Merchant Archive
Thread: My take on the upcoming Vendor and Merchant changes
DragonScout
Tue Jun 15, 2004 12:15 pm
#105
Lot of babbling went on today. same junk, different day.
Dead topic merchant boys. How about you all be the better men/women/flamers and just say, hahahahahahahaha, we won, it is getting fixed, and drop it/ignore it. Then maybe you could go and post ideas to better your profession as a whole? Since you all think that as soon as vendor poaching is fixed, you are going to get the rest of your profession fixed, wouldn't that be more productive?
It is really getting pathetic that all these topics throughout the merchant forums are constantly dragged down by the vendor poaching preacher team. Like p4samwise said.. I mainly read here because I find it fun in a perverse way, especially when I beat down flames and bad logic -- or much more likely, broad and vague and unsupported opinions. But that is just me. And I for one, instead of bashing people who are just asking questions -- regardless if they are questions that annoy me, I try to answer them or refer them to where they can get answers. Because I find that pissing off people who might or might not do the 'right' thing, tends to just put a bee in their pants and get them hopping towards the 'wrong' thing to do, just to spite me. lol. But again, that is just me.
oh, and to me, the sad part is that 90% of the changes and improvements requested for your profession, are centered on vendors. It really is no wonder that people look at this profession as nothing but a utility profession when ALLLLLL it amounts to is placing vendors ONCE, and then stocking them for the rest of the time you are a merchant. They should change the name to The StockBoys Profession. StockBoys R Us!!! We stocks em daily for ya! lol. But hey... I guess I just have delusions of grandeur. And prefer to think big instead of concentrating on the crumbs I am thrown.
Dead topic merchant boys. How about you all be the better men/women/flamers and just say, hahahahahahahaha, we won, it is getting fixed, and drop it/ignore it. Then maybe you could go and post ideas to better your profession as a whole? Since you all think that as soon as vendor poaching is fixed, you are going to get the rest of your profession fixed, wouldn't that be more productive?
It is really getting pathetic that all these topics throughout the merchant forums are constantly dragged down by the vendor poaching preacher team. Like p4samwise said.. I mainly read here because I find it fun in a perverse way, especially when I beat down flames and bad logic -- or much more likely, broad and vague and unsupported opinions. But that is just me. And I for one, instead of bashing people who are just asking questions -- regardless if they are questions that annoy me, I try to answer them or refer them to where they can get answers. Because I find that pissing off people who might or might not do the 'right' thing, tends to just put a bee in their pants and get them hopping towards the 'wrong' thing to do, just to spite me. lol. But again, that is just me.
oh, and to me, the sad part is that 90% of the changes and improvements requested for your profession, are centered on vendors. It really is no wonder that people look at this profession as nothing but a utility profession when ALLLLLL it amounts to is placing vendors ONCE, and then stocking them for the rest of the time you are a merchant. They should change the name to The StockBoys Profession. StockBoys R Us!!! We stocks em daily for ya! lol. But hey... I guess I just have delusions of grandeur. And prefer to think big instead of concentrating on the crumbs I am thrown.
p4Samwise
Tue Jun 15, 2004 1:13 pm
#106
I never said I disagree with your point.
I just like pointing out flaws in the arguments used to support it. 
As to your last post - someone could just as easily say thatif vendors were intended to require skill to manage, they would cease functioning once the skills were dropped. You can't use the way the game works to support your point in one place, but then ignore it when it goes against your argument.
You can't use the way the game works to support your point in one place, but then ignore it when it goes against your argument.Balki's "rule" takes this into account by including the clause about the item "transferable/sellable", but really, that's completely arbitrary. A bug could pop up tomorrow that made vendors transferable and he'd modify the rule to accomodate it.
Songe
Tue Jun 15, 2004 1:37 pm
#107
Yeah, I agree, no need to look for crazy arguments to prove a point. For both sides 
Balkstar
Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:28 pm
#108
p4Samwise wrote:
Balkstar wrote:
Very simple rule. If you can trade an object and have it be used by someone who has never EVER had skillpoints allocated at any time to the profession that has created it, its a good.
Everything else is a tool.
I propose a different rule: there's no such thing as a tool. Only a good.
Now, how is your ruleany more validthan my rule?
That doesn't make it WRONG, of course, but using it to "support" a point as if it were a factis silly, because it's part of the point you're trying to support. Get me?
OK folks!! Everything is for sale!! No reasonable offer is to be refuesed!! Come one come all!
How much for your +50 dodge? Or your ability train a pet? Or your T21 certs? Or your Bone Harvesting? Should I go on?
Hey! This is a capitalist society that says that everything comes with a price. Lets take it to the extremes that Samwise wants us to. After all there are no tools in his little world, only goods.
p4Samwise
Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:36 pm
#110
Balkstar wrote:
How much for your +50 dodge?
