Pikeman Archive

Hit3 has been a big issue for Pikemen for quite some time.

The implication was always that they received a x3 mod where other professions received a x4 mod and that (as delay was never mentioned) this implied that they were doing 33% less damage.

In fact, however, we see that the margin is much slimmer.

As posted in the other thread:

Sworsmen Hit3 Damage Mod -- x4
Swordsmen Hit3 Delay Mod -- x3.25
Swordsmen Hit3 DPS Mod -- x4/x3.25 = x1.22

Pikemen Hit3 Damage Mod -- x3
Pikemen Hit3 Delay Mod -- x2.5
Pikemen Hit3 DPS Mod -- x4/x3.25 = x1.20

Instead of losing out on 33% damage, Pikemen are losing out on 1.8% damage. As has also been pointed out, Swordsmen wish to be primarily damage dealers.

Polling data suggests that Pikemen wish to:

a) have crowd control abilities
b) have better defense

I would suggest asking for these abilities in the combat rebalance (and I think that I can see that these are plausible and possible goals to strive for). If Pikemen wish to sacrifice more damage for these things then they should certainly have better defense then Swordsmen (something which currently is definitely not true) and/or some very useful crowd control abilities that give them a powerful in-game role.

I am sorry StGabriel, but you each time I read another of your replies, you seem more and more of a deceiver and a conniver. Here is a perfect example of what I am talking about:

As far as I am concerned, you just stated your agenda and interest in Pikemen's affairs here very clearly. Youstated "Swordsmen wish to be primarily damage dealers".

Then you attempt to persuade the Pikemen from that goal themselves by telling them "a) have crowd control abilities b) have better defense I would suggest asking for these abilities in the combat rebalance (and I think that I can see that these are plausible and possible goals to strive for). If Pikemen wish to sacrifice more damage for these things"

Wouldn't that work out perfectly for the Swordsmen who by your own words, "wish to be primarily damage dealers"?

You must admit, if your goal was to make Swordsman the most damage dealing profession, this would be the way to do it.

A wise man once said- Keep your friends closebut your enemies closer...

I'm just going by this:

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=pikeman&message.id=16863

AND

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=swordsman&message.id=18612

You'll find similar stuff in the In Concept threads.

Of course if Swordsmen want to be damage dealers and if Pikemen want to be less so then it makes sense to say what I said. If the Pikemen vision is of more balanced offense/defense with crowd control and the Swordsmen is of high damage at all costs then I fail to see how it would be a balance problem if/when Swordsmen indeed had slightly higher damage output.

Yep that was sadly insightful Immoral....

And I wish Piekman was high damage personally...

But to be honest I'd rather have a defined role as a defensive crowd controlling tank and let the glory of Insane damage dealing go to the swordsman than to leave either with no true role as they currently are - as someone posted earlier today, we know what thats like and I don't wish that on anybody.

If we took the Max Damage role swordsman would be absolutely screwed...so StGabriel fine I say let the Swordman swing for insane damage and let us play a more defensive, anti-group role with some special area attacks....thats what I consider a compromise.

Now we're getting somewhere this is good...the other thread should just be abandoned

Laetitia

---

StGabriel wrote:
Hit3 has been a big issue for Pikemen for quite some time.

Sworsmen Hit3 Damage Mod -- x4
Swordsmen Hit3 Delay Mod -- x3.25
Swordsmen Hit3 DPS Mod -- x4/x3.25 = x1.22

Pikemen Hit3 Damage Mod -- x3
Pikemen Hit3 Delay Mod -- x2.5
Pikemen Hit3 DPS Mod -- x4/x3.25 = x1.20

Instead of losing out on 33% damage, Pikemen are losing out on 1.8% damage. As has also been pointed out, Swordsmen wish to be primarily damage dealers.

Polling data suggests that Pikemen wish to:

a) have crowd control abilities
b) have better defense

---

So, lets leave the math at the door for a moment.

Pikemen carry what is arguably the heaviest, edged weapon, in the melee arsenal (LVA). Added to the mix is the vibro enhancement, which make it supposedly able to part metal like it were paper. (Read that somewhere, about using it to gain entry into boarded starships). Based on that alone, Pikemen should hit the hardest when using their best attack move. While I cant quite recall the fencer or swordsman move for hit3, ours ends with the Pikeman jumping in the air and bringing the axe down on top of the opponents head. This usually results in a posture change. What it should result in is brains all over your new crafters apron.

Math be damned, Physics should rule here. I want some splatter.

---

Math be damned, Physics should rule here. I want some splatter.

---

I agree 100% but I'm willing to concede the damage crown for some good defensive capabilities, which Pikemen would naturally excel at (long reach, sweeping attacks keeping opponents on their back, overhead blocking, etc.). Unfortunately, you can't have it both ways.

Since we can't have both, and Swordsmen are already the high-damage dealers, it [i]should[/i] (emphasis here) be pie to buff up our defenses and move us up into the role of hardiest melee class. Since everyone in the poll seems to think we should be tanks (and we should, don't get me wrong) we need defensive mods out the yin-yang so that we can sit in the middle of a pack of angry rancors, take aggro, and absorb licks not only for ourselves but the rest of our group as well.

That's about what we do now but these changes would give our role more definition and would most likely incite less riot from our melee brethern about upsetting the status quo when it comes to combat roles.

Fencer = Defense, Swordsman = much DMG, but Pikeman = Area Attacks?????? kidding? The Swordsman Area Attacks are much better than from Pikeman.....

---

BackBite wrote:

we need defensive mods out the yin-yang so that we can sit in the middle of a pack of angry rancors, take aggro, and absorb licks not only for ourselves but the rest of our group as well.

---

It's interesting that everthing old is new again. I'm pretty sure if one was to scroll through the past posts, they would find all these same thoughts, perhaps with less math. I know Antares and I have both posted on the idea of the dual pikeman. One who could be defensive or offensive depending on which weapon was equipped.

To tweak the statement above: I would rather have pikemen avoid the licks, as opposed to absorbing the licks. Anyone can get the 90% comp, buffs, etc and just stand there and take the hits. Even if such awesome defense comes at the cost of no offense. Equip a staff (for example) and block, dodge and redirect nearly all incoming attacks. Equip a LVA and start smashing things. We can't have it all, but maybe we can do it all, just not at the same time.

---

Immoral wrote:

Has this changed recently? Because I did some pretty extensive testing of Swordsman damage/delay mods of my own about a month ago and I can assure you it was a x3 delay mod. Just as it is currently stated on so many websites.

Where do you get yourx3.25 delay modfrom? Personal testing or some sort of inside developer information?

BTW - I have been a correspondent myself in the past. Not that that holds any clout in SWG.

---

Just curios... once your speed is as high as it needs to be (between 92 - 100, depending on the issue), does the delay matter anymore..?