Pikeman Archive

Have been over on TC-5 for a while and decided to get an NSEL from the frogs. When I saw the damage levels my jaw dropped. it was about 400-700 damage with an elemtnal damage(forgot which) and has a DPS of around 250. It is just about in line with the best of the swordsman tk and rifle weapons(dont know if it's in line with other profesions havent tested them yet). Just thought I'd let you all know. The only problem is it is going to be exremely difficult to aquire an NSEL, so I'm hoping that NSELs are made easier to aquire.

Message Edited by Goldenstar10 on 04-02-2005 04:04 PM

Sure you're not thinking of the normal NS lance? The NSEL I got from the frogs is 246-493 damage with 164 dps.

The normal NS lance is 393-768 damage with 261.8 dps. Identical to the Massassi lance aside from the Massassi is kinetic and the NSL is energy (plus a small wound difference).

To me, this says that the NSL will be certed at master while the NSEL stays at stances 2. I'd LOVE the NSL to be certed at master, because even post-conversion there will be far too many uber NSLs, and 80% of their owners won't be willing to master pikeman just to use them.

---

pagoa wrote:

ya i agree, and here's the problem with any super uber weapon that is hard to get, whether it ends up bein a ns lance or nsel or whatever...a few people have them and run around dominating everyone els...no fun!!!! i don't think we even need uber weapons past the master skill. lets make the best weapons available for only those who master the skill, but make them equal!! let's let skill decide who wins in pvp and not the dam weapons. if two pike masters are fighting and both have the cert for the master weapon, it would be cool if the fight ended with both hams being almost drained, not one dominating cause they happened to loot and uber weapon

---

While I absolutely agree with you, making every master pikeman equivalent wouldn't go over well with those who have bought or looted really great weapons.

The good news is that the CU should reign in the unbalanced weapons. While someone with a great LVA will still have a great LVA, that doesn't mean it'll be 5x as good as a normal LVA anymore. I don't know what it will be for sure yet, but my hope is that the best loot on any given server is no more than 1.5x as good as the best crafted weapon.

---

Goldenstar10 wrote:
Have been over on TC-5 for a while and decided to get an NSEL from the frogs. When I saw the damage levels my jaw dropped. it was about 400-700 damage with an elemtnal damage(forgot which) and has a DPS of around 250. It is just about in line with the best of the swordsman tk and rifle weapons(dont know if it's in line with other profesions havent tested them yet). Just thought I'd let you all know. The only problem is it is going to be exremely difficult to aquire an NSEL, so I'm hoping that NSELs are made easier to aquire.

Message Edited by Goldenstar10 on 04-02-2005 04:04 PM

---

even if the damage is equal to swords doesnt mean u will do the same damage as them, depends on the multipliers of the special's, which i guess is going to be low, seeing as we are going to be tanks now (guess we should buy about 10 suits of armor from the beating we are going to take)

Quoth VacaXXX,

> one thing that I think is cool is that if you dont have the cert for a weapon, you cant hold it

I personally don't think that is "cool" at all. Firstly because it doesn't make sense and reduces the suspension of disbelief. In real life I have no training with melee weapons and wouldn't last five seconds in a fight against a skilled adversary with a sword or pike in my hands but to suggest that I couldn't even pick the weapon up and hold it in front of me is absurd. Secondly from a roleplaying point of view this change removes people's ability to goof around in character. As a Fencer/Pikeman I could sometimes be seen walking around Bestine in stormtrooper armour and holding an E11 carbine. In every cantina in the galaxy you will see dancers carrying swords, axes and lances as part of their act. All this is done in the name of fun and has a negative effect on absolutely no one.

> so keep an eye on the market for Dancers selling their NSEL's cheap!!

To be honest apart from combatants casting envious glances at rich entertainers carrying loot weapons they haven't been able to obtain themselves, I can't think of anybody who stands to "gain" from the new rules.

if they make teh NSEL a common and easy weapon to get, i am going to quit...thats just stupid.

---

furrycat wrote:
Quoth VacaXXX,

> one thing that I think is cool is that if you dont have the cert for a weapon, you cant hold it

I personally don't think that is "cool" at all. Firstly because it doesn't make sense and reduces the suspension of disbelief. In real life I have no training with melee weapons and wouldn't last five seconds in a fight against a skilled adversary with a sword or pike in my hands but to suggest that I couldn't even pick the weapon up and hold it in front of me is absurd.
In real life a man can also dress in women's clothes whenever he feels like it, but the game doesn't allow that (for the most part). Is that immersion-breaking as well? There are plenty of rules the game imposes that don't make sense.

Secondly from a roleplaying point of view this change removes people's ability to goof around in character. As a Fencer/Pikeman I could sometimes be seen walking around Bestine in stormtrooper armour and holding an E11 carbine. In every cantina in the galaxy you will see dancers carrying swords, axes and lances as part of their act. All this is done in the name of fun and has a negative effect on absolutely no one.
You can still roleplay in ST armor, you'll just need to carry a CDEF carbine instead. What self-respecting Stormtrooper would walk around carrying a weapon they have no idea how to use anyway? Unless you're roleplaying the ST who cheated his way through training
Similarly, when's the last time you saw a real life dancer wielding a giant axe, sword, or staff (pole dancers aside)? That's a little immersion-breaking for me, actually. Most dancing doesn't use props. The props that are used are rarely dangerous. Give the dancers their own unique props and they won't feel the need to utilize weapons.


> so keep an eye on the market for Dancers selling their NSEL's cheap!!

To be honest apart from combatants casting envious glances at rich entertainers carrying loot weapons they haven't been able to obtain themselves, I can't think of anybody who stands to "gain" from the new rules.
NSELs are rare. Every NSEL in the hands of a dancer is one not in the hands of a pikeman. Supply is always low, demand will decrease post-CU. NSELs will be more readily available to those who can use them. It may not help us an enormous amount, but I think there's at least something to gain.

The biggest benefit I see however is much more abstract. You can make higher-level weapons much better if you can prevent lower-level players from using them at all. The VK for instance has been a problem ever since its cert was moved to novice TKA. Most people grinding Unarmed 1-4 used an uncerted VK because the benefit from it outweighed the penalty for using an uncerted weapon. With elemental and splash damage on the new weapons, it may be that the most sensible way to keep this problem from coming up in the future is to just make them unequippable. If you're going to make the weapon totallly unusable in combat without a cert so that dancers can have their props, you're better off spending that energy making some new prop objects for dancers to hold.

---