Merchant Archive
Thread: Sick and tired of empty vendors
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MisterGee
Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:45 pm
#1
Maybe this has been talked about to death here already... I don't know. Did a search for "empty vendors" and came up with a dozen or more pages on it, so if it's been talked about already here's another thread. Sorry.
As the subject indicates, I'm totally fed up by all the empty vendors in this game. When I need to purchase something - whether it be clothing, deeds, resources or whatever - I first check the planetary map for registered vendors selling those items. That's reasonable, I think. In my pursuits, more often than not, I will bounce from city to city to city going to all these vendors and find them empty in most cases. I have active characters on four different servers and have found this to be true maybe, if not more than,6 times out of 10.
I believe merchants have an obligation, not only to their customers but to all players in the game, to remove their vendors if they are quitting SWG or have chosen not to sell any more goods. Common decency would seem to dictate that, but ex-merchants don't appear to grasp that concept. That said, I'd like to see the Devs step in here and take some action.
What I'm proposing, I think, is not too dramatic. It benefits all "consumers" in SWG and does something a lazy or inconsiderateex-merchant should have done themselves. I'd like to see one of two solutions implemented.
1) A vendor is automatically unregistered from the planetary map if it has had no inventory for 3 consecutive days. It can only be re-registered when it has been re-stocked.
Of course, I've seen merchant xp exploiters putting 1 unit of a resource on multiple (disceptively named) vendors so there will, no doubt, be people who will attempt to find loopholes. Maybe it's time to modify the merchant skill tree in a way that advertising privileges will be reflected bythe number of items for saleon a merchant's vendor. That idea is real fuzzy, I admit, but there's gotta be a better checks and balances system than exists now.
You could also say the planetary map listing is the SWG equivilent with being in the Yellow Pages in real life. At least in real life you have the option to call ahead to, a) see if the shop is still in business, or,b) has the item you want to purchase. Obviously, we don't currently have those options in SWG without physically going to that vendor and using them.
Or, alternatively, another possible solution...
2) In addition to monetary maintenance fees, a vendor's condition is also based on the existence of an inventory. For every 24 hours a vendor remains completely void of any inventory, its condition drops by 20-25%. When its condition hits zero, it is automatically removed from the server, taking with it its planetary map registration (if any) and obliterating all items listed under its Stockroom tab.
The idea, to me, is fairly simple. If you've got nothing to sell or haven't bothered to check on your shop within 96 hours then the odds are quite likely that you don't even need a vendor.
I've seen several instances where a guild or city will create a mall and invite its members to place vendors in a large structure of some kind. Soon after, one of the merchants will suddenly quit SWG or drop his/her crafting profession and leavean empty vendor to rot with300 days worthof maintenace in it. There's nothing that can be done to get rid of the abandoned vendor, short of pulling everything out of thestructure and re-deeding it. I've seen some very creative uses of furniture and decorations to hide abandoned vendors on all servers. My proposal above would put an end to all that.
A potential problem that comes to mind here is what happens if a merchant goes on (real life) vacation and won't be logging in for a week or two? The first thing that comes to my mind is to add Vacation Mode to a vendor's radial menu. Accessing this mode will allow you to enter the number of days you'll be on vacation, but enabling it will automatically remove you from the planetary map register, disallow customer access to your vendor (picture a "On vacation, be back in 10 days" sign on a shop here) but keep your vendor and itsinventory safe from self-vaporization while you're temporarily away from SWG. I think shutting down a vendor from customers while in Vacation Mode would be a must, otherwise vendors would have no incentive to ever pay maintenance or stock their vendors... they'd always just stay in Vacation Mode to exploit the benefits.
Finally, I think it could be of great benefit to all consumers in SWG to see a number of items displayed alongside a registered vendor's listing on the planetary map.
For example... (2) John Doe's Ultra Rare and Uber Loot
That number, 2,would accurately represent the amount of items currently for sale on that vendor. This would save people the hassle of jumping from shuttle to shuttle en route to a vendor with no or very few items for sale. Something like this may put added stress on the already shaky vendor database situation, but I'm not a programmerso I'lloffer no technical answers there. 
