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Thread: Atmospheric flight using existing game technology
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WarHokie
Sun Mar 27, 2005 9:31 pm
#1
A common sight in Star Wars movies is the independence granted by owning your own star ship. While starports are necissary for propper maintainence, most any ship has the landing gear needed to just set down on a planet where ever one pleases.
Since JTL was introduced, people have wanted to take their ships into the atmosphere. The trouble is, the technology of the ground game is turn and skill based, while the technology of space is reflex based. Combining the two game types is difficult, if not impossible. What I thought, was how we could work around the problem using only what already works in the game.
Atmospheric Flight - The goal:
The goal of atmospheric flight is to give the feeling that a ship is a physical thing you own that can be interacted with, and not an object in your datapad.
How it would work:
When in orbit, and in proximity of the planet-side of the space sector cube, the command to decend into the atmophere can be given. A map of the planet is shown, and a location to land is picked.
After a load time, the player is relocated to that part of the planetary map, inside of their ship. The ship is kept at a regulation height, low enough not to interfere with planetary spawns and high enough to not clip with ground level decorations. When in this state, the ship is in 'repulsor lift landing mode', and handles like a slow moving speeder bike, allowing the player to drive the ship around very slowly. (The slow speed is explained as atmospheric drag, and prevents ships from being used as speeders)
When in this mode, weapons on a ship will not function for safety reasons, as they are designed for use in a vacume. (With the possible exception of smuggler made ground-only items, like the repeating blaster on the falcon) The ship can only move, and use the option 'land'. If land is chosen, the ship decands to ground level as best it can, and drops the player off next to it, leaving the ship present like a parked speeder bike, oriented with the ground the way a speeder bike would be.
A ship may not fly into, or land within, the limits of a city. This includes NPC and PC cities, and could be expanded to include many no-fly-zone POIs. (themeparks,
Combat with landed ships:
in combat, a ship can be shot at like a speeder bike can in PVP, only with somewhat more hitpoints, and in the case of a multiplayer vessel, much, much more hitpoints. In addition, PVE factional units will fire on the ships of combatants. (it would be better if non-faction NPCs and animals ran from the engines of a low flying ship, but such would open grief opportunities and would have to be avoided) If a ship's hitpoints are exhausted, it will blow up with a suitable explosion graphic, and the ship will return to the owner's datapad as it would if destroyed in space, needing simular repairs.
When boarding a ship, there will be a 'pre-flight warmup sequence'. This is just a timer, perhaps a minute or two in length, during which the ship starts up and prepares to take off, before it may go back to atmospheric flight mode. During this time, all aggro on a player will be transfered to his ship, prompting aggressive mobs to attack the ship now.
If a ship blows up with a player in it, the player is killed, and may choose to clone as normal.
Multiplayer ships:
The special exception to landing is a multiplayer ship. Rather than be deposited outside of a multiplayer ship, the pilot is placed inside of the ship, next to the pilot station. Rather than the usual 'pilot' choice, 'start take off sequence' is the choice given. To leave the ship one must go to the physical exit ramp in the ship, and use the 'exit ship' option there. When outside of a multiplayer ship, those in the pilots group as well as the pilot have the option to go back inside using a radial menu to board ship.
If a multiplayer ship is destroyed with players inside of it, all players on board die and have the option to clone as normal.
Uses and enhancements:
The effects of being able to land a ship are such that multiplayer ships can be used to move large amounts of cargo from remote towns and locations to other towns, or even to the field. Letting ships land this way means it would be possible to introduce planets with no star ports, remote places of mystery where any pilot can go at their own risk. This would make the ship a moving house, encouraging Ace pilots to live out of their ship, something that seems characterful. A system of maintainence costs when ground side would be needed, preferably as swoop bikes suffer, so that the ship must be lifted off and stored occassionally. It is strictly not the goal of this system to introduce fields full of parked space ships to replace player cities. If one logs off with their ship out, it will dissapear and return to the datapad, to be summoned from any spaceport on that planet.
In the future, the combat angle of these ships could be enhanced. Perhaps flights over enemy territory could have AI controlled ship-NPCs 'fly' low-altitude (like a probe droid 'flys', only higher) to intercept rival ships. The turrets on multiplyer ships could behave like base turrets do now, and the idea of being able to board and destroy a ship like a factional base would add tremendous play elements to both the space and ground game.
That's the idea anyway, for how it could work. What do you think?
-Dalnara
Since JTL was introduced, people have wanted to take their ships into the atmosphere. The trouble is, the technology of the ground game is turn and skill based, while the technology of space is reflex based. Combining the two game types is difficult, if not impossible. What I thought, was how we could work around the problem using only what already works in the game.
Atmospheric Flight - The goal:
The goal of atmospheric flight is to give the feeling that a ship is a physical thing you own that can be interacted with, and not an object in your datapad.
