Merchant Archive
Thread: Dropping skills (NOT another can I keep my vendors? thread :-))
Songe wrote:
Hiring is just a waste, but I would think all of us will agree on that point
I don't actually, because so many people seem to want to have the custom clothing aspect on their vendors, as well as all the IshTib's, Ithorians, and what like. There must be some draw to it, if so many people crave it.
You are right in one respect:asthe code iswritten now,hiring is just a waste, but it is soon to be remedied.
p4Samwise wrote:
Balkstar wrote:
Nope, as it is a usable race of vendor NPC at Novice Merchant. I'll assume you had a lucky roll, since anyone can mindlessly reroll over and over and over until they get the perfect one. I'll grant you that little perk for free.
Agreed.
Now suppose that I'm a 0/0/1/0 Merchant (I have only the Hiring 1 skill box).I use my Hiring 1 skill to choose to place a human vendor.
My neighbor, Sleazoid, does not have Hiring 1. He randomly creates vendors until he also gets ahuman vendor.
I'm spending 5 more skill points than Sleazoid did, but we both have the same "tools" available to us at this point in time. Assuming that we never again reroll our vendors, I get exactly zero benefit from my Hiring 1 skill.
Is Sleazoid in the wrong for having the same benefits I do , despite only one of us having Hiring 1? Or is the real problem that Hiring 1 is only useful during the actual process of placing the vendor (because it cuts down on the number of mindless rerolls)?
And I would agree with you that this particular skill is rather useless, except in the interest of timesavings. There is a little value in it, just not enough to warrent a whole skill box, I grant you.
My interest in discussing this tree was purely on the types of races that can be chosen, and the custom clothing that could be dropped.
DragonScout wrote:
"I don't have a bad attitude towards the profession itself, just the current shape it has. There is little to it but being a stock boy/girl once you reach master. All the skills are geared towards setting up vendors, and once you do that, you are done. And that seems sad to me when Merchant could/should be one of the most involved and rewarding professions in the game."
The profession itself and the current shape of the profession are wildly different things. The current shape centers around stocking vendors, and that is pointless and worthless if you consider that the entire profession gives you nothing to help with anything else. If merchant as the profession currently is, was removed today, and yet vendors were left open to anyone, few would actually notice, and most of those would be crafters who would be like, 'about freaking time' and go on with their lives without putting skillpoints into something they barely use. Hell, even 'true' merchants wouldn't notice except for an increase in maintence fees and a lack of titles.
Does this mean I don't think the profession can be saved? no. Or I wouldn't post so much trying to get you all to see the big picture that involves actually fixing the profession as a whole, instead of just reinforcing the warehouse stocker attitude most of you seem to want the profession to be.
Balkstar wrote:
And I would agree with you that this particular skill is rather useless, except in the interest of timesavings. There is a little value in it, just not enough to warrent a whole skill box, I grant you.
And by all appearances, the skill was designed like that - so that it grants its benefit solely at the time the vendor is created. Right? It's impossible to imagine the skill being intended to be useful at any other time, even if you suppose that its use is supposed to be related to being able to control a particular type of vendor, because the skill doesn't even grant you the usage of any new vendor types.
This implies, to me, that the entire tree was designed the same way - to be useful at the time a vendor is created. And that's why they named it "Hiring". 
Of course, this is all conjecture, but like I said, I think it's fairly well grounded conjecture.
However, I think a far better discussion to have (since I see it beginning to germinate here) iswhat the actual value of vendor customizations is, and whether it's appropriate for there to be an entire skill tree devoted to them, be it for "placement" or "management" of these special vendor types.
The way I see it, the Hiring tree is the *only* skill tree in the game whose only ability is to change alimited number ofgame items' appearance. Image Designers can change player appearances, but the players themselves need invest no skill points to be IDd, and a given ID can operate on any number of players. Tailors can create new clothes, but they can then transfer those clothes to any number of other players, and the other players don't need to invest skill points to wear them. And any player can decorate his/her own house (although many of the items of decor need to be crafted by an Architect, but... you see where I'm going here.)
So why is an entire fourth of the Merchant tree devoted to customizing the Merchant's own limited number of vendors? The only "benefit" the Merchant gets from this is the pleasure of a unique-looking shop. No other class needs to pay skill points for the privilege of makingsuch a small corner of thegame world look a bit nicer - it'd be equivalent to only allowing IDs to customize their own appearances, or requiring Architect skills in order to place items in homes (and only homes that they actually own). Wouldn't it make more sense to approach vendor appearance the same way that player appearance and home decoration are currently approached -possibly requiring the assistance of a particular profession, but not requiring any particular skill set on the part of the beneficiary of the customization?
The constant refrain from the developers in the early days was that they were excited about the possibility of player-created content, but they sure don't encourage it with the game mechanics...
Songe wrote:
It's scheduled to have IDs have a part in the customization of vendors.
p4Samwise wrote:
No other class needs to pay skill points for the privilege of makingsuch a small corner of thegame world look a bit nicer - it'd be equivalent to only allowing IDs to customize their own appearances, or requiring Architect skills in order to place items in homes (and only homes that they actually own). Wouldn't it make more sense to approach vendor appearance the same way that player appearance and home decoration are currently approached -possibly requiring the assistance of a particular profession, but not requiring any particular skill set on the part of the beneficiary of the customization?
I realize that. It still doesn't make sense to make the merchant pay skill points to have an ID customize the vendors, when the benefit the merchant is getting is right in line with all the other customizations that don't grant tangible game benefits.
Songe wrote:
I agree, I hope they will replace that column by something more useful.
Would you also agree with me that their efforts would be far better spent doing that rather than entrenching everyone in the current Hiring column by adding a new requirement that it be kept to not only hire but keep the vendors?