I dunno, maybe my ideas would just make things more complicated for the merchant class. A whole lot of emphasis is placed on the player economy in this game and from what I've seen, and heardfrom other players, the storefront economy is becoming a lot more unstable as people have Holo grinded andquit SWG. I think steps need to be taken by the Devs to improve and insure the future integrity of the game's merchant economy, as I see it in a sharp decline.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on the subject and suggestions for improving the situation.
PlentyOToole
Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:55 pm
#2
I agree with you in that I too hate checking empty vendors. That said, the main way one earns merchant exp is to have as many vendors as possible, so you're gonna have a hard time making people stop placing them. I place my "exp. Generators" in another room, so that people don't even see them, if everyone did this it would help out, but I doubt it will solve all the problems 
Naufragus
Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:58 pm
#3
well if all the vendors are empty then why is everone so all fired eager to get rid of all the "illegal" ones...
if they are empty they cant vbe hurting anyones bizness
(empty vendors are symptom of the hologrinding)
valubo
Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:29 pm
#4
We are complaining about the wrong problem.
The problem isn't that the vendors are empty. The problem is that you have to run all over the planet to find what you want to buy. You actually have to GO to someone's vendor to see what they are selling.
The solution is that we should be able to view vendor contents from any bazaar terminal. Then the problem would be solved: people could keep as many empty vendors as they wanted, but it wouldn't harm anyone's shopping experience because you would only need to travel to the vendors that you buy something off of. SOE would need to add finer resolution to the categories on the vendor in some cases (It's already a pain to shop for inorganic resources in Coronet. There are often 10 pages to look thru, but they could add a category just for copper, for example).
For the most part, I love this game, but I hate the shopping. Trying to buy any item that is too expensive to find on the bazaar is seriously UN-FUN. It's so frustrating I could scream. You spend so much effort running to places that don't have what you want. I wouldn't mind running 3000 meters to pick up my purchase if I were certain that it was there, but I hate, hate, hate driving all over 3 different planets for 6 hours just to find one Rocket Launcher. I just wanted to buy one item and I already knew what I wanted. Why should it be so hard to do??
The problem isn't that the vendors are empty. The problem is that you have to run all over the planet to find what you want to buy. You actually have to GO to someone's vendor to see what they are selling.
The solution is that we should be able to view vendor contents from any bazaar terminal. Then the problem would be solved: people could keep as many empty vendors as they wanted, but it wouldn't harm anyone's shopping experience because you would only need to travel to the vendors that you buy something off of. SOE would need to add finer resolution to the categories on the vendor in some cases (It's already a pain to shop for inorganic resources in Coronet. There are often 10 pages to look thru, but they could add a category just for copper, for example).
For the most part, I love this game, but I hate the shopping. Trying to buy any item that is too expensive to find on the bazaar is seriously UN-FUN. It's so frustrating I could scream. You spend so much effort running to places that don't have what you want. I wouldn't mind running 3000 meters to pick up my purchase if I were certain that it was there, but I hate, hate, hate driving all over 3 different planets for 6 hours just to find one Rocket Launcher. I just wanted to buy one item and I already knew what I wanted. Why should it be so hard to do??
ChaoKuang
Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:07 pm
#5
I think the problem lies with all the hologrinders trying to get through merchant. They'll grind enough to get put on the map and have multiple vendors, and have those vendors up so people will browse each one, only to find it empty. The people get nothing, and the owner gets XP.
Another problem is people grinding up to get a vendor or two, then dropping the entire profession to keep those vendors as extra storage.
I agree with your ideas though. If empty, the vendor should be automatically removed from the map. There should also be a minimum in the vendor before it can be registered.
valubo
Fri Mar 12, 2004 10:58 am
#7
Empty vendors are not the problem. The problem is that you actually have to run out to the vendor to find out that it doesn't have what you want.
If you could view the contents of someone's vendor from a regular bazaar terminal, then you wouldn't have to waste your time travelling to the empty ones.
