Musician Archive
Thread: No string instrument for me?!?!
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M_Fechter
Wed Mar 02, 2005 10:45 pm
#1
As a musician who did not master entertainer, but hopes to master Musician before SOE releases EQ8 in 2026, are there no string instruments I can play?
I found out today that the mandolovi (or what ever its called) is only for master Entertainers. BS I say! I want a string instrument.
Any hint of them adding new instruments in the future?
bawler14
Thu Mar 03, 2005 12:27 am
#2
All we have is hearsay and data files at this point. Apparently, a stringed instrument, the Xantha was available among the Western data files when it came out. However, the Xantha has yet to appear in game or appear in any of the other songs. Speculation says it will come out eventually.
Try searching for "Xantha" here on the musician board for more info.
Caliet
Thu Mar 03, 2005 10:28 am
#3
I personally like the fact that Master Entertainer is the only profession with this feature. It is the only real reward a master entertainer gets, making Master Entertainer a wothwhile profession.
omadnay
Thu Mar 03, 2005 9:40 pm
#4
Welcome aboard!
It has always been my opinion that a Master Musician should recieve the cert for the mandoviol in the Master Musician Box.
Master Entertainers should still get it at thier box as well.
I think it is enough of a reward for Master Entertainers to recieve that cert in thier master box.
Seriously, getting a Master Musician certed instrument at master entertainer would be a very worthwhile reward.
Like I said, that has always been my opinion... and it remains just that... my opinion.
May the force be with you.
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
It has always been my opinion that a Master Musician should recieve the cert for the mandoviol in the Master Musician Box.
Master Entertainers should still get it at thier box as well.
I think it is enough of a reward for Master Entertainers to recieve that cert in thier master box.
Seriously, getting a Master Musician certed instrument at master entertainer would be a very worthwhile reward.
Like I said, that has always been my opinion... and it remains just that... my opinion.
May the force be with you.
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
Mariki
Thu Mar 03, 2005 11:54 pm
#5
The Mando is probably the biggest reason so many master musicians also carry master entertainer.
Of course its a nice bonus to be able to do your own cosmeticsand everyone should know a few dance steps too 
Gknee
Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:08 am
#6
Caliet wrote:
I personally like the fact that Master Entertainer is the only profession with this feature. It is the only real reward a master entertainer gets, making Master Entertainer a wothwhile profession.
but the saddest part of it..is that Image Designers and Dancers really have no "rewards" for mastering Entertainer. but...that's another forum...<giggle>
Bronski113
Fri Mar 04, 2005 7:45 am
#7
I personally like the fact that the mando is only for master entertainers. Show's i took the extra step and earned it.
Really if it was certed for both master musician and entertainer no one would master entertainer since the majority of people who want it are master musicians.
Really if it was certed for both master musician and entertainer no one would master entertainer since the majority of people who want it are master musicians.
omadnay
Fri Mar 04, 2005 9:07 am
#8
Bronski113 wrote:
I personally like the fact that the mando is only for master entertainers. Show's i took the extra step and earned it.
Really if it was certed for both master musician and entertainer no one would master entertainer since the majority of people who want it are master musicians.
I really think that line of thought is the problem.
Mastering Entertainer shouldn't be to get an instrument that a Master Musician can't use... it should be to get all-around entertainer skills, a little bit of the three branches.
If Master Musicians are spending the extra 34 skill points JUST to get the mandoviol, I think that's a problem.
They should be spending it to know a few dances and have some image design skills.
106 skill points is enough of a burden for someone with one account that wants to be a master musician AND an adventurer.
This is an old debate, one that we will probably never agree upon.
I just think it's really selfish of all the people that "Like being a Master Entertainer so they can have the mandoviol". "They earned it"
Come on... it's an instrument... Master Entertainer should have some other type of bonuses to make it worthwhile to master both the elite and novice, not an instrument that the Master Musician cannot play.
No kidding it's the only reason anyone masters it. That doesn't make it a good thing.
Again, if you only want to spend 77 points, you can get the mandoviol.
Or you should be able to spend 106 points and get the mandoviol.
And let's not just compare the skill points... how about the xp?
Doing Master Musician is enough to "earn" it.
