Merchant Archive
Thread: Two types of people opposed to this merchant change
zukem
Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:33 pm
#14
Just thought of another possible solution. Something that was tried in the past, but there was such a huge backlash on it that it was scrapped.
Keep vendors at unlimited amounts. But make maintenance on vendors be 20 credits per item posted per day. And once you get the reduced vendor costs skill, that gets dropped to 10 credits per day. With master merchant, you get it reduced to 1 credit per day for maintenance. That way those that want their 1000 items can have it, just will cost you 20k a day in maintenance.
Brilyn
Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:48 pm
#15
< Why else would they post in favor of disolving the profession? How would that help in the face of what SOE is trying to do here besides allow them to keep vendors they don't have the skill for. >
Because
it's
pointless.
I have 2 Vendors, and I have Novice Merchant.
ExDarthStorm
Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:55 pm
#16
I totaly agree with you..
i'm the first type of person..
Yes i have master merchant, and i have not dropped it to pick up some other skill.
but i do have a storage vendor to help me keep track of all my resources.
What i don't get is that we offer hundreds of ideas and fixes to their "database overload" problems.. but they never listen!
increase the size of resource containers.. aka 1million units per block instead of 100k, increase the size of creates and allow us to re-assemble broken crates. (i'd even be happy with 500k blocks of resources)
That would seroiusly reduce the database problem they have, but the refuse to do it. so what do they do? the deside to fix there database program and nerf the TRUE merchants in the process.
Why can't they just FIX the problems/exploites and leave the stuff that works alone?
1- Take away vendors from those who don't have any merchant/artisan skills to support them
2- Remove vendors from the over head map that have been inactive for"___" amount of time.
3- Figure out other LOGICAL ways to reduce the strain on your so called "database" problems..
4- FIX OTHER PROFESSIONS BEFORE YOU BRAKE THE ONE THAT WORKS!!
BTW...does anyone else see the problem with using so many skill points for a profession that has little to no interaction with the player?
All we do is fill them up, and sell, and fill them up again..
they need to ADD more to merchan than take away.
Give us bigger discouns on our harvesters, give us special "storage" houses kinda like the merchant tents, that will only take up 1 lot, but give us 100 storage but nothing else can be put in them except for resources & componets
Do something to make it more worth while..
I'm tired of the DEV's nerfing this.. and nerfing that..
HOW THE HECK DO YOU THINK THIS GAME GOT INTO THE STATE IT IS IN NOW!?!?
BY THE NERF BAT! stop swinging so blindly with it.. and listen to the people that play this game..
putting this huge of a cap on vendors is stupid...
mhal9000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:56 pm
#17
Brilyn wrote:
< Why else would they post in favor of disolving the profession? How would that help in the face of what SOE is trying to do here besides allow them to keep vendors they don't have the skill for. >
Because
it's
pointless.
I have 2 Vendors, and I have Novice Merchant.
Its
pointless
to
you.
there are others who play the game too.
Brilyn
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:03 pm
#18
< there are others who play the game too.>
Hey, I've made a productive post.
You've responded by painting those of us who disagree with you as exploiters.
Get over it.
Master Merchant reduces **minimal** maintenance costs to less, let's you pick which doll you like the look of most, allows you to dress your doll, and change your shop sign. It also allows you to add your vendor to the map, and spam starports (via droids).
The only ones of these that areeven vaguely worth anything is the Advertising one, and having addional Vendors.
Every other profession adds something either productive, or promotes interaction with other players.
The Merchant "Profession" doesn't.
Please, enlighten me: What is thepoint of the Merchant "Profession"? As you see it, of course.
DocSavag
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:11 pm
#19
I have respect for most of the posters who have posted on this issue you are trying to play this game and proect the hard work you have put into making your business. I don't want item limits but I recognize that unlimited is an invitation to abuse and I udnerstand why the devs want to change it. I think the limits should be fairly high and should be aggregate if we MUST have them.
I have seen a few people post about storage..I know its tough but vendors were really never meant to store things. That isn't an arguement I can take back to the devs. I can take the legitimate business concerns and try to make the devs understand that you guys have worked hard for what you have and shouldn't be put out of business with limits this low. I am doing that and will continue to do that.
