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Thread: A Complaint to LucasArts about Star Fighter Continuity
Get used to the idea that people will go for the best ship they can get at what ever level they are....
Look at the online flight Sims as a example.
20%-30% will be flying only one plane for almost anything they do in the game, good example is the Spitfires, great all a round plane yet a fighter like the P-47 thunderbolt my only be used by 1% of the player population due to its limitations.
That just shows how unrealistic those are as well.
LRRCP wrote:
Get used to the idea that people will go for the best ship they can get at what ever level they are....
Look at the online flight Sims as a example.
20%-30% will be flying only one plane for almost anything they do in the game, good example is the Spitfires, great all a round plane yet a fighter like the P-47 thunderbolt my only be used by 1% of the player population due to its limitations.
!
KJFett3 wrote:
That just shows how unrealistic those are as well.
LRRCP wrote:
Get used to the idea that people will go for the best ship they can get at what ever level they are....
Look at the online flight Sims as a example.
20%-30% will be flying only one plane for almost anything they do in the game, good example is the Spitfires, great all a round plane yet a fighter like the P-47 thunderbolt my only be used by 1% of the player population due to its limitations.
its unrealistic not because the P-47 is as good as a spitfire, but because not everyone is given a spitfire to fly. if all the pilots in WWII had been given the option of what they wanted to fly, they would all choose the better aircraft. unfortunatly they were not able to supply top of the line aircraft to all the aviators.
in an online game like JTLyou cant limit some people to inferior equipment, so you have to sacrifce continuity by eitherletting everyone have the top of the line ships, or by artificaly beefing up the inferior ships to the level of the better ones.
ZandaarDokedros wrote:
DavidHarper wrote:
Could you people please tell my why on earth you are being so hostile because I really do not understand.
Message Edited by DavidHarper on 07-07-2005 08:05 PM
Message Edited by DavidHarper on 07-07-2005 08:08 PM
Because you came in here with this "idea" and a bunch of numbers that you pulled out of your butt and it sounds like you have NO IDEA how complex and good the JTL game really is. Or who approves it. Lucasarts controlls ALL things SWG, for better or worse. Its a level of red tape that affects all SW projects, not just SWG. Kotor II, force commander, etc etc. They can kill anything. When sony designed the JTL system, you can bet your ass that LA saw it ahead of time, and all the ships and said yay or nay. So while writing them IS the best choice to affect radical change in the game since they can pull the plug on anything they want, its not because SOE doesnt listen.
You lost credibility on another point as well. The game ALREADY adjusts engine speed based on fighter type. The range simply isnt as high as your silly numbers would make it. The same engine in an interceptor and an xwing will NOT result in the same un modified top speed. The game also takes into account s-foils (excepting the actis)
STOP trying to make this game play like Xwing, Tie fighter, XvT, XWA, Falcon 4.0, or REALITY! Its fantasy. It also has to be FUN. Tie fighter was one of the best light flight sims i have ever played, but i have more FUN playing rogue squadron III because its arcadey and doesnt require a lot of management and its just me and the joystick.
Your idea, what little i read of it after i got tired of it had a few basic assertions right, but overall its overkill and unnecessary and shows you dont know all you think about the game and that "possibly" you might want another game.
People come here to have fun. People DO NOT have fun getting thier ass kicked flying a variety of space ships just to satisfy your variety. Ep III is new and the jedi starfighter kicks ass. There will be people who will fly that just because of the movie, like me. I love tie fighters, but i like the look of the JSF and the droid there, its great. I also love the tie interceptor. Im one of those guys who flys it die hard even though there are better choices. Im pretty decent at JTL, but i loose more pvp than i win in the T/I because it is not the best tool for the job. I dont expect everyone to enjoy losing as much as i do.
The game needs minor tweaks and balances of a few ships for a few purposes. If they deleted the ground game database, i would still pay 15 bucks to fly my space ships and not complain. I imagine a LOT of others, especially those on this board, feel the same way. So dont come in here and F up my game
Message Edited by ZandaarDokedros on 07-08-2005 12:57 PM
Since you admit you didn't even read all my post I don't even know why I am replying to you.
For a start this game is already very similar to the X-Wing games. Secondly I know there are engine modifiers alll I sugested was changing them and adding modfiers for shields too.
