Musician Archive
Thread: Episode 3 Discussion
Padme's role as written stunk. She has gone from a leader to auxiallary plot device. If she had some tiny bit of political maneuvering after her attempt to manipulate Ani, or some work in the Senate other than disinterested listener to Palpatine's speech, I would have been pleased. It was backwards and inconsistent to have her attempt manipulation, resist manipulation, and be manipulated (ok taken advantage of by a jedi hitchhiker), all by turns. She didn't have any role except to service the plot. Also, what was up with that pathetic attempt at a pregnant glow in the blacony scene? did Makeup take a day off?
Fashion gripes- everyone looked baggy! even the outfits that were somewhat form fitting on Padme, tended to make her look bunchy in weird ways. The Mon Cal ballerinas were not anywhere near close enough!!! if I hadnt seen concept art I wouldn't have know that was what they were. New vadermask- I do not like it Sam I am, it is too big, and he looks quite the bobble head. Best looking Jedi- Dooku, alas he died too soon. Best looking droid- R4's coppertop look.
/agree voices on droids nowhere near mechanical enough, and semi coherent babytalk from complex machines is offputting.
Honestly loved the movie, but there were things that screamed shoddy and sellout, and thankfully the parts that worked overshadowed them, until now when I poke a little fun at them.
Great movie, could have used a Musician, though. lol
As for the Anakin and Padme thing...I'll just say that I hope Lucas' next projects aren't romances.
The saber battles were top-notch. I really need to go see it again, heh.
Message Edited by Warryyr on 05-22-2005 08:31 PM
So bloody amazing!
Heehee,
When the openingcrawl finishes and the camera tilts... the boom boom of the drums... man you had to know we were in for something different, eh?
My jaw literally dropped with the enormous amounts of stuff on the screen above Coruscant and all those ships... hehe, wow.
Great to see Lucas able to achieve his dreams... you know he had all this stuff in his head when you just couldn't create such things... so He changed the world in order to be able to create them, hehe. A great artist (perhaps onlya genius)learns to invent the tools that are neededto best express oneself.
About the actors... just amazing performances, in my opinion.
Ewan Macgregor is so friggin fantastic... he blended seemlessly into Sir Alec Guiness. I'm not exactly surprised, as I've always thought Ewan was great, but the job that he did to become Alec Guiness's Obi-Wan was just so tremendous he deserves a lot of respect and love from us Star Wars Fans. I know he did great in each of the Episodes, but this movie was so important and he nailed it and it all seemed so natural. I heard that Lucas simply calls Ewan "Obi-Wan" because he simply IS Obi-Wan in his mind. Sir Alec Guiness isn't exactly the easiest guy to hold up to... and he did it amazingly well!
Plus, the scenes they had to do in this movie... wow.
When Obi-Wan delivers those lines after defeating Anakin... /sigh
Hayden is a great young actor.
I know it's not popular opinion (That never stops me), but I loved him in AOTC.
He had some tough scenes in that film and he did them wonderfully.I just don't think that most viewers fully relate to the type of person Hayden was playing in AOTC.
Anyway... back to ROTS... Hayden was perfectly grim. Even early on, he just perfectly came across as battle-hardened. That War played a strong role in messing up Anakin as well, I think.
He really seems to understand the Anakin character and I think his enjoyment of it makes it all the more enjoying to watch.
I'm looking forward to following his career closely... ^^
Great to see the chemistry between Obi-Wan and Anakin build.
As far as I'm concerned, Natalie Portman is an excellent actress. I loved her emotion in this film.
The scene on the landing platform on Mustafar lived up to any expectations I've had... and that means A LOT to this life-long fan!
We've had 28 years to imagine what might have happened and honestly the Maker didn't let me down one bit.
That scene was just perfectly chilling and each of the performers nailed their roles. I'm not ashamed to admit each time Padme tells Anakin that he's "breaking her heart" my eyes water. To be perfectly honest, I'll freely admit that my eyes are basically teary from just about Code 66 and on.
I did not expect the film to be SO emotional... I don't know why. I guess Lucas may have successfully faked me out and I didn't expect him to deliver such intense drama without the usual Star Wars Sugar-Coating that has always existed in each of the other films. There's always been great drama (Well especially Luke and Vader in ESB and of course ROTJ) but it has never ever been so heavy and as painful as in ROTS. And of course, it just had to be.
But wait... the actors... Ian McDiarmidis always the best and this movie allowed his character to shine once again!
Brilliant delivery... just perfect. When he's talking with Anakin...
Oh, I just love his child-like grin when he mentions that Darth Plagus's apprentice killed him in his sleep... he's just SO pleased with himself, hehehe!!
