Musician Archive
Thread: Feedback needed Jukebox Player Event Perk
Fragpuppie
Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:09 pm
#27
Fragpuppie wrote:
1) How "ambient" is ambient. It seems like I can only hear it when I'm in the same room of my Naboo small. I wonder if it is the same for a PA hall or Cantina or if its quiet farther away like musicians.
Im my small it stops EXACTLY at the doorway, but that is not really a good test.
2)What happens if you have 2 of them playing at one time....or 3...on different songs? Will it sound as bad as a the old grind groups?
Well if you drop a 2nd and start it the ambient music switches to the new....if you pick up either one it stops.
Also I tried granting admin to my 2nd TC char to see if he could control. When I bounced #1 for #2, the juke stopped and there was no way to restart it til I relogged in as #1. This will take some careful jumping through hoops to make it work right. Then again we're pretty used to that.
I do want to state that with these, events can be done without us. Buffing is all through buffbots, healing is all through AFKers. This takes the one thing we had left, performance. Only thing that could be worse is if they could also do effects. They will hurt our profession and one day all these paper cuts WILL kill us.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Entertainer, Master Musician
Founding Member - Frag's Puppies
President and CEO - Fragpuppie Enterprises and Uber Instruments
Coronet, Corellia, Chilastra
Fragpuppie
Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:11 pm
#28
<this was not the duplicate post you were looking for>
Message Edited by Fragpuppie on 02-21-2005 03:12 PM
Maisland
Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:59 pm
#29
Ok, my first thoughts were that this was not something to be concerned about... however, after reading this thread, I decided to go to TC myself and check it out. After setting up a house and dropping a jukebox, I started playing it... and yes, it is cause for concern. It is just TOO good for what it costs.
A solution would require something that needs to be done by a Musician. Maybe have the "jukeboxes" be simply cases, and require that a Musician install the tracks. I would like to see it as a permanent object that can be played X number of times per track... then require that a Musician "recharge" it in order for it to be used again.
Warryyr
Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:17 pm
#30
Home in a few, maybe we can meet up on TC-Gorath and try this out. Then, no need to log in/log out for a 2nd admin to test things.
Fragpuppie wrote:
Fragpuppie wrote:
1) How "ambient" is ambient. It seems like I can only hear it when I'm in the same room of my Naboo small. I wonder if it is the same for a PA hall or Cantina or if its quiet farther away like musicians.
Im my small it stops EXACTLY at the doorway, but that is not really a good test.
2)What happens if you have 2 of them playing at one time....or 3...on different songs? Will it sound as bad as a the old grind groups?
Well if you drop a 2nd and start it the ambient music switches to the new....if you pick up either one it stops.
Also I tried granting admin to my 2nd TC char to see if he could control. When I bounced #1 for #2, the juke stopped and there was no way to restart it til I relogged in as #1. This will take some careful jumping through hoops to make it work right. Then again we're pretty used to that.
I do want to state that with these, events can be done without us. Buffing is all through buffbots, healing is all through AFKers. This takes the one thing we had left, performance. Only thing that could be worse is if they could also do effects. They will hurt our profession and one day all these paper cuts WILL kill us.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Entertainer, Master Musician
Founding Member - Frag's Puppies
President and CEO - Fragpuppie Enterprises and Uber Instruments
Coronet, Corellia, Chilastra
Fragpuppie
Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:28 pm
#31
TC-Gorath is down atm....will check back.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Entertainer, Master Musician
Founding Member - Frag's Puppies
President and CEO - Fragpuppie Enterprises and Uber Instruments
Coronet, Corellia, Chilastra
Master Entertainer, Master Musician
Founding Member - Frag's Puppies
President and CEO - Fragpuppie Enterprises and Uber Instruments
Coronet, Corellia, Chilastra
Warryyr
Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:47 pm
#32
Rats.
Fragpuppie wrote:
TC-Gorath is down atm....will check back.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Entertainer, Master Musician
Founding Member - Frag's Puppies
President and CEO - Fragpuppie Enterprises and Uber Instruments
Coronet, Corellia, Chilastra
YodaMac
Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:14 pm
#33
From a non-musician player (but I make droids for ya! 