Yes I made up the numbers but as I have said sevral times, they were just sugestion and if you didn't like them they to give your own sugestions as to what you believe would be good for the gum. Maybe as a group we could come up with ideal stats for each craft?
DavidHarper wrote:Could you people please tell my why on earth you are being so hostile because I really do not understand.
Message Edited by DavidHarper on 07-07-2005 08:05 PM
Message Edited by DavidHarper on 07-07-2005 08:08 PM
Because you came in here with this "idea" and a bunch of numbers that you pulled out of your butt and it sounds like you have NO IDEA how complex and good the JTL game really is. Or who approves it. Lucasarts controlls ALL things SWG, for better or worse. Its a level of red tape that affects all SW projects, not just SWG. Kotor II, force commander, etc etc. They can kill anything. When sony designed the JTL system, you can bet your ass that LA saw it ahead of time, and all the ships and said yay or nay. So while writing them IS the best choice to affect radical change in the game since they can pull the plug on anything they want, its not because SOE doesnt listen.
You lost credibility on another point as well. The game ALREADY adjusts engine speed based on fighter type. The range simply isnt as high as your silly numbers would make it. The same engine in an interceptor and an xwing will NOT result in the same un modified top speed. The game also takes into account s-foils (excepting the actis)
STOP trying to make this game play like Xwing, Tie fighter, XvT, XWA, Falcon 4.0, or REALITY! Its fantasy. It also has to be FUN. Tie fighter was one of the best light flight sims i have ever played, but i have more FUN playing rogue squadron III because its arcadey and doesnt require a lot of management and its just me and the joystick.
Your idea, what little i read of it after i got tired of it had a few basic assertions right, but overall its overkill and unnecessary and shows you dont know all you think about the game and that "possibly" you might want another game.
People come here to have fun. People DO NOT have fun getting thier ass kicked flying a variety of space ships just to satisfy your variety. Ep III is new and the jedi starfighter kicks ass. There will be people who will fly that just because of the movie, like me. I love tie fighters, but i like the look of the JSF and the droid there, its great. I also love the tie interceptor. Im one of those guys who flys it die hard even though there are better choices. Im pretty decent at JTL, but i loose more pvp than i win in the T/I because it is not the best tool for the job. I dont expect everyone to enjoy losing as much as i do.
The game needs minor tweaks and balances of a few ships for a few purposes. If they deleted the ground game database, i would still pay 15 bucks to fly my space ships and not complain. I imagine a LOT of others, especially those on this board, feel the same way. So dont come in here and F up my game
Message Edited by ZandaarDokedros on 07-08-2005 12:57 PM
People are hostile because your first post was a complaint, using bad examples and attacking things you don't understand. We get lots of those in here, and those of us whe enjoy JTL are going to get defensive.
Your last post reads more like the usual suggestions to the devs rather than a screaming rant. Hey, if you've got ideas more power to you, maybe they'll listen.
But it's all in how you pitch it to us.
Attacca wrote:
S-1-l2-H-C wrote:
in an online game like JTLyou cant limit some people to inferior equipment, so you have to sacrifce continuity by eitherletting everyone have the top of the line ships, or by artificaly beefing up the inferior ships to the level of the better ones.
Sure you can, via the Tier or level system employed by most games. You start with the lowest end and work your way towards better gear (pretending the Tier 1 Heavies don't exist). Actually a very nice and balanced system.
By the way, last night I was jumped by a pack of Rebels in Deep Space - I saw an ARC, an X-Wing, and an Actis. Not bad for variety.
Attacca wrote:
People are hostile because your first post was a complaint, using bad examples and attacking things you don't understand. We get lots of those in here, and those of us whe enjoy JTL are going to get defensive.
Your last post reads more like the usual suggestions to the devs rather than a screaming rant. Hey, if you've got ideas more power to you, maybe they'll listen.
But it's all in how you pitch it to us.
Attacking things I do not understand? Well maybe I was being to harsh and it did come off as more of an attack on the game however I think I have quite good idea of how things work in the game. I have been playing Star Wars Flight Sims since I was a kid and have been reading about the ships since then aswell. I love getting into the details of how each ship works. I was in the JtLS Beta and have been playing it since then. I havebeen Master Pilot almost since JtLS was released in the UKand helped a lot of people out in piloting too. So I would like to think I have a decent understanding of the subject.
Could everyone atleast agree on some points, sorry I don't think I have worded thes to well?
