Merchant Archive
Thread: Why every Merchant poacher cry baby should be quiet....
kaspars_tenowog wrote:To be a successful self reliant crafter, you generally need to supply your own materials. In the case of tailor it takes metal, fiberplast, gemstone, and some type of polymer, all of which can easily be harvested for.. The rest of the materials which must be available in BULK are hides and even bone. In order to get hides you have to have scout skills, the higher the better for the best yield. In order to get the hides at all you must have decent combat skills, and as we all know when you fight a lot you get wounded and thus it's a good idea to have medical skills as well. In order to be successful or at the very least self reliantThis is a mmorpg you are not supposed to be totally self reliant. Maybe the people that have figured this very small fact out are the ones that are still having a lot of fun in the game because they have made friends and connections and have a sense of community instead a sense of only self.
A master ranger is your friend
Nothing that we sell really adds up to any HUGE figures to be able to pay ppl to supply us with resources whenever we need them. You are right though, I'm not an island thank god, none of us should be lol.
vanora wrote:
LOL very very true kaspars and I do indeed agree, just trying to make a point on where other skill points have gone in my case and perhaps other crafters as well.(also quite obviously I was in defesivemode there as wellya know?) It is a bit harder for tailors in that unless you have a good BE friend (mine quit the game
<--- heads back to the sandbox to play with the other kids as she should
Chloe (master tailor,TKM, bunny and other fuzzy critter killer, sunrunner)
Vanora (master CH, master medic, rifle shy of master marksman, tarquinas)
vanora wrote:LOL very very true kaspars and I do indeed agree, just trying to make a point on where other skill points have gone in my case and perhaps other crafters as well. (also quite obviously I was in defesive mode there as well ya know?) It is a bit harder for tailors in that unless you have a good BE friend (mine quit the game<--- heads back to the sandbox to play with the other kids as she shouldChloe (master tailor,TKM, bunny and other fuzzy critter killer, sunrunner)Vanora (master CH, master medic, rifle shy of master marksman, tarquinas)
Personally, I've got a second account (as in my sig) with Novice Scout/Hunting1 -- I don't bring in enough hide for my armorsmithing, but I supply myself for tailoring, and i've got a few rangers on my friendlist that i can e-mail out if a good hide spawn hits for my armorsmithing.
DragonScout wrote:
Chloe.. don't worry about some of the more.... 'out-going' merchants that post here. They like to turn anything they can into a preach session about the evils of vendor poaching. After a while you get used to it
Regardless of any changes, I haven't heard anywhere from a DEV or Doc, that they are going to remove business 3. As long as you keep that, which really isn't that much of a problem for an artisan, you won't need to worry about losing your vendor.
I haven't heard of any reason to remove the vendor from Business III nor have I ever supported such a thing. I do think the cost of running it is too low since it is exactly the same as a Novice merchant. It should cost more.
DragonScout wrote:
Chloe.. don't worry about some of the more.... 'out-going' merchants that post here. They like to turn anything they can into a preach session about the evils of vendor poaching. After a while you get used to it
Regardless of any changes, I haven't heard anywhere from a DEV or Doc, that they are going to remove business 3. As long as you keep that, which really isn't that much of a problem for an artisan, you won't need to worry about losing your vendor.
That is where you are so utterly wrong, Dragon. Your assumptions have proven false yet again. If you've ever taken a look at any postings that I do on any other board, including non SOE boards, you'll notice the utter lack of vitrial. Ask any of my friends (yes, I do have a few) and they will state that the attacks I throw out here are so out of character for me.
There are plenty of things to discuss about the professions that I am in the game that need addressing, or someone at least said they need addressing. Personally much of the game does not need the drastic facelift they tout. I normally am a go-with-the-flow person and make the best of bad situations. If this issue were suddenly to vanish, I would fall back into the shadows, content to play the game happily with the rest of you folks.
This issue though stings me to the core. Its the fact that players tout how they are using more skill thanpoints alloted to them, then complain bitterly how they will be screwed when the system will be fixed. It is the utmost in hypocrasy, and I'm here to be messengers to them with that message. What exploiters do here is wrong. They must pay a price, at the very least socially, for that behavior.
