Pikeman Archive

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LordSerevok wrote:

dev: The numbers and skills got out of wack. The problem with this class is this, if we give more defense to pikemen as they are supposed to have then we would be forced to keep balance and lower tka's defense and others classes defenses.

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That's one pathetic excuse. There's no balance to keep. Improving us even without taking away from TKAs and others would move the game towards more balance, not less.

Frankly, the whole thing baffles me. All the in-game desciptions of pikemen characterize us as hard-hitting and area attacking (therefore crowd control). Nowhere is it mentioned that we should be high-defense. We were given the block defense, which intentionally makes us take more damage than everyone else. We have laughable toughness, poor melee and ranged defense, and mediocre state defenses. None of that makes me think there was ever any intention to make us good defensively. Numbers going ouf of whack is one thing, consistently giving us terrible defenses is quite another.

Of course, in order to be effective crowd controllers we need to have some ability to tank. We should have a lot of things attacking us and therefore we need to be able to absorb that damage. So crowd control and tanking aren't mutually exclusive, but just switching our role to the one fencers currently occupy would be a poor excuse for a fix in my opinion.

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LordSerevok wrote:

oh yea annelido the devs preety much said that the problem with combat medics dots are not with the class but with the ways to counter act it so they are more then likly gonna add doctor specials to area cure not nerf dots, that question came up a lot of times. The guy preety much in charge of the combat revamp said this, but the bugs with thorwing 90 meters and all those others are gonna be fixed.

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Interesting to know. This would be a welcome change for large-scale battles, but in my eyes it doesn't fix the core problem of DoTs being a vastly more effective way to deal damage than any other method of attack. Now, if they fix that issue in another way I have nothing to complain about. It'll be interesting to see how it all turns out.

In the meantime, I stand by my sig

You bring up a good point about not being able to improve us without dropping others due to template stacking. I'd imagine that is what they were thinking of. I'd argue that at least improving our toughness (even just replacing those brawler-level 4's with the 10's every other class gets) would be a nice easy fix to hold us over, and not at all unbalancing. But it's a moot point, they'll wait until the combat balance regardless.

Thanks for all this info, by the way.

This is odd, since what this dev said we should be is exactly what we are not. I very much hope they actually read some of the forums, talk to some of us and pay attention to what we want the profession to be like. Dialogue is the name of the game, not a 1-person decision.

antares
master pikeman

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Gunman21 wrote:

tanks don't fit us. We're currently the least defensive melee profession and they want to turn us into the most defensive? sorry that just doesn't fit.

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lol, since when have fencers ever (historically) been tanks. They were part of the main force, part of the infantry and cavalry.

Pikemen were front line, holding off the enemy giving the main force time to out flank, out manouvior. Pikemen were the tanks.

It's even what we asked for just a few months back. Remember Gunman's poll? The majority posted they wanted to have high defences, slow attacks and holding/pinning the enemy (i.e. crowd control). Correct me if I'm wrong, but that defines a tank.

Message Edited by Kasteu on 06-07-2004 08:39 AM

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Kasteu wrote:
lol, since when have fencers ever (historically) been tanks. They were part of the main force, part of the infantry and cavalry.

Pikemen were front line, holding off the enemy giving the main force time to out flank, out manouvior. Pikemen were the tanks.

It's even what we asked for just a few months back. Remember Gunman's poll? The majority posted they wanted to have high defences, slow attacks and holding/pin the enemy (i.e. crowd control). Correctly me if I'm wrong, but that defines a tank.

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Don't care what everyone else says, Pikeman are tankers, just like PoleArmsmen in DAOC, we take the damage.

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kparton wrote:

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Kasteu wrote:
lol, since when have fencers ever (historically) been tanks. They were part of the main force, part of the infantry and cavalry.

Pikemen were front line, holding off the enemy giving the main force time to out flank, out manouvior. Pikemen were the tanks.

It's even what we asked for just a few months back. Remember Gunman's poll? The majority posted they wanted to have high defences, slow attacks and holding/pin the enemy (i.e. crowd control). Correctly me if I'm wrong, but that defines a tank.

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Don't care what everyone else says, Pikeman are tankers, just like PoleArmsmen in DAOC, we take the damage.

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I think what most people are saying is that, currently Pikeman can not tank as well as some of the other brawler proffessions, ie Fencer. Now if they should or not would be a different debate, but I know as a guy that has mastered all melee proffesions, pikeman are not currently the king tanks in the game.

Yeah, I've done them all too. I've also dabbled, with pikeman being my primary profession. Once we get the defences, no way can we retain one of either the speed or damage output. Although I would like to see the one being sacrificed based on what weapon we hold, which is pretty much how swordsmen currently works (i.e. swords lower damage but fast, power hammer, high damage with slow speed). With high defences (through dabbling) we can currently out damage any profession in a one vs many situation and tank until our hearts content.

This isn't about now though, this is about what is being done and what was asked to be done. Looks like the Devs are taking into account dabbing in the combat balance too.

just a thought...if theyre nerfing bufs and armours....what we suposed to tank with?

swodsman are the damaging...ok only cuz they have a bix axe, and how come thery more damaging it suposely by combat revanp (i read this somewere, thin in riffle forum) were considered heavy therefor we will hit slowler (like riffleman will fire sleower) then swords

not my opinion - we was screwd already, we gonna be screwed all over again....tanks my ass

just a thought...if theyre nerfing bufs and armours....what we suposed to tank with?

swodsman are the damaging...ok only cuz they have a bix hammer, and how come thery more damaging it suposely by combat revanp (i read this somewere, thin in riffle forum) were considered heavy therefor we will hit slowler (like riffleman will fire sleower) then swords

not my opinion - we was screwd already, we gonna be screwed all over again....tanks my ass