Musician Archive

Thread: Loot System changes and In Concept concerns

Warryyr
Tue Nov 25, 2003 3:32 pm
#1






Banthabutcher wrote:

The mind buff crystal recharges over 4 days, only lasts 1 hour 30 minutes, and buffs for 900.


It's really more of an emergency thing, which is what I hope a mind wound healing stim might do, rather than become the basis...


"Gah, I can't PvP tonight guys. I ran out of Mind Wound stims..."


Compared to


"Damnit! A CM got us with a mind disease! Take a stim if you have it and maybe we can live through this guys..."







Well, I hope so.


But the Devs won't know that's a way we'd be cool with it.


We don't want these Mind wound stims (if they make it into the game) to be the next Locked Container or anything. Otherwise they'll be freakin' EVERYWHERE. When you have a stat that can be damaged IN combat, but only healed OUT of combat (unless you're a Jedi or TKM) then you've got great demand for a way to heal that while away from cantinas.


I'm fairly certain this would be a popular item. If it was rare, things would be camped to get as many of them as possible. People might not decide they can't PvP without them, but then again they could decide they'd rather wait and collect a massive amount, and THEN PvP.


As NJ said, it's dilution of our value as a profession that's most concerning to me. I pay my skill points like anyone else. Hands off my skills and passing them off as any random loot item in the game. Makes me feel less valuable as a player.


Warryyr
Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:11 pm
#2



TH has a post regarding the new loot system. One paragraph in particular made a little red flag raise up in my head. Here's the paragraph and my response to TH in this thread.


Crafting Assist Items These are items that combatants will give/sell/trade to crafters, who will in turn craft better items for the combatant. This sets up a loop of positive interaction between the combatants and the crafters that will enhance both play styles. Examples of this would be weapon upgrades (experimental lenses to be used in scopes, extended barrels to be used on rifles, mysterious resources used to craft more durable melee weapons), armor upgrades (the mysterious resources used to make better armor, the schematic for a new type of armor, or the hardening solution used to increase an armor's effectiveness against kinetic attacks), and medical upgrades (a mysterious elixir that can be added to stimpacks to heal a players mind wounds, a syringe full of a strange substance that reduces the amount of time between burst runs when mixed with spices, or a bottle of blue pills that give the player an increased regeneration speed to their action pool if added to food).





Hey, be careful, now. You're treading on Entertainers' livelihood. I fully understand this is only in-concept, but given the current state of Entertainers, the very LAST thing we need is for you to hand our skills out to any random Joe-Combat who loots something.


If you put this in, I fully expect loot items that left me craft weapons like a Weaponsmith, or build armor like an Armorsmith, and any other skills other people have but I don't have.


Weigh this very heavily in your minds. This will not sit well with the Entertainer community. I will be following this subject closely, as other Entertainers will as well I'm sure.


Fair warning, Dev team. Seriously. Don't step on Entertainers anymore than you already have.







So, seems to me that if we feel this is wholly inapproriate for loot, we need to tell them now while it's still in concept. Just saw this little blurb and figured I would keep everyone informed.


Not anything to get in a tizzy over, but something we should probably express our opinion about via our Correspondents if we feel it's something we don't want added into the game.


I kind of got all "gloom and doom" on TH about it, since I figure we value our skills highly. If people feel this isn't that big of a deal, I'll edit out that stuff. I just wanted to get this in front of the community and see what people think.


Message Edited by Warryyr on 11-04-2004 11:28 AM

Message Edited by Warryyr on 11-04-2004 11:58 AM

MyT_Chicken
Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:54 pm
#3

I think that "magical elixer" is going to be pretty have to find. I don't think we will have much to worry about. Maybe wrong.




h Egri p
§ If you don't know; you'll find out soon enough! §

Banthabutcher
Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:16 pm
#4

I would hope that, down the line, that is changed to Mind Damage and not Mind Wounds.


But even if it's kept at wounds, it'd probably only heal around 50-100 wounds, which isn't that much (I heal that in 1-2 ticks).