It was so great to see those scenes between Palpatine and Anakin. I've dreamed of those interactions for so many years now... Mr. Lucas did a great job to bring a real sense ofhumanity into the mix and give Anakin the motivation to make the leap.
There's a post somewhere in my history on these boards about the theory my Brother and I had about Anakin's "Immaculate Conception" and I am so glad to see that touched on in ROTS. 
It's not that I'm bragging about it... I'm just so pleased that we were right. (Or at least could be right, as it is slightly open-ended)
Perfectly done too.
Anyway, Ian McDiarmid is a master.
The greatest thing about this movie is... it does exactly what he intended it to do. It's the tragic part III of the great Saga.
When Vader enters the scene in A New Hope, you'll never see it the same way as you did before. Even more amazing is just how well it all fits together.
A 28 year gap is not an easy thing to connect and after watching the entire Saga this weekend, I can say that it works extremely well.
The original trilogy, so full of life from the begining, now has even more life breathed into it and even greater under-scores and emotional resonance.
Episode III is just so tragic... and that shadow now hangs over everything in the series... until the fallen hero's Son undoes those tragedies and brings the balance back through his unconditional love.
Just great stuff!!!
Anyway, as you can see I can ramble on and one about this.
I just hope it wasn't too long and that someone gets some enjoyment out of reading this...
May the force be with you.
Bah! I have to add this last little bit...
Lucas just deserves so much more credit than he gets.
He is an Independant Film Maker (And anextraordinary artist) that makes films the way he wants them to be and does not "sell out" or conform to what other people want.
I find it funny when people say he "Sold out"... you have no idea what he is about.
He's built things up for himself to be able to do what ever he wants.
And he's donethat by fronting his own money, each and every time.
It's a shame that, just because he's so successful and he uses merchandizing (outside of his art) to it's fullest, that he gets so overlooked as an original, innovative and independant artist.
This world needs more true artists... not the real studio-slaves and conformists that create crap that sells simply because the marketing demands it and the masses gobble it up.
If you watch the entire Saga with an open mind, you'll see that he hasn't changed what he's beendoing.
He just told the story like he wanted it to be.
You can either choose to accept Lucas's art for what it is or you can battle what he hasdone against what you (The audience) always imagined it should have been like.
In the end... it is what it is... and if you don't enjoy it, then you're missing out... and I feel bad for you, beacuse it is one fun ride!! 
-Omadda Szool
Kauri
Shock-N-Awe wrote:
Am I the only one that thought the Frankenvader scene with him breaking the restraints and screaming "Noooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!!!eleventy11!!!one!!!!".....was really stupid?
Hehe. I felt like I was the only one to actually like that scene.
I liked the hesitant James Earl Jones voice as he asked about Padme. It connected the uncertainty and self-doubt of Anakin with the confidence and dark hate of Vader.
The NOOOOOOOO! temper tantrum Vader threw reminded me of the show down between him and Obi Wan over Padme's body. The "You won't take her from me!" (as if he hadn't just force choked her and threw her aside) showed that at that moment, sucumbing to the darkness, he thought of her as a thing, a posession, rather than a beloved. Mine! The NOOOOOOO! was rage at loosing that possesion, the rage of the thwarted child, rather than remorse or repentance. And the gleeful look on the Emporer's face was the same look he has later, watching Vader and Luke fight. The puppetmaster arranging misery and hate.
Vorpaks wrote:
Hehe. I felt like I was the only one to actually like that scene.
And for the exact same reasons.
Jutewr wrote:
Vorpaks wrote:
Hehe. I felt like I was the only one to actually like that scene.
Don't feel alone! I liked it too.
The scene in general I liked, I only was displeased with the use of "Nooooo!" Had it been a general scream without any words, or a screamless rage/despair, I think the whole scene would've been perfect. Just not the "Nooooo!"
Aleyo wrote:
Jutewr wrote:
Vorpaks wrote:
Hehe. I felt like I was the only one to actually like that scene.
Don't feel alone! I liked it too.
The scene in general I liked, I only was displeased with the use of "Nooooo!" Had it been a general scream without any words, or a screamless rage/despair, I think the whole scene would've been perfect. Just not the "Nooooo!"
I think a far more powerful and evocative image would have been the Emperor smiling over a "fallen to his knees, sobbing" Darth Vader, immediately after getting his suit on.
It was the moment where his new reality hits him - he's gone to the Dark Side with no hope of return that he sees (gone so far, killed friends). He killed the very reason WHY he went to the Dark Side - Padme. Obi-Wan's word "You have done this to YOURSELF" must ring very true in his ears at this point. He has lost everything, and gained nothing but power and perpetual servitude to the Emperor.