If you could view the contents of someone's vendor from a regular bazaar terminal, then you wouldn't have to waste your time travelling to the empty ones.
Naufragus
Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:06 pm
#8
you actually could at one point in BETA....
Also the owner of the vendor could also access the Bazaar...
My belief is that we as merchants need to be focusing more on Bazaar functions than just fretting over vending machines.
The ONLY reason any one wants vendors in the first place is because of the bazaar limits...people are forced to have to use vendors.
Aside from 3 or 4 shops that i use regularly, i buy everything off of the bazaar...
LukeBorgman
Fri Mar 12, 2004 2:37 pm
#9
Another part of the problem may be how difficult and frustrating crafting has become, combined with abandoned professions from hologrinding. Most crafters have to do most of their own mining due to high resource prices. It's a lot of hassle and work just to get the resources needed even before any crafting begins. In other words, I think the economy/resource scarcityis partially to blame.
Still it seems that people should be able to lodge "Community Standards" complaints with Customer Service for clearly fraudulent vendor names and listings.
That said, I use vendors for house decorations, but they are clearly named as "housekeeper" and "security" etc. No global advert of course. ...Item disappearanceswhat they are, you're taking a big risk putting anything in one anyway. HA!
Naufragus
Fri Mar 12, 2004 2:44 pm
#10
so you hard asses who want empty vendors to be removed from the map...
will the vendor fee be reduced accordingly....i have been paying for it since like september and dont think i have ever been on the map...
or do you think since people have PAID these fees that they should be listed....
you cant take things away from people that they have paid for.
Raleran0
Fri Mar 12, 2004 3:04 pm
#11
I can understand this...I haven't shopped much but what I have seen does annoy me. I like your option #1 the most, #2 is kinda harsh.
The main problem as someone said is not empty vendors but the fact they're on the map. If they weren't on the map then we wouldn't waste time running to them. So my ideas, taking yours into account, would be:
1) If a vendor is empty for 3 days, take it off the map and reduce the fees accordingly
2) If the vendor doesn't visit his vendor in a week then take it off the map and reduce fees.
3) Implement your vacation time idea. If you put in that you're going on vacation for 10 days, then in 10 days + 1 week your vendor goes off the map. BUT if your vendor runs out of inventory anytime during your vacation then after 3 more days it's removed from the map.
Using the above rules take the vendor off the map and keep us from making unfruitful runs while not penalizing the merchant unduly for not being around.
Still I think they should link the vendors back with the bazaar so you can find the item, then run out to get it. BUT, they need to fix the bazaar so you can filter the results better first.
The main problem as someone said is not empty vendors but the fact they're on the map. If they weren't on the map then we wouldn't waste time running to them. So my ideas, taking yours into account, would be:
1) If a vendor is empty for 3 days, take it off the map and reduce the fees accordingly
2) If the vendor doesn't visit his vendor in a week then take it off the map and reduce fees.
3) Implement your vacation time idea. If you put in that you're going on vacation for 10 days, then in 10 days + 1 week your vendor goes off the map. BUT if your vendor runs out of inventory anytime during your vacation then after 3 more days it's removed from the map.
Using the above rules take the vendor off the map and keep us from making unfruitful runs while not penalizing the merchant unduly for not being around.
Still I think they should link the vendors back with the bazaar so you can find the item, then run out to get it. BUT, they need to fix the bazaar so you can filter the results better first.
Haruspex77
Fri Mar 12, 2004 5:38 pm
#12
Raleran0 wrote:
2) If the vendor doesn't visit his vendor in a week then take it off the map and reduce fees.
I don't think this is needed. If the vendor has stuff in it, why shouldn't it stay on the map until all the items drop into the stockroom? Of course an un-attended vendor is going to have only slow moving stock on it, but that is far better than nothing. Then the vacation timer isn't needed either, the 30 day posting timer handles it all.
Kattatonic
Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:39 pm
#13
You forgot about the 1 credit access fee you had to pay to go into the house to find that the vendor was empty.
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