Probably billions and billionsof credits, but you actually could buy that. Check your server trade forums.
Oo, THERE's an idea... "+1 vendor" and "+10 hiring" skill tapes! I'd definitely buy some o' them hiring ones if they existed...
But I digress. You haven't done anything to show that your rule can be used to support an argument, since it is not based on anything other than those same arguments.
Balkstar
Tue Jun 15, 2004 2:55 pm
#111
p4Samwise wrote:
Probably billions and billionsof credits, but you actually could buy that. Check your server trade forums.
Oo, THERE's an idea... "+1 vendor" and "+10 hiring" skill tapes! I'd definitely buy some o' them hiring ones if they existed...
But I digress. You haven't done anything to show that your rule can be used to support an argument, since it is not based on anything other than those same arguments.
Smart people concider the self-evident truth that tools are items that noone can access but the members of a particular profession that has the skills to manipulate them. They can't be manipulated, benefited from, or used by anyone else. Why is that such a hard conceptfor you to grasp? Most everyone else on the board has gotten it.
I'd rather refuse to make a list stating the huge numbers oftools throughout the game.
p4Samwise
Tue Jun 15, 2004 3:08 pm
#112
Balkstar wrote:
Smart people concider the self-evident truth that tools are items that noone can access but the members of a particular profession that has the skills to manipulate them.
I didn't even have to read past the first sentence this time to find something to make fun of you for.
So you're proving your point by saying that "smart people concider" it? And ofcourse, sincesmart people recognize (or concider)it, it must be true! Wow! What a master debater you are!
Fap fap fap.
StumanKadir
Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:45 pm
#113
It would be nice if this thread ended - its getting rather circular with the same old thing being said by the same folks.
One ending thought to this thread though. No formal announcement has been made that this fix is going ahead, and not date or patch release has been announced to say "its going to be released in patch 9.x, etc". I'd say that an agreement to have it fixed is a long way from actually having it fixed, and for myself, I can see SOE dragging this out as long as they can.
There is enough pain and misery coming from the forthcoming Jedi, Combat, mission payout downgradesand the armour nerf changes - thats lots of bad medicine to be feeding the player community. The merchant/vendor change is just one more bit of pain and it may be something SOE will prefer to sit on till the other changes have been bedded down and accepted.
And yep, they will risk alienating or annoying the much smaller merchant community at the risk of annoying the majority of the player community. But hey, thats just my opinion and I am probably wrong.
p4Samwise
Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:15 pm
#114
DingoBoi wrote:
forgive those, like deadra, who aren't so bright.
/throws eggs
It's true. Anyone who doesn't agree with Balki is stupid. He just said it, so it must be true.
Songe
Wed Jun 16, 2004 12:58 am
#115
If vendors were intended to be used by people without the skills, like schematics, they would be transferable/sellable. It's not the case.
You know, I've always been considered argumentative but playing with words trying toprove a point... Wow.
Ke_la
Thu Jun 17, 2004 1:13 am
#116
Don't forget one thing too... With the changes to Jedi everyone will be able to do what they want with their second slot, why not just pick up merchant with it? Just a thought.
yes but you only get a second slot after doing 22 missions and if what I saw on TC2 is how it will be implemented 22 Skill points, I am a MDE, and therefore NEED Martisan or I can build almost NOTHING, and am also my guildsMID, now I am able to have just enough points for 0-0-0-3 so guess what I am doing?
However, I do think that merchant NEEDS a revamp, however it MUST be done extreely carefully or what the creater of this threed said WILL happen. My personal Opionon is this instead of "buying on consinment" or "reselling" how about this change the proffesion to a true Mall set-up where on a branch Seperate from the Vendor Count is the ablitiy to Lease a vendor up to the 1 less then the Max you can create/control. At that point as "landlord" you can set ether a Set fee or a "Tax" much like the Proporty Tax and Sales Tax cities have. The Crafter would have Complete Admin Rights to the Vendor to Sell what they wish and once active as a leased location you would have no control over what is on the vendor to you it would act like someone esle's vendor with one major differance and that is the "Manager" Menu where you can adjust the cost of using your vendor as well as "evicting" a "tenent" however the stuff on the vendor would remain the proporty of the crafter that placed the Iteams on the vendor.
SargusQuintek
Thu Jun 17, 2004 3:38 am
#117
Well from my understanding you don't get to just pick it up. You will be required to do a series of missions to open that second slot. These missions are going to be time based which means that you will be prevented from doing them in a day. It will be stretched out over a period of time. Also I do not think these missions are going to be easy. If they just gave us the second character slot and allowed us to proceed with a non-Jedi character it would be that easy.