Musician Archive
Thread: Musician Correspondent's First Report July 29 please comment
I just e-mailed Q3P0 with my first report as Musician Correspondent; it is reproduced as the next post in this thread. The report lists the "top five" issues I have seen posted here, especially (but not solely) in my thread inviting comment on the "top issues for Musicians." I'd now like to ask that you comment on my report. Your comments will help me formulate my next report for Q3P0. In particular, it would be helpful if you couldidentify which items you think should beremoved from the list and which should be added to it. Please postyour comments in this thread as soon as possible.
In compiling my first report, I tried to be as objective as possible. I tallied how many people listed which issue at which level of priority, and I listed the top issues in accordance with that tally. Inevitably, that meant that some very constructive suggestions didn't make the "cut" for this first report.(For what it's worth, it also meant that some things on my personal "top five" list didn't make the cut either.)
My hope is that our list will change as the devs respond to our concerns. By way of example, "improved gigs" are currently #4 on the list; now that gig terminals are "in development," that issue may soon fall out of the top five. Likewise, a /bandtip fix would clear the way for us to put other issues in our top five.
Finally, I want to thank everyone for the extraordinarily constructive tone of the posts in my Correspondents threads thus far. I hope, as you comment on my first report in this thread, that we can continue that tradition of constructive discussion. See you in the cantina!
-NewJedi (Ricky Starwalker, Master Musician, Chilastra)
Dear Q3P0,
This is my first report as Musician Correspondent. I wasn't quite sure when this first report was due, so I hope this report is timely. You asked that I develop a "top five" list of issues and requests for Musicians, and that I toss in a "sixth" issue of particular interest to me. Accordingly, last week I started a thread inviting comments in the Musician Forum and gave people one week to reply. See
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=musician&message.id=906
I've now received and tallied dozens of thoughtful replies. Here are the results -- the top five issues for Musicians as of July 29. I emphasize that these aren't necessarily *my* top five issues; these are the five I have seen posted most often, and at the highest level of priority, in the Musician forum. This list also comports with comments I've received when I talk to other Musicians in the game. So here are the "top five," in descending order of priority, with a virtual tie for first place:
1. Duplicate instrument sounds. Many Musicians have expressed great disappointment that, after working hard to learn how to play a new horn, it sounds essentially the same as a slitherhorn or fizzz. Indeed, one doesn't acquire an entirely new "sound" (the bandfill) until one has made it well into the Master Musician skill tree. People want each instrument to sound distinct. Likewise, a number of people also have expressed disappointment that the bandfill and ommni box sound the same; some posters suggest that the bandfill be the "bass" and the ommni the "drums." (On a related note, some players wish that Musicians could get a stringed instrument without taking Master Entertainer, but others strongly disagree, arguing that the mandoviol provides needed incentive for people to pursue Master Entertainer.)
2. More songs and flourishes. As I mentioned above, this issue is cited virtually as often as issue #1. People want more songs and flourishes! Some people suggest that each skill box should come with two songs, not just one; some suggest adding more "newbie" songs to supplement Star Wars I, which many people find painful; others note that one Music Knowledge skill box adds no new song; others ask for more Star Warsy tunes; and still others think that Master Musicians should be able to work or quest to learn new songs, thus adding high-level content to the profession.
3. Tips for the whole band. The next-most-often cited issue is that tips aren't split among bandmembers. Some people favor a system by which tips are split by default, so that any tip goes to the whole band. Others say the audience member should have a choice between /tip and /bandtip, depending on whether the audience member feels the entire band warrants a tip.
4. Content: better gig missions, and better high-level content. Your "in dev" notes mention that gig terminals are coming, so "gigs" may drop off my list soon. For now, though, a number of people say that gig missions are uninteresting, or that it's hard to tell whether you are actually making progress on the mission as you play. Some players suggest adding a "meter" to let the player know how much time is left on the gig. Likewise, people think the life of the Master Musician could be spiced up with more high-level gig content. Perhaps an Epic Quest for Musicians could involve a series of gigs that lead to new songs, etc.
5. Integrating newbies into bands. This is easily the most controversial issue on my top-five list. Some players feel that newbs ought to be able to join in any song, albeit for reduced or no XP, so that bands aren't forever stuck playing Rock and Star Wars I. By contrast, other musicians feel that such a system would eliminate the sense of accomplishment that comes from playing a new tune for the first time, and that newbs already have ample opportunities to jam with others; these folks see no need for a change. I wasn't sure whether to include this issue on my list at all, since there seem to be as many people opposed to a change as favoring one, but a fair number of posts are concerned with it, so I decided to include it.
6. As you requested, my pet peeve: /changeband is bugged. It sometimes causes a player to hear the theme of a tune repeated endlessly, even if the player and band has stopped playing. The bug requires that player to relog. A number of posters did mention this in my thread, and it *is* a pet peeve of mine, so I add it to the list. In fact, I see no need for an abrupt /change command at all. Real musicians don't abruptly change mid-song -- they stop a tune before starting a new one.