But that is just my opinion. And I am far from perfect, but I try to keep the flames down, and discuss the idea of a subject -- not the people that are on the other side of the table.
And by claiming that they must pay a price... you really do sound very vengeful. Like you are personally being hurt by this, like someone hurt you, or your family or something, instead of it just being a game. I could understand this kind of anger if someone shot you through a wall and you weren't able to shoot back, because that is a clear exploit of a bug that allows one player to gain a direct advantage over another. But with merchant, while vendor poaching may be wrong, it is no where near bad enough as all that.
If you are doing the right thing in your opinion, awesome great wonderful. You should keep doing it. But you shouldn't try to force your beliefs on anyone else. That isn't your place. If the game designers feel it isn't how it should be working, they will fix it -- like they have said they are going to. So it is really a pointless topic.
DragonScout wrote:
There is no assumption on my part. The only place I have seen you post is the merchant forums. I have drawn my conclusions from that.
There is plenty of assumption on your part, as you're looking at a very narrow field of data.
With that being said Dragon, go back through the merchant boards, and see how many threads on this subject have been created. Imagine yourself a member of a profession forum getting constantly bombarded by this. You could either leave, or fight back. Ignoring is another possiblity, but for a while the sheer volume of these threads damn near madethat impossible. Try to understand where Balk's coming from.
If you are doing the right thing in your opinion, awesome great wonderful. You should keep doing it. But you shouldn't try to force your beliefs on anyone else.
Tell that to the creator of this thread, along with everyone else who's created a similar thread in here...
So it is really a pointless topic.
On this point, we are in complete agreement.
mhal9000 wrote:
DragonScout wrote:
There is no assumption on my part. The only place I have seen you post is the merchant forums. I have drawn my conclusions from that.
There is plenty of assumption on your part, as you're looking at a very narrow field of data.
With that being said Dragon, go back through the merchant boards, and see how many threads on this subject have been created. Imagine yourself a member of a profession forum getting constantly bombarded by this. You could either leave, or fight back. Ignoring is another possiblity, but for a while the sheer volume of these threads damn near madethat impossible. Try to understand where Balk's coming from.
If you are doing the right thing in your opinion, awesome great wonderful. You should keep doing it. But you shouldn't try to force your beliefs on anyone else.
Tell that to the creator of this thread, along with everyone else who's created a similar thread in here...
So it is really a pointless topic.
On this point, we are in complete agreement.
I do. I blame them completely. Just because something angers or upsets you does not give you the right or justification to attack anyone else for any reason. That you think it does, proves a fundamental difference between us. I won't attack people, I will pick apart their ideas. But, I don't expect everyone to feel the same as me. I just find it funny that they can attack people for doing something they consider morally wrong -- using a utility in a game in a way that isn't exactly as intended -- yet have no problem with personally attacking them. I think it is mainly because it is an online forum. Most peoples 'morals' can change on the boards to suit their present needs, especially in forum arguments. I don't blame them for being upset, just their reactions.
"Well it allows one player to gain a direct advantage over another, by having a vendor, that is an income, without using the points, and thus having basically up to 100 more skill points than other players. I'm not personally for any kind of punishment for them, I just want the vendors to stop working so they can get their items back, except of course for the people who poach AND come complain here on the forums about how our profession sucks, we just want them all nerfed and everyone should be able to get a vendor for free anyway. Those should see their poached vendor disappear with everything that is on it." -- songe
It is not a direct advantage. maybe a slightly indirect advantage.. but not direct at all, because there ARE other means to sell items. If they took away the bazaar, if they took away the forums, and took away the 'trade' option.. then yes, people vendor poaching would be getting a direct advantage over other people. As it is now though, it just makes life easier for some people.
"There is plenty of assumption on your part, as you're looking at a very narrow field of data.
With that being said Dragon, go back through the merchant boards, and see how many threads on this subject have been created. Imagine yourself a member of a profession forum getting constantly bombarded by this. You could either leave, or fight back. Ignoring is another possiblity, but for a while the sheer volume of these threads damn near made that impossible. Try to understand where Balk's coming from. " -- mhal9000
Wrong again. It isn't assumption at all. It is hard cold fact. On the merchant forums, balkstar is more concerned with flaming people than constructive conversation, which is all I am concerned with. I was very specific. THESE forums. If I said all forums, it might be another story, I didn't. The last few days though he has been refraining from truly nasty personal attacks, but we will have to see if that change is here for good.
