Musician Archive
Thread: POLL: Who thinks that SOE should back up what they state?
And guess what, I'm in the Novice Musician line and I will NOT have the points left for Mater Entertainer. That's right, I won't get to play the stringed instrument. And I'm fine with it. I'm fine with it becasue its nice that the game forces you to make choices, that Master entertainers are as special as master muscians. I'm sorry that some of you can't do everything you want in the game without spending the skill points to do it, but that's life. Not only that but I like the fact that the stringed instrument is a rare thing - it makes it special. The moment every musician can play one is the moment it becomes the stupidest and most obnoxious pices of crap in the world. It's cool right now, because its speicial and kind of unique. 3,000 guitar-armed musicians is going to make it something every player in the game will be begging God to smite.
That said, I'm sure you'll get what you want, becuase you whine very loud about it, and that is usually effective. And if so, then it certainly won't be the end of the world.
It seems that Sony has done MMs a favor by not requiring ME to progress as an entertainer elite. Count your blessings; some other elite professions aren't so lucky. So, instead of punishing you, SOE might have been trying to help you out with a little flexibility. They just didn't want to drive MEs to extinction in the process. And this is the thanks they get?
If anything, ME should get more features to make it worthwhile for the IDer and dancer to achieve, not the other way around. The relative rarity of MEs in the world tells me that, to most, having the Mandoviol is not important enough to give up something else for. A change to make them more rare than they already are is certainly ill-conceived.
Incorrect statements in manuals and "documented" features that don't actually exist are common occurrences, and most who play lots of CRPGs (complex computer games with lots of rules) have likely encountered one or the other before: check NWNs documentation, for instance. This "incorrect manual" tack seems more a disguised attempt to swindle skill points than it does a real argument. This especially seems the case when the solution is as simple as to change the term "all" to "most" in the MM description or to just hang on to that ME tag that you spent a couple of days winning.
Bener
Bulbous2 wrote:
SOE needs to fix the bug. You know, the bug where it says that a Master Musician knows how to play ALL the instruments. This is a remnant from Beta that was never changed. It should be.
MM will never get the Mando, deal with it.
/agree 
This is exactly how things are right now, and I think they will fix the wording of master musician before they will take mando out of ME. This is just another thread that can be grouped with all the AFK Macroing threads under the category of JEALOUSY.
Master Entertainers also get two dances Dancers don't get. But really, I haven't seen any whining about THAT on the Dancer forums. But seeing as I've been here a short time, maybe it happened before I was around.
Either way, I'm guessing the subject was dropped there, and probably should be dropped here. Master Entertainer needs a couple of unique skills that branch to Dancer and Musician to give them the Master status and a unique sound. I know it says all songs/instruments, but eh, it's one thing, that's life.
If it's so hard up, maybe try suggesting switching the instrument. Put Mandovial in Master Musician and the Narg to Master Entertainer, or Omnibox or something.
But jeesh, let the master entertainers have their unique instrument. Makes having them in a group more essential. ^.^
Simply my two cents.
C_SKYWALKER wrote:I am not saying to take the Mando/Cer. away from ME's Just give it to MM's
So what you are saying is that ME get's Mando cert, and then when you hit MM you will get Mando cert as well. ??
C_SKYWALKER wrote:I can make one but I can't play one... Thats WRONG!
And like every other thread talking about how wrong the ME gets a unique instrument and song, this one pops op. Well have you tried to learn the Tech tree before knowledge ??? well then you can't play any of the instruments, not even the nalargon, how unfair is that ??? well not really unfair, there is a different between playing and making instruments,
I think the others have answered a lot of the things about this topic already.. And I'm on the nay sayer side, the ME is good as it is, they just need to alter the text in MM.