Giving a Master Musician Cert to a Master Entertainer is a fair sollution.
It's just that the Master Entertainers don't seem to like that idea too much.
Prima donnas!!
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
May the force be with you.
Mariki
Fri Mar 04, 2005 9:21 am
#9
My alt is a master riflewoman. There are some nice abilities and specials if she had master marksman also but she couldn't spare the skill points. The Mando is just one instrument. Ceremonial is just one song. They are what you get if you can spare the skillpoints for master entertainer. It really isn't unreasonable and follows the same model of all professions. You gain no additional experience playing a mando or ceremonial also. Just asmy altwould gain no additional experience using the specials if she had master marksman. I have never heard a valid arguement for it being any other way then it is. You have your master level song and you can play it on any other instrument except the Mando. And too many mandos in a band is really not a good thing also
omadnay
Fri Mar 04, 2005 10:54 am
#10
Mariki wrote:My alt is a master riflewoman. There are some nice abilities and specials if she had master marksman also but she couldn't spare the skill points. The Mando is just one instrument. Ceremonial is just one song. They are what you get if you can spare the skillpoints for master entertainer. It really isn't unreasonable and follows the same model of all professions. You gain no additional experience playing a mando or ceremonial also. Just as my alt would gain no additional experience using the specials if she had master marksman. I have never heard a valid arguement for it being any other way then it is. You have your master level song and you can play it on any other instrument except the Mando. And too many mandos in a band is really not a good thing also
With Novice Profession Master Boxes, you can get modifiers and special maneuvers, but not certifications. A Master Marksman does not gain a cert for a unique weapon that a rifleman cannot use. Overcharge Shot2 does not compare to any special within the Rifleman Profession, but the mandoviol certainly can hold it's own with any instrument in the Musician's Profession. You cannot say that the mandoviol has no visual/entertainment impact on what a musician does, just the same as different weapons improve, or at least diversify, a combat player's game. I'm not talking about xp or better results. I'm talking about what matters to the profession(s) in question... combat prowess for a rifleman and the actual abilitity to entertain (visually/audially, not pure game-mechanics) for a Musician.
So, it honestly doesn't follow the model of all other profession.
To be perfectly honest though... artisan is another story. Master Artisan is quite a valid profession on it's own. We could compare entertainer more to the crafting professions, but I don't think that really works either.
Entertainers are vastly different than all other professions though, so I guess neither of us should use that for our cases.
"They are what you get if you can spare the skill points"
That's exactly my problem with it.
Master Entertainer, for most people, is all about getting something extra on the side of MUSIC...
Not general Entertaining, but entirely in the realm of music, which of course is what the Musician Profession is all about.
It's an arguement for taking something from one Elite Profession and putting into the Novice Profession to make it worthwhile.
That is what they did, when they changed it in Beta.
It used to be a Musician Cert, but they switched it to make Master Entertainer more appealing.
In my opinion, Master Entertainer should offer special visual effects (As in Dazzle, Colored Lights, etc.) that are unique to that profession.
Other bonuses or modifiers would be great, if they could think of some.
To be honest, I feel more strongly about Ceremonial being granted at Master Musician than the mandoviol itself.
You say that you've never heard a valid arguement for it being any other way than it is...
I could honestly say the same for the way that it is now.
I'd like to ask, what is not valid about my arguement?
* A Master Musician should be able to play the mandoviol and know how to play "Ceremonial". As a Master of Music, thier skill is high enough and thier experiences are broad enough, that they should be able to play the instrument and certainly know the song.
* The Master Entertainer Box should not be based entirely around gaining musical content that a Master Musician does not have. It seems that most (If not all) claim that this is the only reason to have Master Entertainer. The mandoviol and ceremony are pure musical content... enormous musical content. They are easily as appealing (If not more appealing) than anything else the musician/entertainer can acquire. A musician's appeal is equal to a combatant's combat prowess.
* I suggest that the Master Entertainer should be rewarded the certs for the mandoviol and ceremony. These two certs should also be placed in the Master Musician Box. While the Master Entertainer Box should not be based entirely around musical content, this would still give it a largely appealing reward to those that are not Master Musicians.
