Musician Archive
Thread: Entertainer Correspondent going to push to end AFK macroing
Are you implying that all Master Musicians are AFK macro'ers? You might want to clarify.
Well here is a fun thought for you... I am a Master Musician, and yet I still AFK macro.
I have nothing to gain from this myself as the xp does me no good, so why do I do this? Simply to help out the others around me. When am on my Nalargon I add about 15xp per tick to the people in the band with me. I have a /join in my macro so anyone who wants me in there group while I'm afk is welcome to invite me. Heck when I'm on the floor with that huge Nalargon it often helps the other band members get xp because people want to listen to me to hear what it sounds like.
Medics also love that I'm AFK when there are few people on because the get a chance to work on there healing. I don't have any words in my macro that get displayed only a few /TELLs to myself so I know what part of the macro is running that way I can stop it if need be by changed to another toolbar.
In some of the far off places that I go, when I tell everyone I have to go, they ask me to stay and be afk so they can keep getting mind heals. There are some places in this galaxy where people greatly desire a full time musician even if they are afk.
If this is a big problem to everyone, perhaps a bouncer can be installed in a cantina. If you want to kick someone out of the cantina you select "kick out" on the bouncer's radial menu and the bouncer npc sends a tell to the person you select. If that person does not reply withing say 30 to 60 seconds, they are bounced to outside the front door.
That way they are stuck out front if they are afk and don't interfere with the LIVE band. They are still able to afk but don't tread on anyone else's musical freedom.
Honestly people lets be honest here, no one is ever going to see MM/MD/MID/ME as anything other than side line profs. Why? Simple because even with out the macro there is not skill to getting to master. Let's see how does one get MM with out an AFK macro...
/flourish 1; /flourish 2; <wait for a few XP ticks>; Rinse Repeat!
Hmm same goes for Dancer and ME
Image Design
"Can I change your eye color 500 times?"; "Yes great thanks!";
And is having everyone at Master in these profs. a bad thing? NO, becauses lets face it these four profestions are meant souly to socialize this is noted in the total lack of combat abilities. Wow yeah I can see why they need to stop AFK people from earning xp it really ruins the game play....
Come on people get over it the simple fact is no mater how much you want to be proud of Mastering anything in the entertainment line it will never be a huge deal! At best if the got rid of AFK/Macros people would see a Master and just wow there is someone that has a lot of time on his/her hands!
That's about it!
Takhteh wrote:
"one reason is because I'm not a dyed-in-the-wool AFK Macro user"
Are you implying that all Master Musicians are AFK macro'ers? You might want to clarify.
Nope, I'm implying that I haven't had the time and/or dedication to the profession to get there. Besides, last week it was hotter than the hinges of hell in England and my study was not where I needed, wanted or was interested in spending any time. 
Plenty of folks have gotten to Master in a variety of ways - I'm just making sure people understand where I am coming from.
Liquid is right on. The skill of a musician or a dancer comes not from pounding buttons and staring at their screen. It comes from building up a reputation with clientele. It comes from understanding your flourishes and how they interact with other instruments/dancers and other flourishes. It comes from a desire to get more out of the class than hitting a random combination of flourishes.
How you got to Master has little bearing on any of this.
The people who feel like they're being cheapened by AFK/Macro users need to understand that I, personally, do not value their time. The fact that you may have spent more time staring at your computer screen to get Master than someone else doesn't impress me. Your time, and the time you spend playing the game is meaningless to me -- and should be meaningless to everyone else too. Your time should be as valuable as you make it -- and how you enjoy playing the game, and spend that time, should be up to you.
End of story.
The only thing that matters to me, is how you play when you are live. I remember back when I was learning to play the drums. Every night I would pound away on my little practice pad. The same couple of beats over and over and over and over. The same with guitar and learning notes. Over and Over and Over. No ONE would want to sit there and listen to me practicing because it was repetative and boring. However, all of that repetative practive allowed me to rock when playing for real. I knew where the notes were and had my muscles trained to go where they were supposed to.
So let's translate this into my music career on corbantis. You might see Tobius out there=). Now, let's say I'm out at my favorite haunt, the dath science outpost. I'm practicing for when actual people show up. I don't want to go to another cantina because I'm needed where I am at. I put on my big show, but without healers there I only last about 2 minutes. So, if I want to gain experience and play without healers, I must cut back on the flourishes and listen to the base track.
One might say this is very similar to the repetative practice when learning a real life instrument. The difference is, my real life practice has a direct effect on my playing ability. My hands learn patterns and muscles get stronger and in turn the songs I play sound better. Each time a play a real song and see the difference my practice has made, I am encouraged to practice more.