1. We need to get more people into space.
2. Space needs to be bigger.
3. Space needs to be more involved with the GCW afterall the GCW in Space and the GCW on the ground SHOULD affect each other.
4. NPC ships need to be brought more in-line with player ships. Some people may say that they have to be diffrent as if the AI ships had the same stats as ours they would be to easy to kill. However I would disagree, if I remember in X-Wing Alliance the NPC ships could be set to a difficulty level where it was very hard for the player to kill them and the NPC's were flying the same craft as the Player. I am sure this could be achived in JtLS too.
5. If NPC ships are brought in-line with player ships this should also help solve the one or twohit kill in PvP. This would be because players would notthe weapons to be as strong as the are now. I think a simple solution to this would be to tone down the strength of enemy armour and shields and the strength of player weapons, whilst leaving player shields with the same stats as they curently have.
6. The X-Wing needs to lose that extra weapons slot and the TIE Interceptor needs to gain 1.
7. Shipwrights need to be able to craft the new ships that came with JtLS, the Heavy X-Wing ect.
8. The B-Wing needs its manouverability increased, even if you keep the same engine speed modifier. It has been a while since I checked but if I recall corectlyif you put the same engine in a Y-Wing and a B-Wing the Y-Wing will be faster. So maybe bring the B-Wing up a little so it handels the same as a Y-Wing but has a lower speed?
Are these good or bad points? Please give feed backdon't justattack me. Also I have very little experiance with Neutral and Imperial craft so any sugestions for those ships would be appreciated.
A lot of what you're saying is NOT new, skim by the weekly threads in the Pilot's Forum.
DavidHarper wrote:
Could everyone atleast agree on some points, sorry I don't think I have worded thes to well?
1. We need to get more people into space.
Sure.
2. Space needs to be bigger.
I dunno, it's actually pretty big now, when you consider the population. Someone mentioned the idea of (hyperspheres?), where you'd fly out one side and it'd loop you to the other. I like that idea.
3. Space needs to be more involved with the GCW afterall the GCW in Space and the GCW on the ground SHOULD affect each other.
Absolutely. We've been begging for this since JTL launched.
4. NPC ships need to be brought more in-line with player ships....
5. If NPC ships are brought in-line ....
No. I don't think the discrepancy exists that you think does. Right now, if NPC ships were as easy to kill as player ships there would be almost no change. What needs to happen is a retuning of POB ships. My suggestion is to put a "vs. POB" onto weapons like we have for shields and armor now. Fighter weapons would have a very low percentage, while other POB ship weapons would be much higher.
6. The X-Wing needs to lose that extra weapons slot and the TIE Interceptor needs to gain 1.
Who cares? TIEs have hyperdrives and shields too, makes it more fun for us Imperial pilots. Those weapon slots are pretty low on the great list of pilot issues, just see the bug thread in our forum.
7. Shipwrights need to be able to craft the new ships that came with JtLS, the Heavy X-Wing ect.
No, leave them as quest ships. But shipwrights need a lotta lovin' in other areas, perhaps retuning some old vessels, or continuing to make crafted components viable, like they recently did with engines.
8. The B-Wing needs its manouverability increased, even if you keep the same engine speed modifier. It has been a while since I checked but if I recall corectlyif you put the same engine in a Y-Wing and a B-Wing the Y-Wing will be faster. So maybe bring the B-Wing up a little so it handels the same as a Y-Wing but has a lower speed?
See #6 - I actually like this one, might make them more fun. But I'm not a rebel pilot, so not really an expert on those. Better yet, create a need for bombers (see again vs. cap ship ideas. maybe only torpedoes hurt ISD's and Freedom Station?).
XGustaX wrote:
I think the newer ships they added like the Jedi Starfighter and ARC-170 are under power ive been hearing the advanced X Wing beats them is this true? if so im glad ur e mailing lucasarts cuz thats just stupid how an "ad. X-Wing" can beat a Jedi Starfighter or ARC-170
Reading this made my IQ drop. I'm going back to hang out with the Smugglers and eat some pie.
You completely miss my point. Besides, what would you do, put a hard cap on the number of a certain type of ship allowed in a galaxy? While that might approach realistic, it sure wouldn't be part of a game I'd play.
Also, again, I'm seeing lots of variety of ships out there. I just buzzed by a dunelizard in Deep Space.