I don't mean to jump up and down on anyone just because they do not agree with me.
Hopefully my post is not taken too strongly... sometimes the way I debate comes off a bit harsh.
I think TH said once, "think of it more like a casual conversation at a small table in a coffee shop".
Taking that into consideration, people's posts can seem much different and even more productive/constructive.
Ever since he said that, I've wished that we could attach ambient music to our posts.
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
May the force be with you.
Mariki
Fri Mar 04, 2005 5:26 pm
#11
I suppose from an RP standpoint a master musician should know all songs and play all the limited selection of instruments made avail, just as everyone should have some dance knowledge. The cost is high to hold all these master of entertaining fields and leaves very little to do anything else. Truthfully, if I did not have an alt, I would probably not have enough to do as I do like to explore combat to a degree and crafting. Also mining has always paid the bills. Because my entertainer has all her SP just to entertain, its not a problem for me but it was before I created my alt. It seems a shame to exclude people from content in the game because they don't have the skill points but its the way its set up. I have always thought the first box in the basic skills were too high. That probably isn't a problem when it comes to entertaining but if it was lowered, then the combat professions would be more out of whack then they are now. Intil SOE is willing to give up more skill points, I suppose there isn't much we can do. I really do feel for those master musicians who can't play a mando or ceremonial but I'm afraid they have no plans to change the basic game model. I know the normal comparisions are to combat medics and doctors, but theyhave much higher combat value in the GCW then entertainers. Perhaps they should take that into consideration when it comes to thehigh skill point inventments of entertainers. I pay double each month just so I have a entertainer for mostly RP purposes.
omadnay
Fri Mar 04, 2005 9:24 pm
#12
Yeah, I have to tell you... it's a reall bummer when I'm a Master Musician in a band and they /change to ceremonial.
You just want to hide behind your nalargon. :/
(Where's that announcement?)
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
May the force be with you.
You just want to hide behind your nalargon. :/
(Where's that announcement?)
- Omadda Szool
Kauri
May the force be with you.
ArcadyHerigorn
Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:41 pm
#13
At 3:00am I Mastered Musician and couldn't wait to get back to the Cantina and play the Mondovial and my new song. I get back and find that the instrument that I was suppose to be able to play in Music Tech 3 (I think) I still didn't have the "skill" to play. Ok I have no problem with Master Entertainers having a special instrument and/or special song. What gets me is the misleading way this instrument was on the skill page for Master Musician. Why is it part of the skills promised when you complete the skill box if a Master can't play it?
There is no explanation like "skill granted only if you have mastered (fill in blank)" This kind of thing leads to major disappointment, frustration and confusion. Not to mention the fact that i spent credits on purchasing a worthless instrument based on the confusing way it was presented as a skill I could have as a Master Musician.
And as long as I am ranting...What is up with the Master Musician level song? I mean out of the 10? songs we "learn" while Mastering this profession I assumed the Master Level would be the most awesome....something that displayed your mastery and knowledge. A song that would stick out to an audience on its own since few can play it as a band. I forgot what it was called but it is horrible to me, not at all worth working so hard to acquire. And YES, 98% of my Musician experience was ATK so it was just as "hard" a grind as any other profession.
And another thing! Why is the narglon and omni box so stupid to play. As the ATK leader of the group I can tell you it was major frustration and anger to constantly lose tons of xp because i couldn't target group members, buff patrons, and my accompiment droid to manage the group without stopping playing music.
I know there are many professions that need a serious looking into and changes and I hope Master Musician is one of them that is done soon.
My suggestions would be redo the skill page to be more in tune with what really happens to the Musician as far as what they really achieve.
Redo the songs!
Redo the instruments so there is a distinct difference, not the same repeating instrumentation sounds with so many insturments.
Here is an idea...At master level create a terminal so that a Master Musician can go and create an actual song. Upon activating the terminal a menu could come up that allows the musician to make some choices of tempo, accompiment and harmony. When thats selected a full notation screen for the melody could come up and allow the musician to actually write the music. When completed a song schematic could be made that allows the Master Musician to sell, hire others to perform etc. Does that make sense. I think that would be fun and give some uniqueness to the process.
Ok, done ranting, done suggesting....
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