As far as understanding where he comes from...Yes, I can see it. But it still doesn't excuse his actions. When a dog is beat by its owner and ever after snaps at anyone that comes near it, we put that dog down because he then isn't fit to be part of society. Yes, the owner was not right in his actions, but is balkstar nothing more than an animal unable to control his own reactions? If so, he shouldn't be posting here.
"/bow to my Merchant Bretheren
See Dragon? I guess there are people on this board that truely understand where I come from on these posting.
They may not like me attacking the person, but they do know that I attack their points to with equal wieghting. There have been very few points made by you and your sympathizers that have swayed in the slightest any merchants position that A. Poaching is not damaging. B. That ending the bug that causes poaching should not be the one focus of the devs at this time." -- balkstar
I see that they still don't see the problem with your actions. They might agree with your point of view, but it is sad that they condone your actions. It says something about these boards. Perhaps there needs to be more moderation here by SOE employees if it is 'acceptable' to flame someone for asking a question contrary to the opinion of incredibly small percent of the more outspoken merchants' that post here. (because what.. songe says 15% or something of the population reads the forums.. and being generous there is what.. 5% 'true' master merchants.. so 15% of 5% gets us what? lol)
And just for the record, myself and p4samwise tend to pick your arguments apart with ease. I for one do it because I think it is fun to pick apart ungrounded arguments and because I don't like people bashed for asking questions. But it doesn't matter. Because there is no need to sway an opinion. I haven't even tried. And really, I don't think p4samwise was ever trying to sway your opinion on vendor poaching or anyone else. I think we both agree it wasn't intended. I just think we disagree with the trend of thought that makes vendor poaching the most important thing concerning merchants. Though I might be misrepresenting p4samwise. If I am, I am sorry
Anyways. Have a good evening
DragonScout wrote:
There is no assumption on my part. The only place I have seen you post is the merchant forums. I have drawn my conclusions from that. And from what I have seen, you find it hard, if not impossible, to post in a civil manner on just about anything in these forums. You attack people, not ideas -- when it should be the other way around, and a tad bit less on the 'attacking' side and more on the 'discussion' side. I shouldn't have to read other boards. Just because something bothers you beyond your limits to control yourself, doesn't mean other posters should be attacked.
But that is just my opinion. And I am far from perfect, but I try to keep the flames down, and discuss the idea of a subject -- not the people that are on the other side of the table.
And by claiming that they must pay a price... you really do sound very vengeful. Like you are personally being hurt by this, like someone hurt you, or your family or something, instead of it just being a game. I could understand this kind of anger if someone shot you through a wall and you weren't able to shoot back, because that is a clear exploit of a bug that allows one player to gain a direct advantage over another. But with merchant, while vendor poaching may be wrong, it is no where near bad enough as all that.
Well before you claim vengence you need to look at it form both sides. I am new to the merchant prof because of my alt. The community have not viewed merchant as a legitimate profession for 10 months or so because most people just drop it after getting their vendors. How would you take it if your profession that you liked was treated that way for so long. I do see many resentful remarks..but do you blame them. I don't
Well it allows one player to gain a direct advantage over another, by having a vendor, that is an income, without using the points, and thus having basically up to 100 more skill points than other players. I'm not personally for any kind of punishment for them, I just want the vendors to stop working so they can get their items back, except of course for the people who poach AND come complain here on the forums about how our profession sucks, we just want them all nerfedand everyone should be able to get a vendor for free anyway. Those should see their poached vendor disappear with everything that is on it.
Scoooter wrote:
DragonScout wrote:
And by claiming that they must pay a price... you really do sound very vengeful. Like you are personally being hurt by this, like someone hurt you, or your family or something, instead of it just being a game. I could understand this kind of anger if someone shot you through a wall and you weren't able to shoot back, because that is a clear exploit of a bug that allows one player to gain a direct advantage over another. But with merchant, while vendor poaching may be wrong, it is no where near bad enough as all that.