That's my first report. Please let me know if you need further information. Incidentally, I've heard that you want subsequent reports submitted on Fridays; is that right? Unless I hear otherwise, I will submit my next report this Friday (incorporating Forum reaction to this Report). In the meantime, I hope you find this report helpful.
Best regards,
NewJedi
a/k/a Ricky Starwalker, Master Musician, Chilastra
In the spirit of self-criticism, I thought I'd mention a couple of things that didn't "make the cut" in my report, and perhaps should have:
1. Targeting nalargons and ommni boxes. A number of people have cited this problem, and I agree it's a pain. In the end, the volume of posts on newbs and gigs swayed me, so I didn't include this targeting issue. Also, as annoying as this issue is, there are workarounds: one can /invite by using the command line, and indeed can invite a player just by typing the first 3 or 4 letters of his or her name. E.g., /invite newj will /invite NewJedi to your band. Likewise, one can do emotes with the command line: /cheer newj. But I still agree that this is an annoying problem. Should it be on our next top-five list?
2. Making our own songs. I was actually surprised how few people put this on their top-five lists. I assume folks don't expect the devs to do this, and indeed I recall that Holo said in beta that we had "no idea how hard" he fought for this. I did read the interesting thread on Composition, and a few weeks ago I started my own thread on Song Schematics. I've also heard suggestions for "playing" our keyboards like MIDI instruments - making them virtual keyboards. Should this sort of thing be on a future top-five list?
Anyway, I look forward to your comments on my first Report. Thanks.
Allura WindSinger, waging a war for the right to play a mandoviol without having to learn to braid hair or dance on people's toes first, Naboo, Intrepid
You're right, I just don't see SOE adding custom songs or player MIDI keyboards at all. Lisencing issues, but I'm not a lawyer so maybe I'm wrong and petitioning for it would work. I'm all for it I think it's great. The down side is it's like adding twitch skills to fighter classes. Now all the real life musicians have a huge edge over the ones that are inexperienced thru no fault of their own and just want to role play a musician. I've met many people who, like me, have had many years of musical training and I've met many with a casual but healthy interest. Would player made live music alienate anyone from the game? How many of us as a percentage are RL musicians or are RL musically inclined in any way? I don't know the answer and I'm just bringing it up cause I just now thought of it. Maybe we are all musicians, I don't know, might not be an issue.
Nice write-up NewJedi. As a Musician, I appreciate it.
This is my second post here, only have found these forums today 
. Not that this sways anything, but I agree that from the standpoint of an entire profession, that's a great "Top 5 Issues" list.
But I have my own pet peeve, in the Advanced line, for which I'll start a new thread. I need my daily dose of flaming 
Felsspat wrote:
I DON'T want group tips..usually all musicians except me are afk.. and thats why they want a group tip
A group tip is much better than what /tipsplit is now if it worked. If a leader were to enable /tipsplit any tip that you recieved individually would be split with the whole band. That is unnacceptable. That is why there needs to be an option for /tipgroup or /tipband...whatever. That way the person making the tip has the option of tipping the whole group or individuals alike.
I agree that the "/tipsplit" command, even if it ever works again, is inadequate. I created a new thread though with a suggestion I've been mulling over for a bit, if anyone cares
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=musician&message.id=1322
Great first report!
I have been one that is really on the side of wanting musicians to be able to make up there own songs. Even if most people would suck at it I think it would add a lot of difference to the game which is what it lacks IMO.
Keep up the good work NewJedi.
First off excellent job NewJedi. Quite a few major issues were addressed there, and I am glad to see they are getting attention.
I cannot understand anyone who has a problem with /bandtip AS LONG AS /tip stays
If it replaces, then I agree I don't want it. But as long as it co-exists, then I see no reason why it should be opposed. It gives the listener that choice. if there is a band of 10 and 9 are afk, it is pretty easy to tell who isAFK and who is not (especially if you interact with them). If they choose to tip the other anyway they would have done it regardless. If they tip just you, then more power to yah
I have an AFK macro (no flourishes, already a master) that clearly states if I am AFK do not tip me. Sadly I know musician who ask for tips in their go away for 8 hours macros. That's not right. If you power macro, I pleed to other musicians to NOT ask for tips as you are not earning them. If you are given a tip because someone comes in and listenses to you and they choose to tip you then cool, but asking for one in a AFK for a long time macro gives us all a bad rep.
As for songs, maybe create a supplimental program outside of swg that allows you to in a GUI interface create your own songs and then load them into a text file to be loaded with the /load command. Create a simple 3 proged interface that allows you to with a midi keyboard create tunes, then in section 2 have a little version of you (like when you are in your inventory) who when you add flourishes/special FXto the mix animates how they work with the specific song. The 3rd section can be used for lyrics. Most songwritters will tell you it is easier to write lyrics into a song then the opposite. I am not a good programmer, but it seems these things using the swg curent code would be very easy to implement. This will allow a bunch of top notch musicians to get together and create that "something special" that will keep the profession moving forwards. Food for thought. Keep the ideas rolling