Merchant Archive
Thread: As part of the merchant change, can we raise resource stack size to 1000k, and crate size to 1000?
Avair wrote:
Inflation is the 'average' change in the cost of goods and service. Productivity growth (from efficiencygains)doesn't result in inflation. In fact, it's more likely to result in deflation as the cost of goods and services becomes cheaper, therefore merchants can charge less and still be profitable.
What will result in inflation is lots of extra cash in the system (think what would happen if they doubled all mission payouts) or scarces goods. Now what would cause scarce goods I wonder? Perhaps driving crafters away from the game by making craftingunnecessarily more difficult through overly complex interfaces or silly vendor caps?
As far a preventing resource hording, I have serious doubts a 100k stack stops anyone. Making stack 1000k versus 100k make 1 stack out of 10. Before the vendor caps, Infinity/10 = Infinity/1. So arguing that it was put into place to stop hoarding is silly. It was just a happenstance design decision they left in. Assume a medium grade merchant with 2500 storage (10 vendors), who devotes only 4 of his vendors to storage and stores items in travel packs.
1000 items* 50 stacks/pack * 100,000/stack = 5,000,000 resources.
Lets take it further and say he uses all of his vendor space for storage and gets master merchant (12 vendors, 300/vendor) to do it.
3600 items * 50 * 100,000= 1,800,000,000 resources
When you can convince me that the 'hording masses of evil' (which everyone is so concerned about) are going to be concerned about a 'puny' storage cap of 1.8 billion resources, then I rethink things. Until lets operate on the assumption that if someone wants to horde resources, they will horde as much as they want to. So 'hording' is a weak argument.
So the only real effect of small stacks and crate sizes is players have extra makework for crafters. And let me tell you, I don't find it enjoyable to load a factory with a 100 GP/EMM crateswhen I could just have 3 crates of 1000 instead of 100 crates of 25. I do it cause I have to, but it ain't fun. And do you think a crate of 1000 GP modules is unbalancing? Frankly, I don't care about storage space really, if it took up 40 spaces i don't care, i just want one stack to worry about not forty.
P.S. Check me on my math for storage please, it's very late in the day for me to doing dangerous things like multiplication.
"Fear the 1000 GP Module crate. It will destroy the game!"
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
DaunteDelfuego wrote:I think these are reasonable, and will compliment the merchant changes nicely. Plus, it will make the game much more enjoyable for crafters.The answer, everytime it has been asked is "no".As the rest of the folks have said ... it serves to limit hoarding. Especially when things such as "power" are concerned.ie: Weapon Powerups ... 10 to a crate.Why? cause powerups are very powerful ... and with power comes expense ... in this case "inventory" space.DIV>
That's a silly argument. I can carry around a crate of 25 power hammers and a crate of 25 composite chest plates, but 25 dinky little powerups (which take 10 units of resources each) fills up 3 crates.
Astev_Aris wrote:
Can you explain to me how increased goods and lower prices are a symptom of inflation? Increased competition, perhaps, which drives prices down, as you so perfectly illustrated, but inflation is quite the opposite of what you're describing above.
The argument put forth by the Architects was that increased stack sizes would decrease the number of discrete items in the game (i.e., one stack of 1,000,000 as opposed to 10 stacks of 100,000) and so improve database performance. Seemed logical to me, especially with all the other measures (such as this vendor nerf) being taken to reduce database load. But for whatever reason, they didn't accept it.
Sorry ... meant defaltion ...
I don't think the issue is valid decrete items ... I think the issue has been storage of said decrete items ... by folks that should not be able to store them ... that will now change.
If you take out "storage" from the game dynamics you loose something in the game. Managing storage, in some ways, is a mini game ... and some folks are better at it then others and propser because of it.
Now, once they start to limit how many structures you can "admin" the cycle of storage management will just about be complete. (and yes, they will control cross lot swapping somehow and this seems the easiest way to do it, just put a hard cap on how many structures your name can be added to as admin)
Sigrun wrote:
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
ie: Weapon Powerups ... 10 to a crate.
Why? cause powerups are very powerful ... and with power comes expense ... in this case "inventory" space.
That is just TOO funny... Yeah, those weapon powerups is OOOBAH! Phear my VK's now, you evil, mean, nasty (newly weakened by my powerup) CM/Rifleman/Jedi!
LMFAO!
I am sure you got no Arse left to laugh off.
Why did they nerf Probots way back when? why did they drop the CH level down to 10?
VK is not really the *best* example of a powerup ... bt 33% more damage is 33% more damage ... that's like 1/3 of an extra person at your side.So having it limited to 10 per crate means it takes up more inventory ... and inventory management is a game ... and you have to judge whether to bring along those extra couple of crates of powerups ... or whether you want that space for loot or something.
It's a valid argument ... your argument? non-existent ... just another twit in the crowd.
Told you math was dangerous this late in the day, my numbers are full order of magnitude off. The actual equation is..
1000 items* 50 stacks/pack * 100,000/stack = 5,000,000 resources.
3600 items * 50 * 100,000= 1,800,000,000 resources
P.S. Check me on my math for storage please, it's very late in the day for me to doing dangerous things like multiplication.
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
The answer, everytime it has been asked is "no".
As the rest of the folks have said ... it serves to limit hoarding. Especially when things such as "power" are concerned.
ie: Weapon Powerups ... 10 to a crate.
Why? cause powerups are very powerful ... and with power comes expense ... in this case "inventory" space.
100k stacks of resources are here to stay ... if anything, the Dev's would reduce it, not enlarge it. I would say the same thing with crates ... if anything they would bring the stacks down to 10 *if* they did anything.
It's all about time vs reward.
The easier it is, the more you make with less time .. which causes inflation. Imagine for a moment they did increase it all ... you would say "great, takes me less time" ... then again, takes everybody less time ... which allows some folks to produce more ... and they start to need to drive business so they charge less ... then you have to charge less to get your market back ... you are now making less from more ... you have to make more ... which takes more time. It's a vicious circle :-) ... once you have gone round the circle you would come back and ask for crates to get changed to 1,000 .... rinse and repeat.
Can you explain to me how increased goods and lower prices are a symptom of inflation? Increased competition, perhaps, which drives prices down, as you so perfectly illustrated, but inflation is quite the opposite of what you're describing above.
The argument put forth by the Architects was that increased stack sizes would decrease the number of discrete items in the game (i.e., one stack of 1,000,000 as opposed to 10 stacks of 100,000) and so improve database performance. Seemed logical to me, especially with all the other measures (such as this vendor nerf) being taken to reduce database load. But for whatever reason, they didn't accept it.
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
ie: Weapon Powerups ... 10 to a crate.
Why? cause powerups are very powerful ... and with power comes expense ... in this case "inventory" space.
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
Sigrun wrote:
Hero_DarkJedi wrote:
ie: Weapon Powerups ... 10 to a crate.
Why? cause powerups are very powerful ... and with power comes expense ... in this case "inventory" space.
That is just TOO funny... Yeah, those weapon powerups is OOOBAH! Phear my VK's now, you evil, mean, nasty (newly weakened by my powerup) CM/Rifleman/Jedi!
LMFAO!
I am sure you got no Arse left to laugh off.
Why did they nerf Probots way back when? why did they drop the CH level down to 10?
VK is not really the *best* example of a powerup ... bt 33% more damage is 33% more damage ... that's like 1/3 of an extra person at your side.So having it limited to 10 per crate means it takes up more inventory ... and inventory management is a game ... and you have to judge whether to bring along those extra couple of crates of powerups ... or whether you want that space for loot or something.
It's a valid argument ... your argument? non-existent ... just another twit in the crowd.