I have seen a few people post about storage..I know its tough but vendors were really never meant to store things. That isn't an arguement I can take back to the devs. I can take the legitimate business concerns and try to make the devs understand that you guys have worked hard for what you have and shouldn't be put out of business with limits this low. I am doing that and will continue to do that.
mhal9000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:12 pm
#20
Brilyn wrote:
< there are others who play the game too.>
Hey, I've made a productive post.
"Because it's pointless" qualifies as a productive post?
You've responded by painting those of us who disagree with you as exploiters.
I made a statement based on past observations when this subject has been brought up on these boards. It was always someone who wanted to use the vendors without having to invest the skill points.
Get over it.
The only thing I want to get over is theitem limitcaps at the moment, to be honest I was tired of arguments like yours a while back. We've had a couple of resident trolls who've gotten their jollies spurring on arguments such as this. I can only imagine they're sitting back in glee with the firestorm that's opened up on these boards.
Master Merchant reduces **minimal** maintenance costs to less, let's you pick which doll you like the look of most, allows you to dress your doll, and change your shop sign. It also allows you to add your vendor to the map, and spam starports (via droids).
The only ones of these that areeven vaguely worth anything is the Advertising one, and having addional Vendors.
Every other profession adds something either productive, or promotes interaction with other players.
The Merchant "Profession" doesn't.
Please, enlighten me: What is thepoint of the Merchant "Profession"? As you see it, of course.
The problem with the Merchant Profession is that for too long everyone has had the ability to pick up the skills, place their vendors as they want and then ditch the skill points. If you had been unable to do that from the beginning, there wouldn't be a question as to the professions utility.
As it is, you question it because you've been used to the benefits without the cost for too long now.
This is the first MMORPG that has made the merchant a playable class, and that's honestly one of the reasons I still enjoy the game. I hate crafting, and if the PvP or PvE was all that I was interested in, I would've left for greener pastures a long time ago.
Message Edited by mhal9000 on 08-08-2004 05:13 PM
Brilyn
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:16 pm
#21
< Please, enlighten me: What is thepoint of the Merchant "Profession"? As you see it, of course.
The problem with the Merchant Profession is that for too long everyone has had the ability to pick up the skills, place their vendors as they want and then ditch the skill points. If you had been unable to do that from the beginning, there wouldn't be a question as to the professions utility.
As it is, you question it because you've been used to the benefits without the cost for too long now.
This is the first MMORPG that has made the merchant a playable class, and that's honestly one of the reasons I still enjoy the game. I hate crafting, and if the PvP or PvE was all that I was interested in, I would've left for greener pastures a long time ago. >
You've failed to answer the question.
I have NOT ditched Novice Merchant. I am "paying the cost" of the profession.
Again, what is the "point" of the Merchant Profession, as you see it?
Brilyn
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:20 pm
#22
DocSavag, I'm glad to see you're keeping up with the torrent of posts on these topics.
My issue is from a purely business perspective.
As a Master Weaponsmith, I can produce over 80 individual weapons.
Currently, between my two vendors, I have over 2400 items, 1300 of which are in the "Weapons" category on my vendor. I have another few hundred in Crates, as Grenades and Weapon Upgrade Kits sell in that fasion.
Master Merchant (with the currently proposed caps) will kill 75% of my stock, even if I plonk down 4 more vendors.
Master Merchant + Master Crafter + Master Combat class (a cheap one) = **263** skillpoints.
SOE are clearly and emphatically stating that if you want to Craft, you're not allowed to be involved in Combat, with this new change.
mhal9000
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:39 pm
#23
Brilyn wrote:
< Please, enlighten me: What is thepoint of the Merchant "Profession"? As you see it, of course.
The problem with the Merchant Profession is that for too long everyone has had the ability to pick up the skills, place their vendors as they want and then ditch the skill points. If you had been unable to do that from the beginning, there wouldn't be a question as to the professions utility.
As it is, you question it because you've been used to the benefits without the cost for too long now.
This is the first MMORPG that has made the merchant a playable class, and that's honestly one of the reasons I still enjoy the game. I hate crafting, and if the PvP or PvE was all that I was interested in, I would've left for greener pastures a long time ago. >
You've failed to answer the question.