How it would work:
When in orbit, and in proximity of the planet-side of the space sector cube, the command to decend into the atmophere can be given. A map of the planet is shown, and a location to land is picked.
After a load time, the player is relocated to that part of the planetary map, inside of their ship. The ship is kept at a regulation height, low enough not to interfere with planetary spawns and high enough to not clip with ground level decorations. When in this state, the ship is in 'repulsor lift landing mode', and handles like a slow moving speeder bike, allowing the player to drive the ship around very slowly. (The slow speed is explained as atmospheric drag, and prevents ships from being used as speeders)
When in this mode, weapons on a ship will not function for safety reasons, as they are designed for use in a vacume. (With the possible exception of smuggler made ground-only items, like the repeating blaster on the falcon) The ship can only move, and use the option 'land'. If land is chosen, the ship decands to ground level as best it can, and drops the player off next to it, leaving the ship present like a parked speeder bike, oriented with the ground the way a speeder bike would be.
A ship may not fly into, or land within, the limits of a city. This includes NPC and PC cities, and could be expanded to include many no-fly-zone POIs. (themeparks,
Combat with landed ships:
in combat, a ship can be shot at like a speeder bike can in PVP, only with somewhat more hitpoints, and in the case of a multiplayer vessel, much, much more hitpoints. In addition, PVE factional units will fire on the ships of combatants. (it would be better if non-faction NPCs and animals ran from the engines of a low flying ship, but such would open grief opportunities and would have to be avoided) If a ship's hitpoints are exhausted, it will blow up with a suitable explosion graphic, and the ship will return to the owner's datapad as it would if destroyed in space, needing simular repairs.
When boarding a ship, there will be a 'pre-flight warmup sequence'. This is just a timer, perhaps a minute or two in length, during which the ship starts up and prepares to take off, before it may go back to atmospheric flight mode. During this time, all aggro on a player will be transfered to his ship, prompting aggressive mobs to attack the ship now.
If a ship blows up with a player in it, the player is killed, and may choose to clone as normal.
Multiplayer ships:
The special exception to landing is a multiplayer ship. Rather than be deposited outside of a multiplayer ship, the pilot is placed inside of the ship, next to the pilot station. Rather than the usual 'pilot' choice, 'start take off sequence' is the choice given. To leave the ship one must go to the physical exit ramp in the ship, and use the 'exit ship' option there. When outside of a multiplayer ship, those in the pilots group as well as the pilot have the option to go back inside using a radial menu to board ship.
If a multiplayer ship is destroyed with players inside of it, all players on board die and have the option to clone as normal.
Uses and enhancements:
The effects of being able to land a ship are such that multiplayer ships can be used to move large amounts of cargo from remote towns and locations to other towns, or even to the field. Letting ships land this way means it would be possible to introduce planets with no star ports, remote places of mystery where any pilot can go at their own risk. This would make the ship a moving house, encouraging Ace pilots to live out of their ship, something that seems characterful. A system of maintainence costs when ground side would be needed, preferably as swoop bikes suffer, so that the ship must be lifted off and stored occassionally. It is strictly not the goal of this system to introduce fields full of parked space ships to replace player cities. If one logs off with their ship out, it will dissapear and return to the datapad, to be summoned from any spaceport on that planet.
In the future, the combat angle of these ships could be enhanced. Perhaps flights over enemy territory could have AI controlled ship-NPCs 'fly' low-altitude (like a probe droid 'flys', only higher) to intercept rival ships. The turrets on multiplyer ships could behave like base turrets do now, and the idea of being able to board and destroy a ship like a factional base would add tremendous play elements to both the space and ground game.
That's the idea anyway, for how it could work. What do you think?
-Dalnara
Solospirit2162
Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:38 pm
#2
I like the ideas..it would be great if something like this could be implemented 
It would tie the two games much closer together....
wasj2004
Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:24 am
#3
Sounds good! Only changes I would make to it is we should be able to fly over citys, but can only land/park where there is enough room, like at a starport, or maybee a designated area in a player city. Also, While flying on the planet full throttle would keep us at that standard hight you mentioned, but lowering the throttle would ease the ship down to the ground for a landing.
ComCypher
Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:02 am
#4
After playing Planetside a lot lately I have grown fond of the idea of atmospheric flight. Your proposal resolves alot of the issues that are presented with atmospheric flight in SWG. A few alterations I would make are allowing the ship to fire while in the atmosphere, but only at other flying ships (shooting at ground targets would make explosion graphics but do no actual damage to anything on the ground) and atmospheric flight would be about 1.5x-2xfaster than a swoop bike.
And who knows, maybe after the CU atmospheric flight will become more feasible?