):
):I have used the Jukebox on TC-Gorath, and found it to be what I expected.
It's biggest strengths- the variety of songs to choose from, and it's ability to be "ambient" just playing in the background while I craft.
It's biggest drawbacks - no programmable kind of "playlist" to avoid monotony, limited lifespan, and expensive 25k to keep replacing!
I personally would rather see it become a permanent item, craftable by musicians or whoever, and programmable at the time of crafting with certain number of songs selected from this large variety. That way players could have the crafter customize their jukebox with the music they want to hear, and if they want different music later, they'd buy a new one.
Anyways, I can see it being used nicely at parties and events as BACKGROUND music when the band wasn't playing or wasn't there. Everyone prefers to watch a great band perform live (those Entertainer Droids rock!!) and the jukeboxes have "off" switches so bands dont have to compete with them during shows.
I couldn't afford to pay a musician (or even find one) to play music in my shop all day as I craft droids, and that is my primary interest in the jukebox. It's certainly not helping the musician profession, but I don't think it will hurt it that much either, as players who hire bands to perform will continue to do so, and only use jukeboxes as background music to fill in inbetween shows or as a mood setter.
Just my 2 credits worth from a player who enjoys a good show. 
DarkY0da
Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:16 pm
#34
My thoughts...
part of me likes it.(the merchant part) I mean more music in the game, is good. It sounds good aka it's a real song more or less. Large variety.
As a musician though I am at a loss... I'm struggling to understand, "why". You have an entire 106sp Profession dedicated to music. We have 5 different sounds for our instruments. We have gotten 1 new song in the last 2 years.(which once you are over the excitement of the fact we got a new song, you notice the odd way it loops and was written.) We are rather limited in our creative use of the songs and instruments we have.
And they choose to do this ??
I'm just very disappointed I guess... I don't have it in me to get angry... They have shown me that it doesn't do any good. So I'll just sadly resign myself to buying Jukeboxes and playing while using /pausem...
part of me likes it.(the merchant part) I mean more music in the game, is good. It sounds good aka it's a real song more or less. Large variety.
As a musician though I am at a loss... I'm struggling to understand, "why". You have an entire 106sp Profession dedicated to music. We have 5 different sounds for our instruments. We have gotten 1 new song in the last 2 years.(which once you are over the excitement of the fact we got a new song, you notice the odd way it loops and was written.) We are rather limited in our creative use of the songs and instruments we have.
And they choose to do this ??
I'm just very disappointed I guess... I don't have it in me to get angry... They have shown me that it doesn't do any good. So I'll just sadly resign myself to buying Jukeboxes and playing while using /pausem...
Gknee
Mon Feb 21, 2005 5:51 pm
#35
more music is good...but 8 hours and ambiant....ugh....I might as well just be a buff bot (I'm SO kidding) I love the idea..but I think it will kill us.
SpaceCrazy
Mon Feb 21, 2005 9:17 pm
#36
Warryyr wrote:
The Devs should have put more thought in how insulting and disastrous this would be for Entertainers - you know guys - the ones who ENTERTAIN. The performers who PERFORM. It's too late to pull the plug now. People have wanted something like this, it's being given to them for 25k (which isn't exactly chump change, but sure would be a nice big KA-CHING for Musicians if we could make and sell them).
Unfortunately, many of the recent changes and proposed changes by the devs have had this problem. They cater to a large portion of the playerbase who just wants cool stuff, quickly, with little hassle - mostly the all-combat types. All other playstyles seem to be getting pushed to the side. The devs are not considering what effect many of their new plans will have on non-combat professions/playstyles.
The proposed Galaxy Wide Vendor Search, the "shoot on sight" NPC's in the GCW changes, making Smuggler even more useless than they already are, giving away Master Ranger harvesting bonuses to anyone in a group (except the MR), reducing the times on everything from healing and buffing to shuttle waits, and jukeboxes to replace live bands. All of it benefits the all-combat players who couldn't give a fig about anyone else's fun.
The message I'm seeing from all of this is that SWG = combat, and everyone else is a second-class citizen not worth much consideration. I hate even making a statement like that, but I have to call it like I see it. I see it even in the recent Stratics chat, where a dev said something to the effect that "it's a war, pick a side". That demeans a significant part of the playerbase that would like to enjoy the game as a neutral or a non-combat character.