And even if it does heal all your wounds, we still have BF to heal. Not to mention this would be a one-use thing, so it's not like it permanently heals wounds...


The Devs aren't (hopefully) that stupid



Kodo' Bonodawieedo
Master Musician and First Class Soldier!
"Every time someone gives a post one star GarVa kills a kitten."
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Tralmek
Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:21 pm
#5






Banthabutcher wrote:

I would hope that, down the line, that is changed to Mind Damage and not Mind Wounds.


But even if it's kept at wounds, it'd probably only heal around 50-100 wounds, which isn't that much (I heal that in 1-2 ticks).


And even if it does heal all your wounds, we still have BF to heal. Not to mention this would be a one-use thing, so it's not like it permanently heals wounds...


The Devs aren't (hopefully) that stupid





/spam Taking all bets!




Feeling no connection with the Force since 2003
*feels an outer glow*. The HAWT side is with me
Have a question? Read the Stickies!
Remember: Only YOU can prevent forum fires
!
Official AFKophobe


DarkY0da
Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:23 pm
#6

I'll bet Everything I have.



Oh-Orb Rizo Twi'lek
Just hanging out... watching with interest what changes do or don't happen.

I support the NDE. (New Drygo Experience)
Server Pop Snap-Shot Feb. 06 link















LyteFoot
Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:43 pm
#7

They will probably be powerful and plentiful. The SOE solution to not being able to find buffs in off peak hours is to simply remove entertainers from the equation. After all its a social class, isn't grouping and chatting good enough?


They don't get it, they won't get it, they can't get it.



Elwyn LyteFoot - Corbantis server
NewJedi
Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:02 pm
#8

Good catch, Warryyr. I'm going to raise this with the devs. Thanks for your vigilance!


Panthu raised similar concerns about the mind-buff item reward in the phase 3 villagecombat quest. That item had a pretty long cooldown period, though. At least I think it did. I got the health-buff reward in phase 2, and I can only use it once every 3 days. I can live with the item if it hasrestrictions like those.


I have repeatedly told the devs that I (and, I think, most Musicians) oppose any effort to eliminate or dilute our buffing, wound-healing, or fatigue-healing abilities.




Banthabutcher
Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:08 pm
#9

The mind buff crystal recharges over 4 days, only lasts 1 hour 30 minutes, and buffs for 900.


It's really more of an emergency thing, which is what I hope a mind wound healing stim might do, rather than become the basis...


"Gah, I can't PvP tonight guys. I ran out of Mind Wound stims..."


Compared to


"Damnit! A CM got us with a mind disease! Take a stim if you have it and maybe we can live through this guys..."



Kodo' Bonodawieedo
Master Musician and First Class Soldier!
"Every time someone gives a post one star GarVa kills a kitten."
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
|R|O|D|I|A|N| |P|O|W|E|R|!|

+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+


Warryyr
Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:27 pm
#10






Tralmek wrote:





Banthabutcher wrote:

I would hope that, down the line, that is changed to Mind Damage and not Mind Wounds.


But even if it's kept at wounds, it'd probably only heal around 50-100 wounds, which isn't that much (I heal that in 1-2 ticks).


And even if it does heal all your wounds, we still have BF to heal. Not to mention this would be a one-use thing, so it's not like it permanently heals wounds...


The Devs aren't (hopefully) that stupid





/spam Taking all bets!




1,000,000 for Stupidity on the nose, to win!


Warryyr
Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:32 pm
#11






Banthabutcher wrote:

The mind buff crystal recharges over 4 days, only lasts 1 hour 30 minutes, and buffs for 900.


It's really more of an emergency thing, which is what I hope a mind wound healing stim might do, rather than become the basis...


"Gah, I can't PvP tonight guys. I ran out of Mind Wound stims..."


Compared to


"Damnit! A CM got us with a mind disease! Take a stim if you have it and maybe we can live through this guys..."







Well, I hope so.


