ranged weapon users get hybrid combat and supportprofessions that complement their skills. Pikemen and the other elite brawlers do not.
The solution thenis to either change requirements to be more flexible with some of the support based professions or to add new hybrid professions that are attainable by pikeman.
1.Holocron recently proposed these changes in the SWG discussion forum
- increased penalty for firing while moving
- increased defensive bonuses for moving targets
- Added 30 second timer to knockdown/posture changes
- Decreased the cost of ALL knockdown moves
- Increased the damage on all knockdown moves to compensate for 30 second timer
The 30 second timer will totally FUBAR the pikeman profession and melee vs range in general in pvp , why? Hit 3 makes our enemies posture down meaning we will be thebe the only melee class with a timer on our most damaging move. And I dont know about you guys but the only way I have EVER won againstsomeone usingranged without them saying "I wont move" beforehand is with several applications of lunge 1 & kd because as soon as they start moving again you get that wonderful "Your target is out of range" message so what if they have a bigger penalty to shoot you & you have better bonuses when moving your only going to be able to hit them once with it and they're will be back on their feet almost instantly & back to kiting you for for 28 seconds. Master brawlers will be much better offthough lunge 2 will circumvent this sinceit kd's and you can actually get some hits in before they're target is back up again.
2. I saw this in the strat guide so I dont know if the person making it was misinformed or not but every single melee class except polearms Hit 3 dmg modifier is x4 we have x3 it is the same thing with swordsmen & fencers Headhit 3 & Bodyhit 3 dmg= x4 Leghit = x3.
3. Small thing this time, I like to travel incognito (No title) but every few hours it resets back to "Master Pikeman" I'd like to know if anyone else is having the same problem since I'm the only master on my server currently (though probably not for much longer).
about the title sticking.. ya, it is a hastle, when you log off, it will bring you back on as your last announced title. That is why I switch it to something like Novice Musician or something when I log off, so that it will display that instead of Master Pikeman. Also when the title "comes back" after an hour or two, it will go to that instead of the Master Pikeman one. That is all I can tell you, and I have sent a /bug report in about it... just have seen no response.
Khrim...
Oh yeah!
The offensive polearm technique branch of the pikeman tree has two area attacks, both seeming worse than all the other area attacks we have, such as spin attack, sweep 2, stun 2, because it does less damage and inflicts no states such as dizziness or stun to the targets. These two area 1 and 2 attacks in the offensive branch should be removed and replaced by either some offensive skill mod that increases damage (heh heh) or some other attack... I'm sure the first suggestion won't even be considered. Perhaps they could make an attack that blinds or something.
Please make it so we are removed from the radar screen as we get higher up the skill tree. There is no possible way at this point, to sneak attack. (Our primary tactic as a melee)
Also, make it so those wimpy shooter types can't shoot us through walls. We can't avoid fire, and that's silly.
Keto jax,
Flurry
Kolby voiced my first and main concern, here's my second.
Someone PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE fix the resource shift on Starsider. I've been playing a pikeman since day one of retail and to this day NO ONE can make any pikeman cert'd weapons above lance. I seriously am ready to go switch to 2-h simply because I've been using the same weapon for the last month to month-and-a-half. Yes there are loot versions, but as any one knows they flat out SUCK compared to a tweaked and crafted standard lance. If I had any clue it was going to be 2+ months before I could use a pikeman weapon I probably would've dumped it long ago.
It's effective in making you a slightly better brawler (though I suspect a lot more defensive skills are currently broken than just block) but it doesn't let you get out of that niche. I'm not saying I want to be something other than a master pikeman with support abilities, but I would like to haveeven half the options with support abilities that ranged specialists do.
Add/modify hybrid support professions please!
OpethRebel wrote:
About the inability to dabble as brawler: My current plan is Master pike, Master brawler, novice scout with 3 explore, novice medic with 4/0/4/0, novice swordsman with 0/0/4/0, and novice TKA with 0/0/0/4. Melee dabbling ends up being quite effective. And if the combat xp in TKA is too intimidating (though I'll get it without ever touching a VK), you could also get fencer footwork branch instead for the insane posture and knockdown defense (not to mention the dodging).
72 melee def, 60 ranged def, 25 block, 15 counterattack, awesome de-buff defenses...think about it.
Wow thats almsot the exact same thing that i was planning on doing, except for me im fencer im getting meditate and probly a little more in medic here and there.
OpethRebel wrote:"in polearm you get less toughness than the other skills. I know this has been brought up officially already and they are looking into it, but its something that should be fixed or changed."
We get less toughness because we have better, stronger attacks. You can get more toughness by using skill enhancers. As far as I'm aware there is no skill enhancer that gives fencers area knockdown
polearm in the brawler line doesn't get area knockdown either. Which is where the lower level of toughness is. You can't say because polearm at the top of the elite class gets area knockdown that you should penalize someone who isn't even going that high.
This is not a pikeman specific problem, but PLEASE put this as your correspondant pet peeve:the wookiee innate ability "wookiee roar" is broken. I fail almost 100% of the time with it, the only reason I use it now is to check if maybe they fixed it.
Not once have Iseenany other race fail their innate abilities.