Pikeman Archive
Thread: Pikeman CU Role
Rodian-Bob
Fri Apr 01, 2005 11:45 am
#66
Hmm. Perhaps I'll give Pikeman a chance after the CU and see how it fits. I pictured Crowd Control as the EQ Enchanter Class with mezmerize and such. If I can still lay out 8 guys at once, that's something...
Gunman21 wrote:
Rodian-Bob wrote:
Personally I have no interest in this role. My favorite thing about Doc/Pikeman is Spin or Area Attack, downing like10 Stormtroopers at once. I realize this action has no place in the CU. But Crowd Control? Defense? These were never part of what I like about Pikes.
Sounds like Swordsman is more my style now. I used to like being a Crafting Doctor, but that just isn't possible anymore, not combined with an Elite Combat profession...
Area Attacks and Knockdowns are forms of crowd control
-Bob is Robii D'Luminatii
Rimy
Fri Apr 01, 2005 11:54 am
#67
Rodian-Bob wrote:
But Crowd Control? Defense? These were never part of what I like about Pikes.
It's a shame you're not on Valyn... I'd have just traded you weapons and we could keep our respective roles
Iridescence
Fri Apr 01, 2005 12:10 pm
#68
Gunman21 wrote:
Rodian-Bob wrote:Personally I have no interest in this role. My favorite thing about Doc/Pikeman is Spin or Area Attack, downing like10 Stormtroopers at once. I realize this action has no place in the CU. But Crowd Control? Defense? These were never part of what I like about Pikes.
Sounds like Swordsman is more my style now. I used to like being a Crafting Doctor, but that just isn't possible anymore, not combined with an Elite Combat profession...
Area Attacks and Knockdowns are forms of crowd control
Exactly. With the exception of adding more defense (something complained about CONSTANTLY on these forums), I don't see how things will be any different with Pikeman than they are now. We already do the best area attacks in the game, only other profession to get an area knockdown is carbineer, and theirs sucks. "Crowd control" to me means applying states and posture changes and etc to a wide area around us with each attack. Someone explain to me how thats different than what we already do. And about damage, how much damage do the rest of you guys do against a (current) defense-stacked fencer using an 800-max LVA? It's ridiculous. Like 200 damage if we aren't intimidated and spamming Hit3, assume we can even hit the b*stard. If anything, I bet our offense will be *better* after the CU.
The only one in this thread who is likely to have any IDEA what Pikeman will truly be like after the CU hits is Gunman. Notice how he's trying to defend it. Form your own conclusions.
pagoa
Sun Apr 03, 2005 12:06 am
#69
hmm, this role might not be bad at all. i'm thinking we'll be able to hold our own defensively making for nice long battles, and even be able to hold our own against multiple targets, but we wont be able to own with those high damage uber pikes and dots like we used to. good, that's the whole point to an upgrade. no prof should dominate in anyway. i think this will be cool, provided the deves don't allow uberness to sneak in. if i have a defencive role, and some toon comes with their uber weapon they looted and ownes me, i'm gonna be very very angry. lets eliminate uberness once and for all and get into some nice long strategic fights!!
butterflykiller
Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:32 pm
#70
The main thing I think everyone nobody sees here is these are generalized values. Have you guys noticed that all profs were given nine points each that were then distributed to each of the three categories. Probably the only reason the devs even posted this stuff before testing it is the fact that the entire SWG community was screaming at them to tell them SOMETHING.
Secondly, my thoughts on the entire CU as a whole is that it is great (besides the fact that from what I hear Jedi get screwed). I always wanted to be a PvPer and even though I am a half NOOB (4001 pikes) it looks like after the CU I might stand a chance on something besides the random uber NOOB's that spawn in Tyrena with their droids still following them. Also the fact thatthe devsare (in your opinion) srewing you over in one area is OK because have you noticed all profs are screaming this in their forums to some degree. So what that now you can't be a damage dealer, now you can take out 10 people at the same time slower per kill instead of focusing on hitting one guy at a time which for me usually ends up being slower. My big problem is the removal of buffs (the doc post are confusing and thats what I am getting from them, please tell me if I'm wrong) because at my level, I can't grind on anything with signifigant exp (i.e. quenkers) without a buff.
Please comment if you see anything on this that you have problem with or something that I said that was wrong.
Iridescence
Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:57 pm
#71
Docs still give buffs, but its something more like 20% of your health/action added on instead of a set number. This would give a new player 1200 Health/action instead of 1000 and a Master profession 3600 instead of 3000 (assuming 20% is the number, I don't remember exactly).
I think this is *great.* Screw buffs, I've hated the idea of them since I even knew they existed. It sounds to me now that they are being reduced somewhat in their required-ness for combat. Entering combat without them will be common I bet, but you will still WANT to have them.
Dont worry about grinding as a noob. When you're a Novice you have 1000 HAM to start with and everything will theoretically be balanced to that. As you gain levels your HAM will increase. As a 0002 Brawler on TC I think I'm up to 1050 HAM. So by Novice Pikeman you could probably be in the 1200-range, making no assumptions about how much you gain per level.
I think this is *great.* Screw buffs, I've hated the idea of them since I even knew they existed. It sounds to me now that they are being reduced somewhat in their required-ness for combat. Entering combat without them will be common I bet, but you will still WANT to have them.
