Musician Archive
Thread: Dark times and A New Hope (The Jukebox)
C'mon, you wouldn't think I'd give up on Master Musician completely, would you? 
) {Has anyone ever played "Where's Waldo"? }Message Edited by LeBob on 02-24-2005 10:51 AM
I have a guess, but I don't want to spoil anyone's fun.
LeBob wrote:
You speak' truth! ... (all except for one sentence
Very well said, Warryyr.
Message Edited by LeBob on 02-24-2005 10:51 AM
Mariki wrote:
This just plan sucks, I don't know what else to say about it.
Being a master entertainer, master musician, belonging to the oldest entertainment troupe in the galaxy, running the largest entertainers PA in the galaxy, and its hard to be positive an any way about this.
Standing in front of a jukebox and being a mimic? Thats just sad...
I'm trying to see where the hope is... I don't see it...
This is a sad sad day for the entertainment community...
Announcement next week? I have no hopes for that at all, I'm just wondering how to get through a gig tonight or the weekend... I can just imagine the mood the band will be in tonight.
I don't know how to face our guild saturday at our open house party...
Right now it is hard for me to find any kind of hope for the future in SWG as an entertainer.
The way I see it, we have all been stabbed in the back.
It does suck. There's no denying that.
But, given how long so many Entertainers have asked for insight from the Devs regarding their vision for us, or some kind of hint that we'll be getting some serious overhaul to make us the successful professions in this game we deserve to be, the fact that SOETyrant finally said "I wouldn't give up now, we have some pretty positive changes coming for all entertainers shortly. We will be posting on this sometime next week." Please note this response came 13 minutes after Ravanne's post, and it was on the first page. The Devs know how badly we're pissed off about this. SOETyrant was just waiting for one of us to say something, to let us know that that changes - positive changes - are on the way.
HOWEVER - he also said, "Live performances still have clear advantages over the jukebox btw, but not everyone can round upa band."
I think that's garbage.
If "not everyone can round up a band" then the idea is to make it easier to round up a band, not make a terminal to replace the live band. What the hell kind of MMORPG replaces a profession's role at a live event with a terminal, just because people "couldn't find a band?" That's definitely a disturbing mindset to be in - can't hook up with players, replace players with terminals. Maybe the reason people can't round up a band is because not enough people play our profession but rather BOT them and make a mockery of us AND SWG, and they've done it with impunity for over a year now.
Anyways, as far as advantages for live performances, well - we can perform anywhere, Jukeboxes can't, we can play better music (oh wait...scratch that), we add atmosphere to a party like no terminal can, we can interact with people and terminals can't (though many players seem to wish we were terminals).
There's good and bad to all of this, but positive stuff is on the way. I think our validity in this game hinges on those changes. We've got to provide the feedback and the testing to make those changes the best they can be, for all Entertainers.
Standing in front of a jukebox and being a mimic does suck. It's all pretty (expletive deleted). But, they knew how pissed off we were, and how pissed off and discouraged we are now. It's ok to feel that way. The only thing to do is try to focus on our new functionality, getting revealed to us shortly, and get ready to provide feedback and work with the Devs.
The Devs, however, need to make it very clear to us that THEY will work with US when they tell us their ideas for us. Lately, we've gotten a lot of cold shoulders...and that more than anything is what is bumming out a lot of folks - the idea that we just don't matter anymore. We do matter, and hopefully very very soon we'll see just how much we do.
Hey, if the changes suck and nothing gets done right, then quit. No big loss, except to SOE. But I've stuck it out so long that I want to at least try to make this profession what it deserves to be. And if our changes aren't positive and the Devs don't work with us, then I will quit. Because I see no point in playing this game without an Entertainer.
In the current state of Entertainers, we're at a pretty low spot, so low it will test a lot of our commitment to our professions. It's all right, we did suffer a loss today. Things do suck pretty bad right now.
But, next week just might make it all better - or at least give usa chance to make itall better.
Message Edited by Warryyr on 02-24-2005 09:21 AM
I'll be here..I'm committed. I should be committed. Ever seen the movie The Commitments?
Warryyr wrote:
It does suck. There's no denying that.
Yeah it does. But I'm confident things are going to get better soon. I think we just hit bottom.
HOWEVER - he also said, "Live performances still have clear advantages over the jukebox btw, but not everyone can round upa band."
I think that's garbage.
/agree You know..it's always struck me as kind of funny thatsome peopleare always complaining to me that they can never find musicians to play at weddings and events. Yet these same people have never, even once, asked me to play an event they were organizing, or even sent an e-mail saying they were looking for musicians. For my own wedding it was suggested that I'd have a hard time finding musicians!
We have a serious perception problem in this regard and I think this is where we should be focusing our energy right now. We obviously needed to turn on the PR gene ages ago but maybe it isn't too late now. Maybe we can ask ourselves what can be implemented to encourage players to hire entertainers and make it easier for them to do so, as well as what we can do to change this perception.
But, next week just might make it all better - or at least give usa chance to make itall better.
Message Edited by Esharra on 02-24-2005 11:47 AM
Mariki wrote:
I really need to have some hope, please give me some without that next week comment, I need it tonight.
No one can drop a Jukebox in your cantina unless they're on admin.
No one can ever take away your ability to type /startmusic or /startdance anywhere, at any time.
No one can drop a Jukebox outside, so street performances will never be affected.