I am not jealous. I have both ME and MM. I just do not think it right that under the IN-GAME Skills Tree (not a printed manual that cannot be fixed easily), it states that an MM can play ALL songs/instruments... From some of the posts here it sounds like dancers get screwed too. I am not out to take away something from ME as there are people who got that status with no intention on going MM who enjoy playing the mand. I am however saying that MM's should be able to work as the IN-GAME description says. Changing the text there would be an easy fix if that is what SOE is going to do.
I generally think that the ME skill is flawed as a whole but that is another story for another time.
I basically think that if they want to give the mando and cer to ME's (as well as the special dances for dancers) that is fine. I DO think they should also be given to straight MM's (and MD's). These are the MASTERS of their trades and should have these abilities.
Say what you want and this could go back and forth forever but as I see it, ME is flawed to begin with. There is not enough ID to make that worth it, nor dance or music.
Better let ME's make their own Mando's because I know a lot of MM's who are now refusing to make them.
I can make one but I can't play one... Thats WRONG!
Why? You think there aren't people who can build things they can't use? Building an instrument and playing it are totally, TOTALLY, different, they are completely unrelated skills.
You can play instruments before you can build them, so why shouldn't you be able to build them and not play them? The two skills are NOT intrinsicly connected big fella.
build/play or no build/play, however you would like to look at it, this MM/ME (as well as many others) will only be building one Mando... The one I build for myself. If I decide to give up ME, I will destroy my mando before giving it to an ME.
C_SKYWALKER wrote:build/play or no build/play, however you would like to look at it, this MM/ME (as well as many others) will only be building one Mando... The one I build for myself. If I decide to give up ME, I will destroy my mando before giving it to an ME.
Well you use the argument that you can build and not play, and now you throw it aside cause people points out the flaw in that assumption.
about not making mandos for MEs, well then it's good there are still people who still builds Mandos for anyone who want's. Heck i've made instruments for non musicians that just wanted them in the houses.. If there is a problem for ME people on Eclipse to find people to make instruments for you, then give me a call..
And just a thing, havn't seen it in the manual, well heck i didn't read it anywho, but where did it say that the Master Musician could play all songs and instruments... (The printed version)
Printed version I could understand. Hard to fix a zillion manuals... No, the printed version does not go into THAT much detail... The important key is the freaking game itself. Someplace where, if wrong, could be fixed easily.
Say what you will but SOE stated it, and it does not work the way they state.
C_SKYWALKER wrote:Printed version I could understand. Hard to fix a zillion manuals... No, the printed version does not go into THAT much detail... The important key is the freaking game itself. Someplace where, if wrong, could be fixed easily.
Say what you will but SOE stated it, and it does not work the way they state.
Why arn't you shouting for more flourishes and songs on Music Knowledge II then ??
They (they as in SOE) STATE "Musical Knowledge II grants the Musician a wider variety of songs and flourishes they can perform." and you only get the Bandfill instrument at that time. no new Songs no new Flos (or are the flos the new animations for the bandfill).. Hey and you got KnowII long before MM, why didn't you call them out at that time.
The problem with the text in the skilltree ingame stating that master musicians can play every instrument and every song, is a minor bug, so minor that it's one of those that is cosmetic, and the devteam are doing game stopper bugs and other more interesting things than looking at all the cosmetic bugs that can be filtered out at some time, when the game is more stable and the large features are supported.
"Then why when it's so a minor bug why can't they use the 10 secs i takes to alter it ??"
Well that one bug isn't the only Cosmetic bug in the game, and if they are to change one they should change them all, and changing all isn't just 10 secs.. And the time spend on that i would rather have them implement other features for the Musicians, that will give us some more things to do, other than look at our master skill description.
One thing I would like to point out for what it is worth.
"The Master Musician knows all the songs and instruments available, and has all the tools to put on a professional performance."
The key here is that it even says "available" rather than "knows all the songs and instruments". To me, this could impy that this statement means that all the instruments available to a musicain or perhaps a master musician. If the first sentence read
"The Master Musician knows all the songs and instruments available in game. or in the galaxy," then it would be plain that a misrepresentation had taken place.