Merchant Archive
Thread: Let the Master Merchant creaft a vending machine
Naufragus wrote:
but we will only have 150 items we can sell...no one will be able to take his goods.
I have high hopes that it won't be as low as 150 when we get the final decision on what they are going to do. But..if they are trying to limit it to 150 per vendor..they aren't going to also put in code that increases the number of vendors..that defeats the purpose of restricting the number of items for sale.
Why would I want to allow someone to buy the use of my skills that I had to spend skill points on to have? If Merchant create and sell vendors, then anyone at all will be able to have a vendor. If we're gonna allow anyone to use vendors via a deed, then why not have architects make them and do away with Merchants all together?
And if this goes through, you will see two things from me:
1. Vendor deeds sell for 10 million credits each
2. I want tobuy deeds for commando flame thrower skills and bh eyeshot skills
Korrack wrote:
Why would I want to allow someone to buy the use of my skills that I had to spend skill points on to have? If Merchant create and sell vendors, then anyone at all will be able to have a vendor. If we're gonna allow anyone to use vendors via a deed, then why not have architects make them and do away with Merchants all together?
It's an interesting question, Korrack. Back before the big CH nerf, the master CHs were up in arms because everyone and their newbie had powerful pets.
Where did all those powerful pets come from? High-ranked CHs!
In other words, the problem stemmed from the very people who were complaining about it. If the CHs had kept their critters to themselves, they would have continued to feel special and unique. Instead they gave them away, or more likely sold them.
I have also heard that sliced weapons and spices were originally thought to be something that would give Smugglers an edge over other players. Instead they are a market commodity because smugglers sell their services.
The fact is, being a successful "merchant" in the sense of buying stuff and then selling it for more has nothing to do with skill boxes. Any shop-keep with a vendor is not stealing your sales. Most of them are just selling their own stuff. Your ability to make money buying and selling comes from your out-of-game willingness to do so, far more than the in-game tools. You can't sell that!
A vendor isn't really a skill, it's a tool. People sell their tools all the time in this game.
THAT, is the best well thought out argument I have heard in favor of allowing non merchants to buy/rent vendors from Merchants. I still disagree with it in principle, but not in rational thought.
The argument still remains as to what the purpose and intent of the Merchant class itself in the game is. If it is to be shopkeepers and sell wares made by crafters, then letting the crafters sell their own wares will hurt the intent of merchant. If it is a supply house for people too lazy to sell their own stuff or as an add on to a crafter or as a source of vendors, then that it will still hurt the profession in my opinion.
I honestly have no problem with a crafter "renting" a vendor from me for a %, or me placing a vendor, but they can manage it and I get a percent. I have never liked the idea of non merchants owning or controlling vendors. I have 3 vendors out on "loan" as I write this. The people offer up at the price they want to sell at, I buy and put it up for sale at a mark up, or at the same price depending on my mood. Honestly, having them be able to admin the vendor would be an ease on my life, but I want an automatic cut of the profits, and I want to be required for the vendor to exist.
The question is the value of the profession and the skills. The merchant skilsl are obviously worth something, because everyone seems to want them regardless of how useless they say they are.
It's an interesting question, Korrack. Back before the big CH nerf, the master CHs were up in arms because everyone and their newbie had powerful pets.
Where did all those powerful pets come from? High-ranked CHs!
Ideas I must disagree with you here. The CH's was meant to sell pets to non-CHs, hence the ability of non-ch's to control low level pets. The problem was that some low level pets had good armoured rating, damage resistance, and HAM and low damage output, and therefore was excellent for tanking. So a non-ch could send in his rock beetle to attack and then shoot from a safe distance and heal it when necessary.
Non-CH's was not using rancor's or maulers or even GSP, they was using rock beetles. Then there was the problem of CH dabblers getting all the power of the profession by only taking 2 lines (just like the merchants have it now), but that had nothing to do with Non-ch's.
CH's was not renting out CH skills, they was selling over powered pets.
I have also heard that sliced weapons and spices were originally thought to be something that would give Smugglers an edge over other players. Instead they are a market commodity because smugglers sell their services.
Then that is another case of bad design, and not an argument for making merchants rent out skills. The fact that the game mechanics does not deal with people using and dealing in spices, despite thair descriptions saying that they are illegal, is sad.
But about the slicing, I think smugglers was mend to sell the sliced guns on, why else would the weapon smiths be the ones making weapon upgrade kits, and why would non pistol weapons be sliceable (smuggler is build on unarmed and pistol, not rifle or carabineer)
The fact is, being a successful "merchant" in the sense of buying stuff and then selling it for more has nothing to do with skill boxes. Any shop-keep with a vendor is not stealing your sales. Most of them are just selling their own stuff. Your ability to make money buying and selling comes from your out-of-game willingness to do so, far more than the in-game tools. You can't sell that!
All the more reason to not allow ANYONE but merchants to have vendors. Business sense and trading with other players cannot be regulated throe game mechanics. Therefore, the merchant profession should provide the tools to make playing a merchant character more accessible and less time consuming.