You have the power to stipulate, before accepting a gig, that no jukebox be involved. No one can ever take away your ability to type /stopmusic or /stopdance and leave when a gig agreement isn't abided by.
The skills you had yesterday are the same skills you have today, and are the same skills you've had your entire Entertainer career. And positive changes to these skills may be on the way shortly.
Esharra wrote:
I'll be here..I'm committed. I should be committed. Ever seen the movie The Committments?
Warryyr wrote:
It does suck. There's no denying that.
Yeah it does. But I'm confident things are going to get better soon. I think we just hit bottom.
But, next week just might make it all better - or at least give usa chance to make itall better.
I would agree. These are trying times, indeed. Definitely just hit rock bottom.
This morning, when I saw the Publish and initially saw SOETyrant's comments, I felt about the worse I've ever felt in regards to the Entertainer's role in this game.
I was enraged.
No, you don't understand - I was enraged.
The "next week" comment, the "live performances" and "hard to round upa band" comments...I kinda blew my top.
I'm lucky I waited to post here. I made some pretty snide remarks in the Pub 13.1 Discussion Thread. Someone called me on it. Their post was deleted, as was my response to their post which basically said 1 star all you like, I don't care - my profession is dead. The mods were watchin out for people who were lashing out at our venting. Even the mods know the spot we're in. My original post was never touched, though - snide remark and all.
But, that person's comment made me step back a moment. And I realized, hey - none of this depression or anger is going to do me any good. My God, doth mine eyes deceive me? Did a Dev just reply to a Musician's post concerning a changein a Publish Discussion thread in under 15 minutes? Sure, not the best reply - but when the hell have the Devs ever provided a fully satisfactory reply to anything we've asked. I edited my response to be more productive by simply saying:
"Hear that, Devs? It's the sound of thousands of Player Music Volume sliders being set to 0."
And that, my friends, is rock bottom for Musicians.
At least SOETyrant didn't say, "Live performances still have clear advantages over the jukebox btw, but not everyone can round upa band" and leave it at that.
He could have, but he didn't. They know what they've done to us. And they better make it right, because I don't like getting so upset and distraught - I don't need any more gray hairs, dangit!!!!!
Message Edited by Warryyr on 02-24-2005 10:01 AM
Also note. This isn't rock bottom. This is just a sharp jagged rocky shelf that is crumbling the bottom is still down there. Then we can have stuff piled on top of us while we are down there.
Now I would like to post a quote but before I do I want everyone to understand that Panthu doesn't know anything that is coming up for us(if at all). But she was a very good Corr and I think she has a fairly good grasp and understanding of the Devs...
"Panthu wrote:
Many changes are coming. All of them are coming fast... including changes to Entertainer. I'm pretty sure it's all going to work out best for us and the game at large in the end, but the changes will feel drastic and rapid to many of us who have been around for a long time.
It's going to happen either way though, so it's not going to be very useful to get upset about these things. As long as the core purpose and fun behind Dancer is maintained, or even better enhanced, I'm a happy Dancer. I took up this attitude long ago and it's probably best that everyone else try to as well for sanity's sake.
The game's changing. Luckily, I think we have the staying power to survive changing with it. "
I think it pretty much sums up any changes we might have coming. We will have no input. We will not be taken into account. Our feedback will be ignored as always. We either go with what they want to do or we leave.
So bring on what ever it next week. I've been waiting for a very long time for answers on my professions and I want to know if I can quit or if I really honestly do have a reason to hope for more out of these "New and exciting playstyle/professions/grand experiments".
But I'm expecting that little rocky shelf to crumble away at any moment.
"would have been a " : / "... or more likely, I would not have responded to the OP at all.
DarkY0da wrote:
This isn't rock bottom. This is just a sharp jagged rocky shelf that is crumbling the bottom is still down there. Then we can have stuff piled on top of us while we are down there.
...
I think it pretty much sums up any changes we might have coming. We will have no input. We will not be taken into account. Our feedback will be ignored as always. We either go with what they want to do or we leave.
So bring on what ever it next week. I've been waiting for a very long time for answers on my professions and I want to know if I can quit or if I really honestly do have a reason to hope for more out of these "New and exciting playstyle/professions/grand experiments".
But I'm expecting that little rocky shelf to crumble away at any moment.
Haha, on this day, a quote like that made me feel so much better... thank you!
Your last comments word exactly what I'm thinking right now.
Before I hit those "surrender skill" buttons, I can wait another week to see a glimpse of what they have in mind.
It's all about fun, but sometimes I feel like I spent 106 skill points to be taken for a fool.
May the force be with you.
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
The Jukebox can't be used as a buff bot right? (Correct me if Im wrong) so if it can't buff people - whats the big deal with this? I'm a master musician with one of my characters and I dont see this really having a huge impact. Your going to see these things in player cantinas, etc during small events.
How many roleplaying events have you been to where a band was actually present? The ones that I saw were the high quality events put on by the great folks over at swgtales.com, etc. And I'm sure there not going to sacrifice a real band with more content, etc for a band.
When my city hits Level 3 and goes on the map, I plan on hiring a band to come help us celebrate our city launch. I dont think this jukebox is necassarily a bad thing. Especially considering on Gorath, there really aren't that many BANDS that I know of. I know of about 3 of them.
In addition, a band must be clicked on and LISTENED to by each individual player. Isn't the jukebox play automatically when someone walks in? Different uses I think. Im unsure on this one though.
Help me understand the concerns behind the jukebox - because I don't see the problems.
Thanks all!