But the Devs won't know that's a way we'd be cool with it.


We don't want these Mind wound stims (if they make it into the game) to be the next Locked Container or anything. Otherwise they'll be freakin' EVERYWHERE. When you have a stat that can be damaged IN combat, but only healed OUT of combat (unless you're a Jedi or TKM) then you've got great demand for a way to heal that while away from cantinas.


I'm fairly certain this would be a popular item. If it was rare, things would be camped to get as many of them as possible. People might not decide they can't PvP without them, but then again they could decide they'd rather wait and collect a massive amount, and THEN PvP.


As NJ said, it's dilution of our value as a profession that's most concerning to me. I pay my skill points like anyone else. Hands off my skills and passing them off as any random loot item in the game. Makes me feel less valuable as a player.


Landlubber
Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:00 pm
#12






LyteFoot wrote:

They will probably be powerful and plentiful. The SOE solution to not being able to find buffs in off peak hours is to simply remove entertainers from the equation. After all its a social class, isn't grouping and chatting good enough?


They don't get it, they won't get it, they can't get it.







You know, that was exactly my thought when I read about this. The Devs aren't interested in fixing our professions, that would be way too much work. As always, they'll take the easy way out, which in this case means making our sole way in which we are connected to the SWG economy at large available to non-entertainers, thus crowding us out of the market.


Sorry for the negativity, but until the Devs go to great lengths to convince us otherwise, I think our professions are on the way out, the experiment of having a social play-style in an MMORPG has failed through mismanagement and lack of attention on their part.


Message Edited by Landlubber on 11-05-2004 12:01 AM



______________________________________________________
The Ti'lya Brothers: Ailar (Entertainer/Chimaera, DG Trader/Bria),
Klofi (Smuggler/Chimaera) -- Cancelled,
"You have a right to be upset. Anyone who is attached to any profession that doesn't get a lot of new content has a right to be upset." -- HanseSOE
______________________________________________________
Raph Koster on: "SWG: What went wrong?"


Warryyr
Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:18 pm
#13






Landlubber wrote:






LyteFoot wrote:

They will probably be powerful and plentiful. The SOE solution to not being able to find buffs in off peak hours is to simply remove entertainers from the equation. After all its a social class, isn't grouping and chatting good enough?


They don't get it, they won't get it, they can't get it.







You know, that was exactly my thought when I read about this. The Devs aren't interested in fixing our professions, that would be way too much work. As always, they'll take the easy way out, which in this case means making our sole way in which we are connected to the SWG economy at large available to non-entertainers, thus crowding us out of the market.


Sorry for the negativity, but until the Devs go to great lengths to convince us otherwise, I think our professions are on the way out, the experiment of having a social play-style in an MMORPG has failed through mismanagement and lack of attention on their part.



Message Edited by Landlubber on 11-05-2004 12:01 AM






A thought occurred to me, though.


If they stripped all benefits from Entertainers, it would pretty much make having a buffbot alt pointless. We could still entertain, and the only Entertainers left would be the ones who really entertain.


This could be done if and only IF they INCREASE mission payouts for the love of God. We will most definitely need a way to make money. I don't like charity or pity credits.


But, it would cleanse the populace of their current attitude towards Entertainers. Also, when our benefits were finally put in, if they made it only possible to do things ATK then maybe they actually could annhilate AFK playing and the crappy attitude so many players have towards us.


Things are looking rather bleak, though - if they don't say one darn word to us about what their plans are for us. This could be very, very bad. I agree that entertaining, as it currently exists in SWG, is a failure to an extent. Mainly because of a ridiculous lack of action the Devs' part - they brought this upon themselves. The system has serious problems. And we have some serious shortcomings when it comes to things at our disposal to entertain with.


I think word from the Devs in here to explain what the hell is going is pretty much a necessity.


BWAHAHAHA - word from the Devs....oh maaaaan, I slay me! hahahahaha.

Message Edited by Warryyr on 11-04-2004 03:20 PM

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