The fact that the devs have really been churning out major game changes is great and long overdue. But I'm seeing the changes as alienating anyone who doesn't want to blow stuff up all the time and that saddens me. They seem to be intent turning the game into a clone of the rest of the MMO's out there with a Star Wars skin.
Shaizann
Mon Feb 21, 2005 10:23 pm
#37
I was going to post some original thoughts, but then I read Mesca's post. That is also how I feel on the matter. Seems the Devs have no iddea what to do with us, so they're just not bothering. The changes are deffinately of the 'get uber before all the uber runs out!' variety.
I hate the powergame mentality. That is what chagnes like these cater to. Ultimately it ruins everything like a locust. Suck all the good from a game then move on to the next. If you can't get powerful quickly, it's not worht the effort. It leaves a husk of what could have been a wonderful fantasy, but thats ok because they "pwned" it.
In any case, to be on topic, yes, it stinks to be replaced by a jukebox. Even if said device is temporary.
I hate the powergame mentality. That is what chagnes like these cater to. Ultimately it ruins everything like a locust. Suck all the good from a game then move on to the next. If you can't get powerful quickly, it's not worht the effort. It leaves a husk of what could have been a wonderful fantasy, but thats ok because they "pwned" it.
In any case, to be on topic, yes, it stinks to be replaced by a jukebox. Even if said device is temporary.
PoetDancer
Mon Feb 21, 2005 11:46 pm
#38
I feel for you, musicians.
And I agree with Warryyr. This is just too good, sounds too good, and helps no other class. Merchants can't sell it. Crafters can't craft it. And musicians can't duplicate the sort of things it does. The only thing it does is take the money out of that 2% or so on the very top of the income level and sinks it out of the economy, instead of hands that can use it.
Very, very sad.
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 02-22-2005 12:47 AM
Kyorlana
Tue Feb 22, 2005 1:40 am
#39
Like Warryyr I have refrained from starting a thread about this as when it appeared on the player event tools page I thought it was cool but a niggling concern regarding the implementation of it.
Now it is on testcenter and I have heard it... well - let's just say my niggling concern was well founded.
The quality, number of tracks avaialble, and fact that it is ambient is without question going to kill many cantina house bands, wedding reception gigs, etc.
8 hours is just FAR too long. It should be 2-4 hours maximum if they are designed for a one off event as they appeared to be. I can see cantina owners purchasing these, adding friends to admin so they can purchase them and effectively have a permanent jukebox running at all times. Add to that the community already clamouring for these to be craftable by architects... we are being shafted well and truly.
If they WERE to be crafted then it should be a joint venture as follows:
- Selection of Jukebox chassis crafted by an architect
- Songs recorded by musicians
- Each song would have a lifetime of (x) plays so that we finally get a means of generating income. When the plays expires, we provide new recorded songs.
As others have already pointed out... there are speakers, there are microphones. For Nym's sake make them work for those of us that perform live!
I could go on but dinner is ready so I am being pulled away. I like the ability to hear the new music, I do NOT like the implementation.
Nuff said.
Now it is on testcenter and I have heard it... well - let's just say my niggling concern was well founded.
The quality, number of tracks avaialble, and fact that it is ambient is without question going to kill many cantina house bands, wedding reception gigs, etc.
8 hours is just FAR too long. It should be 2-4 hours maximum if they are designed for a one off event as they appeared to be. I can see cantina owners purchasing these, adding friends to admin so they can purchase them and effectively have a permanent jukebox running at all times. Add to that the community already clamouring for these to be craftable by architects... we are being shafted well and truly.
If they WERE to be crafted then it should be a joint venture as follows:
- Selection of Jukebox chassis crafted by an architect
- Songs recorded by musicians
- Each song would have a lifetime of (x) plays so that we finally get a means of generating income. When the plays expires, we provide new recorded songs.
As others have already pointed out... there are speakers, there are microphones. For Nym's sake make them work for those of us that perform live!
I could go on but dinner is ready so I am being pulled away. I like the ability to hear the new music, I do NOT like the implementation.
Nuff said.