Instead of trying to encapsulate that into a "Nooooooooooooo!" - make it the tragic scene of the "mighty" Vader actually on his knees, sobbing. If I'd lost the love of my life, and realized it was my fault for doing something stupid, my first reaction isn't to get mad and scream "Nooooooooooooo!" I'll bet I'd just collapse in a heap, due to my sorrow and despair, maybe let out a "primal scream" of some loud sound of pain.
I wish I'd directed that scene, seriously. lol
Message Edited by Warryyr on 05-24-2005 04:33 PM
Aleyo wrote:
Jutewr wrote:
Vorpaks wrote:
Hehe. I felt like I was the only one to actually like that scene.
Don't feel alone! I liked it too.
The scene in general I liked, I only was displeased with the use of "Nooooo!" Had it been a general scream without any words, or a screamless rage/despair, I think the whole scene would've been perfect. Just not the "Nooooo!"
Do you think Lucas was trying to tie into Luke's cry of denial when Vader told him that he was Luke's father? The I know its true, but I deny it anyway type thing?
Actually even as I suggest that it doesnt quite feel right. Vaders NOOOO! went along with a surge of power, ripping free of the restraints and crushing everything around him. Luke's was more despair and a loss of power. Weeping... sliding down the conduit he was holding... and eventually jumping... retreating. Also Vader was denying something he did, Luke was denying something that was, in effect, done to him. Maybe Lucas just likes that phrase.
Aleyo wrote:
The scene in general I liked, I only was displeased with the use of "Nooooo!" Had it been a general scream without any words, or a screamless rage/despair, I think the whole scene would've been perfect. Just not the "Nooooo!"
/agree
I also love the term "FrankenVader." I've been using it ever since I saw it here. It really describes the scene well.
psikobunny wrote:
Padme's role as written stunk. She has gone from a leader to auxiallary plot device. If she had some tiny bit of political maneuvering after her attempt to manipulate Ani, or some work in the Senate other than disinterested listener to Palpatine's speech, I would have been pleased. It was backwards and inconsistent to have her attempt manipulation, resist manipulation, and be manipulated (ok taken advantage of by a jedi hitchhiker), all by turns. She didn't have any role except to service the plot. Also, what was up with that pathetic attempt at a pregnant glow in the blacony scene? did Makeup take a day off?
Read the novelization. It expandson Padmé's "separatist" ideals, as well as planting the seeds of the future Rebellion Against the Galatic Empire (tm).
My biggest gripe about her is the fact she dies of a broken heart. Completely against the character development we've seen over the first two movies. She goes from being someone who would fight for what she believes in to someone who gives up on her children and her husband (she still believes there is good in him.) Now, if it came off as she was sacrificing herself to protect her children from Anakin and Palpatine, as well as protecting Organa and the others who will eventually lead the Rebellion (though in the movie this isn't touched on at all) then it would be a far more noble and meaningful death than just "she appears to have lost the will to live." Though, given Lucas' penchant for completely borking the romantic scenes in the prequel trilogy, this comes as no surprise really.
The droids are to be expected. Droids = comic relief in Star Wars. With Jar Jar removed from that role, the Droid Army had to pick up the slack. 
I more or less agree with folks sentimants here particularly regarding the roles of Anakin/Padme's love life. The scene on the balcony where they're having the "I love you more...no I love *you* more...no, no, no....I love YOU more..." really got on my nerves. I know he was trying to go for the "Pregnant Glow" effect but the two actors just were not doing it for me. They just did not have the heat/chemistry that conveyed two young peole in passionate love with one another fighting incredible odds.
They may as well have passed a datapad to each other across the table with a small note tapped into it, "Do you love me? Plz check Yes or No in one of the boxes below...kthxbai"
Didn't particularly like that scene either.
(Implied killing of the kids... WOW... ballsy, never saw that coming after the first two movies)
mmmm so and so for me...
a lot of good action but i found that the scenes more oriented to characters where "incomplete" and made just because it have to be done (and as fast as possible)
the order 66 thing seemed also a bit crappy to me...
ok the officer that shot at kenobi but the others.... they are fighting... "order 66" and they shot at the jedi... not to say the one on starfighter that is flying around in battle and the little holo of the emperor appears sayng "order 66!" and he shot down the jedi fighter (that was quite hilarous).
the midichlorians are back!!!
the battles and combat scenes are very good and well made but i think the movie is too much sustained by them.
i was also a bit disappointed by the emperor, i guessed him as more manipulative and, why not, more powerfull... Kreia from KOTOR2beat him hands down eheh 
overall i found the movie enjoyable and entertaining but not at level of ANH or ESB