Dont worry about grinding as a noob. When you're a Novice you have 1000 HAM to start with and everything will theoretically be balanced to that. As you gain levels your HAM will increase. As a 0002 Brawler on TC I think I'm up to 1050 HAM. So by Novice Pikeman you could probably be in the 1200-range, making no assumptions about how much you gain per level.
Message Edited by Iridescence on 04-05-2005 05:58 PM
deadsith6666
Wed Apr 06, 2005 10:27 am
#73
I have built my template around too major combat areas. Pikeman and TK most of the time you will find me with a pike but i occasionally pull out the knuckler. OK, this is what i have found out about combat as a Pikeman dealing damage is not what wins me my PVP matches I use my Night Sister looted LVA and this is not a DOT weapon it is just a really good damage with a great speed bonus and speed mod on it.
Plus 9 to polearm speed
Plus 15 to terrain negotiation
And some other skill that is broken
Speed-3.9
MIn. damage-96
Max. damage-456
I do not use damage to win PVPI useSTOPPING AND STATUS MOVES. I hear alot about rifleman andswoedsman well i know that a swordsman has a hard time hitting me when he is intimidated 2, stunned 2, dizzy, and knockeddown, lol ROFL. And secondly a rifleman who can not get a shot off cause he can not get up is a very very funny site, lol.
The way i feel abou this is that if pikeman did damage like the swords or rifles the game would be unfair. So if i have to choose between damage andALL THE WONDERFUL STATUS MOVES I HAVE NOWI PICK STATUS MOVES. If i wanna do massive damage I will go rifleman or swordsman. I LOVE MY PIKE. well i guess that is all i wanted ot say on this subject, oh and have you ever fought a krayt as aPikeman. Well if you are the second tank there your lunge 2 will actually knock the krayt down about every 10 hits or so. SO THESE SKILLS ARE VERY AFFECTIVE.
I guess what i am saying is leave the devs alone about PIKEMAN before half of the Pikeman skills end up broken like pistols or somethin.
Thank you,
POKE
OH AND ALL YOU OUT THERE THAT HATE STACKING,
GUESS WHAT THAT IS HOW YOU PLAY
WHAT DO YOU THINK A BH, PISTOLEER IS OR A BH, CARBINEER OR A FENCER, PISTOLEER THEY ARE DAMAGE STACKERS
I AM A DEFENCE STACKER SO WHAT.
BUILD A TEMPLATE THAT LETS YOU STACK OR HECK JUST BUILD YOUR OWN TEMPLATE INSTEAD OF COPYING SOME ONE ELSE.
IF YOU ILIMINATE STACKING THAN GUESS WHAT EVERYONE WILL BE THE SAME IS THAT WHAT YOU ALL WANT?
AND PVP WILL TURN INTO A LUCK OR CHANCE WIN AND PVE WILL BECOMNE IMPOSSIBLE.
I LOVE GROUP HUNTING BUT COME ON.
EVERYONE NEEDS TO SOLO OCCASIONALLY.
MASTER BRAWLER
MASTER PIKEMAN
MASTER TK
3440 FENCER
MASTER PIKEMAN
MASTER TK
3440 FENCER
Message Edited by deadsith6666 on 04-06-2005 10:41 AM
Message Edited by deadsith6666 on 04-06-2005 10:42 AM
Iridescence
Wed Apr 13, 2005 9:32 am
#75
Pikes/Swords and Pikes/Fencer are both expected to be great templates.
Gunman21
Wed Apr 13, 2005 11:06 am
#76
Expected to be an are...are two totally different things 
But yes, pike/swords and pike/fencer are expected to be good templates. The downfall of this template is range, though, and range is much more profound in the CU than on live. It also lacks slightly on the crowd control side, but not too badly. They're both all around good templates for melee specilization.
RPMayhem
Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:34 am
#77
I'm looking forward to this. I'm curious how well pike/tka will be able to tank. I don't have time to work on both on TCEP3, so I'm just working on pike for now. The other thing I'm really curious about is a pike/ranged mix. I know that ranged has changed, but now that we can cross use other melee specials if we take pike/othermelee, it seems like a nice bonus versus not sharing specials as a melee/range template. For example...pike/commando sounds fun. Fun commando is sorta a "power up" profession. They give good specials to other ranged profs to use, plus the new commando weapons...as a pike/commando, the commando abilities won't "power up" my pike.
I guess I'll just have to mess around more on TC.
Also, I can't verify it right now and I'm curious. Is pike the only prof that gets warcry and intimidate?
PS - Gunman...afk'taining on TC? *shakes head and walks away*
I guess I'll just have to mess around more on TC.
Also, I can't verify it right now and I'm curious. Is pike the only prof that gets warcry and intimidate?
PS - Gunman...afk'taining on TC? *shakes head and walks away*
Message Edited by RPMayhem on 04-14-2005 12:36 PM
Iridescence
Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:46 am
#78
Gunman21 wrote:Expected to be an are...are two totally different thingsBut yes, pike/swords and pike/fencer are expected to be good templates. The downfall of this template is range, though, and range is much more profound in the CU than on live. It also lacks slightly on the crowd control side, but not too badly. They're both all around good templates for melee specilization.
Well yeah, range could be an issue. But ranged weapons now slow down the movement of the person equipping them somewhat, so kiting might not be as effective. Also, we get Lunge again, which is still an extended range Knockdown. We're very well equipped to deal with the armor that most ranged professions will be wearing.
Message Edited by Iridescence on 04-14-2005 12:46 PM