Ghost-Raven
Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:20 am
#5
Nice i like it ..also at big cities like Mos Eisley and such have starport spaces to allow ships to park temorarily..after a time limit the ship will start to deteriate ...like in Episode IV Han Solo's millinium Flacon was in a parking bay ..we can send friends wp co ord to meet us there for multiplayer ships.. or a landing platform at an Imperial outpost...
have repaier vendor npc's around to buy repair kits from... it wouldnt be feasable to allow players to attack a ship on the ground the shileds are way too strong to even impact the ship... an AT-AT or At-St might do damage...
have repaier vendor npc's around to buy repair kits from... it wouldnt be feasable to allow players to attack a ship on the ground the shileds are way too strong to even impact the ship... an AT-AT or At-St might do damage...
JaxMeridian
Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:08 pm
#6
Great Idea, solves a lot of the problems that inhibit the Ground game from impacting the Space game. As far as the programming goes, the ships (MP) could be programmed in the same way as Vehicles (like the landspeeder). During the "Load "sequence" from space to atmospheric, the spaceship is basically traded for the same item as a vehicle. Ofcourse, all items in the ship would need to be traded to the vehicle version, this would make the loading sequence a bit longer, but to those of us who like this type of option, it'd be worth it.
Also, if you think about it, this is one of the things that could increase the players in the game. We see all the playersa asking for the same thing, of couse it would make the game better, ind increaseplayers (AND HOLD ONTO THE ONES THAT ARE HERE). It would also incourage RP, and this is supposed to be an RPG...isn't it?
BriaMiner
Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:23 pm
#7
I wouldn't mind krayt hunting with my X wing. I mean, come on, if youhad to fight Godzilla, would you do it with a sledge hammer?
JaxMeridian
Mon Mar 28, 2005 8:36 pm
#8
Point conceded.
Afterall, I got the H E double hockey-sticks beat out of me by a young one not too long ago.
(Ouchie !!!!)
SiskoIMI
Mon Mar 28, 2005 9:10 pm
#9
BriaMiner wrote:
I wouldn't mind krayt hunting with my X wing. I mean, come on, if youhad to fight Godzilla, would you do it with a sledge hammer?
/lol rofl lmao
seriously would be sweet, but i can here the devs now... that would be an exploit so kryats are now going to have 3 million hams 99% resist to everyrthing and star destroyer armor.....
I think atmospheric flight should be allowed in the game, as well as combat, the Rouges do it with thier x-wings so why not the rest of us rebels?
Message Edited by SiskoIMI on 03-28-2005 07:11 PM
chessdemon
Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:04 am
#11
Sounds very cool. Right now, the ships are either a free alternative to shuttles, about how it feels when you hit the 'travel' button, you just skip the nonsense with the ticket-taker, or else something you go up in to get shot at. I'd love to be able to take my Tie in for a landing--even if that's all I could do, at least I would feel like, 'Hey, I own a great big starship!'
Pity this might never get put into place, since I gather the devs have a 'the space game and the ground game will be completely separate!' attitude. Which I can understand in some ways, don't get me wrong, even if it's not completely valid--when shipwrights make parts, they don't sell 'em on space stations. I wish they COULD, I wish I could go walking around on a space station, I wish even when I dock with a frieghter in some of my missions and supposedly board it, I was actually boarding the sucker. Heck, imagine a mission (or even just doing this without a mission) where you board a station that's under attack, help kill off those boarding it trying to take it over, and man one of the station's guns to destroy ships outside the station, not necessarily in that order. Or, from the other side, flying in, taking out a station's defender ships, battering down its shields, boarding it, and going mano a mano with the people inside before taking it over or destroying it. A lot of prime adventuring content that I for one would seriously enjoy.
Pity this might never get put into place, since I gather the devs have a 'the space game and the ground game will be completely separate!' attitude. Which I can understand in some ways, don't get me wrong, even if it's not completely valid--when shipwrights make parts, they don't sell 'em on space stations. I wish they COULD, I wish I could go walking around on a space station, I wish even when I dock with a frieghter in some of my missions and supposedly board it, I was actually boarding the sucker. Heck, imagine a mission (or even just doing this without a mission) where you board a station that's under attack, help kill off those boarding it trying to take it over, and man one of the station's guns to destroy ships outside the station, not necessarily in that order. Or, from the other side, flying in, taking out a station's defender ships, battering down its shields, boarding it, and going mano a mano with the people inside before taking it over or destroying it. A lot of prime adventuring content that I for one would seriously enjoy.
ElfDruid
Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:19 am
#12
I love the idea! Really great concept that solves issues and would add some much more to the game.
Yaurrada
Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:37 pm
#13
We have a ground game. We have a space game. We don't have anything to connect the two. I think it would be a great idea to have in the game. This is something that I would really like to see implemented(unlike Kashyyyk, or anything having to do with wookiees for that matter).
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