A vendor isn't really a skill, it's a tool. People sell their tools all the time in this game.
I do not se any other profession renting out or selling thair tools. I cannot use scout or ranger traps, nor camps or cameo kits, that is the tools of thoughts professions.
I cannot use seeker droids or prope-bots to track down marks, and thoughts ate the tools of the BH.
I cannot use stim with out being a novice medic, and then only the low level ones.
The only profession that can be said to remotely sell thair tools is the CH, and that is by design.
So tell me, what profession is selling or renting out thair tools?
Tarnak_Archvold wrote:
All the more reason to not allow ANYONE but merchants to have vendors. Business sense and trading with other players cannot be regulated throe game mechanics. Therefore, the merchant profession should provide the tools to make playing a merchant character more accessible and less time consuming.
A vendor isn't really a skill, it's a tool. People sell their tools all the time in this game.
I do not se any other profession renting out or selling thair tools. I cannot use scout or ranger traps, nor camps or cameo kits, that is the tools of thoughts professions.
I cannot use seeker droids or prope-bots to track down marks, and thoughts ate the tools of the BH.
I cannot use stim with out being a novice medic, and then only the low level ones.
The only profession that can be said to remotely sell thair tools is the CH, and that is by design.
So tell me, what profession is selling or renting out thair tools?
ok.. 1) i have one of the most succesful arc businesses on my server... easily 3-5 mil goes through my hands every day .. either resourse purchases or deed sales.. pretty much on my server there are 3 names that come up if u want deeds... I have never had a merchant ask to sell my goods... plus the success of my business has been how it has and will be marketed.. so i run a VERY high risk now handing over marketing to this third party.. once the deed is his.. he controls how its sold..
0k..2) .. not a fan of the idea to rent a vendor from a merchant either.. even if i have "admin" rights.. in case that char gets deleted.. there goes the goods.. and what not..
ok .. 3) the skill is not using vendor +1.. it is hiring vendor + 1.. the skill is all in the ability to aquire the service of the vendor.. so all of the examples of cant use a tent.. cant use a stim are invalid.. cuz those u actually need skill to use.. i could go on for ever on all the reasons that makes this concept make sense..
ok.. 4) the whole problem with this profession is that everyone is trying to think it must focus around vendors.. personally .. i think merchants should get other skills .. like.. special packs.. that hold twice the limit of normal packs.. special vehicles that.. can hold cargo too.. so there can be merchant transporting.. really expanding what a merchant can do .. should be upmost priority over limiting vendor use...
ok..5) removing vendors from everyone else.. will do more harm than good.. you will see more crafter giving crafting up all together becuz of it becoming more of a nuesance to sell there crafts.. just as u have the choice to become a merchant.. and persue that avenue of roleplay.. the master weaponsmith should be able to choose his path and not be limited unless he accepts being forced into mastering another profession as well...
oh btw master merchant am I...
Crafting a vending machine deed is not selling your skill points, its like CH or a BE making and selling pets. It is not the same like getting a deed fora flame thrower and use it against PVP or PVE, vending machine is not a weaponaffecting other player's play style.
My suggestion is to allow Master Merchants to craftvending machine deeds with a time duration, like 3 weeks or 4 weeks by its quality (experiment with cr as one of the components). Once a player place the deed, she/he then have to purchase a renewal contract (craftable again by Merchants) to keep the vending machine running. What's bad about this? It's a win win situation. SOE, can you make this happen?
Momobear wrote:
Crafting a vending machine deed is not selling your skill points, its like CH or a BE making and selling pets. It is not the same like getting a deed fora flame thrower and use it against PVP or PVE, vending machine is not a weaponaffecting other player's play style.
My suggestion is to allow Master Merchants to craftvending machine deeds with a time duration, like 3 weeks or 4 weeks by its quality (experiment with cr as one of the components). Once a player place the deed, she/he then have to purchase a renewal contract (craftable again by Merchants) to keep the vending machine running. What's bad about this? It's a win win situation. SOE, can you make this happen?
It is differnet than a CH and a BE who's skill is making the pets. Our skill is selling things. We would be giving you the ability to do the exact same thing we do without the skills..it would be like the CH giving you a pet that reproduced and allowed you to transfer the additional pets.. you would become the CH not just use the product of the CH's talents...
<....it would be like the CH giving you a pet that reproduced and allowed you to transfer the additional pets.. you would become the CH not just use the product of the CH's talents... >
This is weak argument. If we only allow Master Merchant to craft a vending machine deed with a limited running time and sell it to those who needed, and also only allow Merchants with certain skills to craft renewal contract for the vending mahcine, what do these have to do with your 'reproducing' situation stated? The vending machine will not sustain without Merchants' involvements thus reslove the 'throw away merchant skills' issue,furthermore,this willalso address those ppls dropping the merchant skill once they get the vending machine up and running. I don't see a strong argument you have against this idea.