In game, no matter how much I practice the flourishes sound the same. I get a new song, but never get to improve my flourishes. If I can play the waltz, I should be able to play starwars1 with my eyes closed and rock the socks off some newbie player's abilities. Maybe I can flourish better than a beginner and have a light show, but I still sound the same as the first day it seems. As a musician progresses, extra flourishes should open up for the songs they have long since passed by. This would encourage people to drop down to swars1 and play with new folks and yet still sound different as an experienced musician would.
If you are not a die hard musician type, then hours of the same song with no real change until you learn a new song could make afk seem very inviting. Even people being entertained will often ask for a new song because they've been listening to 30 minutes of the same song.As you progress up the musician treesome being to despise the older songs. Rather than spending time on policing the music profession and looking for ways make it impossible to use macros, add content to the musician class. Give them reasons to want to be there live.
I love playing live to a crowd. When healers step in I pull out all the stops and rock out. When I'm in a cantina alone or out somewhere by myself I often wonder how much better I could be live if I just stuck myself somewhere to "practice".
More content = less afk !
If there were economic issues like the artisan sampling for resources all night I think the devs would already be going after this one. There just isn't much of an economic impact in the game to the AFKer.
Actually what I'd like to see out of this huge discussion is a message from the devs regarding AFK in the retail game especially as it relates to entertainers. If they consider it a valid play style or just a cheap exploit of an in game system they haven't gotten around to fixing yet or even something in between. There are very vocal people on both sides of this issue. An while I tend to side with the Anti-AFK crowd especially in regards to the many inconsiderate AFKers that are out there. If the Devs come out with a statement that AFKEnt is an intended play style I'll be the first to let the subject drop. I certainly hope the AFKers will be as considerate if the decision goes the other way.
"Macroing is still happening despite our best efforts." -Holocron
the thread is
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Development&message.id=322969#M322969
if you want to read the whole thing.
I'll admit I took a small quote out of a larger post and it wasn't targeted directly at the entertainer question however it seems pretty relavant to the discussion at hand.
I Think AFK Macro is fine by Devs, but I could be wrong.
Speaking of Lack of communication, Devs seem to avoiding this issue, cuz I actuallysend Devs several Messages, and they don't reply to me on this subject.
I understand AFK macroing is largely a conern because of discurteous AFKers.
But, why get Devs involved to change codes?
I say if you got a problem with certain AFK users, talk to them (yet don't be rude either, don't try to act like you Own the cantina) and work it out.
Like tell them to AFK in a corner next time, you know!
JediMutantX3 wrote:I Think AFK Macro is fine by Devs, but I could be wrong.
Speaking of Lack of communication, Devs seem to avoiding this issue, cuz I actually send Devs several Messages, and they don't reply to me on this subject.
I'm sure you'd like it to be fine by the devs.
However, the history of their actions points to AFK as being unintended but not something they've gotten around to doing anything about yet. There have been significantly greater issues these first 6 weeks or so of release. If you're sending them Personal Messages from the board don't be upset that they aren't responding. They made it clear early on that they didn't have time for the sheer volume of stuff coming in through the messages and they wouldn't be answering or even necessarilly looking at that sort of thing with the exception of the guy monitoring for messages about exploits (not a job I envy at all).
sleepdepzombie wrote:
I'm sure you'd like it to be fine by the devs. However, the history of their actions points to AFK as being unintended but not something they've gotten around to doing anything about yet. There have been significantly greater issues these first 6 weeks or so of release.
If you're sending them Personal Messages from the board don't be upset that they aren't responding. They made it clear early on that they didn't have time for the sheer volume of stuff coming in through the messages and they wouldn't be answering or even necessarilly looking at that sort of thing with the exception of the guy monitoring for messages about exploits (not a job I envy at all).
Here is the Deal, finda quality Dev/Official person with a Yellow userid so I know he is who he (or she)is, and have this person either send me a Message OR reply tothis thread, OR starting a new thread stating AFK Macroing is NOT fine, and the consequences of doing it.
And that the punishment is Bannable.
Right now, I swear I am not clear what is their position on this, and the consequences of violators.
If Devs really don't think AFK macroing is fine, then they would do this, no?
They either start banning people, or have to forced to put in a stop.
Do you even have to ask the Devs to do it? No, you don't! (come back to this later*)
Ok, I WON'T AFK macroing anymore, if I don't want to be banned!
However, here is the issue with banning punishment, I also don't think it will work. Cuz,I am sure MANY of people here will argue/complain it's too Harsh. SOE wouldn't want to lose more customers than already has.
*You keep asking Devs to stop AFK macroing... give the Devs a break. Like I mentioned, if it's even against EULA or whatever they would either ban/user accounts (Too harsh) or put in a stop themselves, you Don't have to rush them on this. I am sure they have a lot of other projects more concerning that this!