Merchant Archive
Thread: Some reasons why vendors should stay after you drop Merchant.
1. The Bazaar is a heap of ultra-low end garbage. Allowing players, especially artisans, but also loot hunters, to place a few vendors around is a good thing.
2. The merchant uses their skill to HIRE someone. We then pay their salary to sell goods for us. Raise the price of vendor maintenance to something like 3x or 5x for those who drop merchant.
3. Taking vendors away from all non-merchants would result in a server wide catastrophe. Hundreds of shops would vanish, thousands of items too. Seems its a whole lot easier just to raise the fees on non-merchants and let all the vendors stick around.
Um no.. if you want a vendor in your house spend and KEEP thepoints in it. If I drop doctor and still have a ton of revive packs I don't think I should still be able to revive. If a CH drops pet management and they still have the pets in their D-pad I don't think they should expect to still be able to control pets beyond their lvl of skill. If I get an AsAT as an IMP and go Neutral should I still be able to use it?
Why is this such a strange concept for people to accept. What does the bazar have to do with it? If Idrop a skill Ishould not be able to continue to use it's benefits. As for increased maintenance the rate of maintenace for NPC vendors is absurdly low already - money has nothing to do with it. It is all about the skill points. All these people who you think should be able to place vendors ie, loot hunters etc.. they already can.. it just costs them skill points.. just like I have to spend points if I want to survey or harvest or terrain negotiate (I am a doc/with merchant trees). As for what would be "easier" - it would be easier to warn all players in advance that this is going to happen then wipe them ALL out at once. Very easy IMO and it shouldnt be a big surprise to players when this happens.
As for the server wide crisis - all I have to say is "No chicken little.. the sky will not come down on our heads.. we will survive."
I understand the conern of Merchantswith a playerdropping Merchant and keeping vendors. I have also heard/read "Hire a merchant to sell you wares".
If a nerf goes through this is my concern.
Merchantsbuy products ascheap as possible, forcing the crafting community to lower thier prices in order to use a merchant. Merchants then jack up the price to the consumers gaining the profit.
Thats profit that I could / SHOULD have made for my time and effort and materials used. Why should somone else gain from my hard work?
I can see why the "high markup" thing may be a concern for some. If this is the case get merchant yourslef and make some money - yes a choice would have to be made ie, give up combat skills..maybe a bleed attack OR spend the points in vendor. This is a thing merchants have had to do - and/or will have to do as they should have too - so what's new here?
Do you really think a pair of Nikes cost's 255$ to make so that they can be sold at 300$ for a 15% market up? There are many ways to sell your stuff if you think merchants with vendors are going to "gouge" you and I doubt that all merchants are going to do this and if they do ask yourslef "What is adozen or so skill points in merchantworth - 10% - 20% 50%?
Supply and Demand is what will prevail.
The skill tree is called "management" and is described as "each rank in Management grants the Merchants to place an additional Vendor" - "Place" not "Use"
Once you hire and place a vendor, you have used the skill to hire and place them... they are there. If you suddenly unlearn that skill, it doesnt mean you didnt hire and place that vendor - it just means you cant hire and place any more vendors.
This is not the same as acquiring the skill to use a Flamethrower and then unlearning that skill. Or acquiring the skill to use medicines and then unlearning that skill....in those cases if you drop a skill, all the people you shot with your flamethrower do not suddenly gain back the damage you did. What you did while you still had the skill is doesnt change. The Flamethrower doesnt disappear, heck you can even still use it!! You just loose the skill to use it effectively.
Dropping the Management tree should not mean you lose the things you did while you had the skill, it should mean that you cant do them again (until you re-learn it)
-Skout Finch
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I think this is the misunderstanding.
No one is keeping skills. People who drop that tree can no longer place vendors... they have lost the skill, they didnt keep it.
The only thing that was 'kept' was what was done with the skill.... much like your wounds would still be healed if the person who just healed you suddenly dropped medic.
Skout Finch
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Attikus wrote:
"It was never intended that you be able to keep skills once you drop the skill points. "
I think this is the misunderstanding.
No one is keeping skills. People who drop that tree can no longer place vendors... they have lost the skill, they didnt keep it.
The only thing that was 'kept' was what was done with the skill.... much like your wounds would still be healed if the person who just healed you suddenly dropped medic.
Skout Finch
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I think you are just arguing semantics. By your logic Me (as a Master merchant) has just placed a vendor for a total of 6. Oh wait that placement was done with what I did with that skill...so i should be able to place another one? If someone whohas NO additional vendor skill can have6 then I guess a master merchant should be able to have infinite +6? See where this is going? Your logic does not make any sense either. The way the Additional vendor skill is supposed to work is that at master merchant you can have 6 vendors total, at novice merchant you can have 2 total. You should not be able to place 6 vendors then drop all the skills and keep the vendors.
So you hit Master, you can use your skill and place your 6 vendors. If you then untrain master, that doesnt negate what you have already done while you were a master. The skill is not "keeping vendors" or "using vendors" - it is "placing" vendors.
The ability granted by the Management skill tree is the actual physcial placement of the vendor. No where in there does it describe these abilities as the abilities to use or keep said vendors.
So again, using that skill produces a vendor in your house... untraining Merchant so you no longer have that skill simply means that you can no longer place vendors. It doesnt mean you cant reap the benefits of the skill that you already used.
Think of it this way.... if I train up to Master Weaponsmith and create a custom weapon for myself by experimenting on its HAM values using the added skills points afforded me by my new position.... and then, after making the weapon, I untrain master weaponsmith - should I no longer reap the benefit of the lower HAM that was a product of the skills I used in making that weapon? Sinply because I no longer have the ability to make them like that anymore?
Another way to think of it.... If I train up the Creature Handler proffession and train my pets at mounts, when I back down out of this proffession, do my pets suddenly lose the ability to be mounted?
No, of course not. I already used the skill. So untraining it simply means I can not use it again, it DOES NOT mean that what I did while I had it can no longer be used.
It's not semantics, its exactly the way it is described in the game and it just so happens to be exactly the way it works. This is the way ALL skills work in this game.... I dont undestand why its so confusing.
When you untrain out of the Creature Handler Profession the maximum amount of stored pets begin to decrease. But you do not lose the pets that you have already stored when you new skill level drops below the amount of pets that you currently have. Why? Because you have already STORED them. The skill was already used. When you train down out of the profession it simply means that you can not store that amount of pets anymore - it DOESNT mean that ones that you have already stored go poof.
Exact same scenario. Works correctly in this instance too, because the skill is 'storing' pets, not 'keeping stored pets'
Ya you (CH's) can train them but you can't use them any more. Stopplaying lawyer that **edit** gets old. If somone is no longer a merchant, that istheirchoice, lose the points/lose the vendor, free lunch is over.
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