I have NOT ditched Novice Merchant. I am "paying the cost" of the profession.
Again, what is the "point" of the Merchant Profession, as you see it?
The ultimate point of the profession is the ability to market and sell wares created either by yourself or other crafters, using various tools that should have been exclusive to the class.
As a stand alone class, it doesn't have much to offer, but this game was supposed to be based on interactivity between classes, not the uber I can make and sell everything by myself fest its become on some levels.
What class out there isn't accented in some way by another? The merchant class should've turned out to be a natural partner to all the crafting classes, but the aforementioned ability to utilize the vendor without the skill points has effectively ruined that path.
I must say I'm surprised you decided to keep the skill points if you truly think the profession is that worthless though.
What's your reason for keeping something you obviously disdain, and how would removing the classand giving it to crafters fix the database issue?
Ricani
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:50 pm
#24
in responce to the first post...
why should't everyone be able to sell stuff? Its NOT an exploit, since evryone can do it, no one is hacking the game code or manipulating the servers. It is a FEATURE of the game, dont be so quick to dismiss it as a lot of people like the fact that they too can join in on the econemy and own a business. What about the crafters who like to hunt aslo, or thoes that like to loot components for their weapons/armour. You are forgetting that this nerf will make it impossible for them to do so due to the lack of skill points.
A very simple solution, which would improve the current situation is introduce limits on vendors owned by players who do not invest skill points in the merchant profession, and then go from there.
There are a lot of people who have no merchant, and have 3 or 4 vendors, which are unlimited at the moment, a LOT of people. Surely, if thoes people were now only allowed a single, basic vendor with a cap of say 200 items the database problems would
be improved tenfold.
Dont say that non merchants using vendors are getting anything for free, they cannot rename vendors, move them to a new location or create new vendors to accomodate a new crafting proffesions etc... Master merchants get a lot for their effort, dont be so bitter towards the people who are simply playing the game and utilizing what is available to them.
why should't everyone be able to sell stuff? Its NOT an exploit, since evryone can do it, no one is hacking the game code or manipulating the servers. It is a FEATURE of the game, dont be so quick to dismiss it as a lot of people like the fact that they too can join in on the econemy and own a business. What about the crafters who like to hunt aslo, or thoes that like to loot components for their weapons/armour. You are forgetting that this nerf will make it impossible for them to do so due to the lack of skill points.
A very simple solution, which would improve the current situation is introduce limits on vendors owned by players who do not invest skill points in the merchant profession, and then go from there.
There are a lot of people who have no merchant, and have 3 or 4 vendors, which are unlimited at the moment, a LOT of people. Surely, if thoes people were now only allowed a single, basic vendor with a cap of say 200 items the database problems would
be improved tenfold.
Dont say that non merchants using vendors are getting anything for free, they cannot rename vendors, move them to a new location or create new vendors to accomodate a new crafting proffesions etc... Master merchants get a lot for their effort, dont be so bitter towards the people who are simply playing the game and utilizing what is available to them.
Khaldun
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:51 pm
#25
There's a VERY significant set of posts here that simply want to eliminate vendors...people who are free-riders who are pissed off because the free ride is coming to an end.
If you want to run a large, well-stocked store, you should have to be a merchant. Period.
If you are a merchant, you should have the abilitity to run a large, well-stocked store. Hence the vendor limits as proposed are far too small.
If you have no merchant skills, or very few, you shouldn't be able to run a large well-stocked store. To argue otherwise is to argue that there shouldn't be a merchant profession, and if that's what you want to argue, don't mince words, just say it. I'd accept that as an argument as long as the devs had a compensatory strategy so that all my efforts at being a merchant translated automatically into something else rather than just having it taken from me.
But also recognize that the current situation, where every Tom, **edit** and Harry can have four vendors with planetary advertising, is more or less making advertising and vendors semi-useless. If that makes you happy, if having a vendor is just something cool you want to do, whether you make money or not, ok, fine. Not so good in my book, but there you go.
Ricani
Sun Aug 08, 2004 5:56 pm
#26
A very simple solution, which would improve the current situation is introduce limits on vendors owned by players who do not invest skill points in the merchant profession, and then go from there.