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I so agree, and if it wasn't star wars, u realize that its very likely there would be almost no ppl playing the game.

Tol Antillies
Marksman 3/4/0/3
}}}}}}}}}}}}}}CERTIFIED STAR WARS GEEK {{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{
Ships for JTL:
Yacht- Bunza Kruzna
Fighter- Destrona(II)

Just a quick couple things:


- I'm sorry for any attacks, personal or not, I made towards you. I try exceedingly hard to avoid that route, as it doesn't hold any ground in a debate.

- My biggest problem, or preconcieved opinion of the people venting on this board if you want to call it that, is that when we vent, we tend to forget that they are people, too. Most people take the corperate issues up with the individual devs. I never said they couldn't, nor did I ever said they had no right.. everybody is entitled to an opinion. My problem comes when people think attacking the devs will make everything alright. What would you rather have, somebody calmly and constructively pointing out the faults in your plan, or somebody simply telling you your game sucks, you lie all the time, and you have no idea how to do your job? Take your pick.

- Yes, I enjoy this game. No, I do not think it's the best game ever. It's far from it. This game is buggy, and I'll be right in line to say so. However, I take the constructive, calm route, unlike a lot of other posters on these boards. Being a designer of games myself, I know and value the difference between contructive critism and flames. The latter only makes things worse. As for playing it all the time, I play maybe an hour a day. Most of the time I play City of Heroes, because I have more fun for extended periods of time in that game. I also spend time with my family and friends, so I'm not what some people would call a "fanboi". But, when it comes to senseless dev bashing, yes, I will defend them. Sometimes because they deserve the praise and defense, other times because I like playing devil's advocate. It makes people think, and sometimes sheds light from a different angle.

- Puppies and flowers? Hardly. I hated EQ, from the beginning and even now, during the "balanced" times. SOE is part of Sony, which is a huge coperation. I wouldn't flat out call them evil, but they aren't saintly, either. They have questionable business acts and customer service, but they have great products, too. It's the same way with other large corperation. Nobody, or nothing, in the world is perfect. As for you thinking too deeply into it? Yes, I think so. I think you need to step back a bit, because you took the time to write a large explination to me on how SOE pretty much onlyhas own pocket books in mind. Yeah, they're out to make money, what company isn't? But the way you put it, they're out to make money by sacrificing the one thing that actually pays their bills: customer satisfaction. That just doesn't make sense to me, sir.

Bottom line: Everybody makes mistakes, but does that mean they should be condemed for eternity for it? Lighten up a bit, and you'll see when the flames die down, people are more willing to see us as humans who care about the game and less like unhappy wallets.

Veritanil Ovack - Master Shipwright

My origional post wasnt to degrade the Devs, SOE,Lucasarts, or anybody. I was just trying to post on what events took place and what I think the most logical reasoning behind why they took place. Im just a guy thats a fan of the game thats tired of being punked around. I see things that other people dont see or dont want to see, and/or dont know to look for or want to look for. Im not anymore special than they are, I just took time to stop and look at this from a corporate standpoint. I never meant to make it out to say that SOE was evil or trying to do some insidious plan to rule over uslol. However, looking back over what I wrote, I could see how someone could come to that conclusion, because how I wrote it seemed a little like a conspiracy theory. I think it turned out that way because Im somewhat of a novelist and I just worded it like that. You gotta admit though, it does make you stop and think about it all.

I am a bit tempered about this entire subject, and Ill make no excuses for being so, nor will I apologise for what my origional post said. Mostly, the reason for my aggrivation is because I so much want to see this game be better, and I just dont see it doing that. Still, I dont see the actual game getting worse either. So in reality, I guess no progress is better than regressing. However, they had an opportunity to progress, and they didnt take it. But that isnt to say the devs dont try.

Honestly, I feel like whateveranyone says on these forums doesnt change the way the game turns out in the slightest. I think that when they look at player input in how to change this game, they see what gamers are having problems with and then fix them according to what the developers can and cant do or what they wantto do. Iread these forumsat least once a day, and though I dont postmuch, I see and read what people are saying. I have yet tosee anything implemented into the gamethat anyone or a group of people have specificallysuggested that would help the game (except when someone cries nerf, but then the devs just nerf what they want about whatever theyre nerfing)toadd. These forums are ntohing more than a moderating tool. They dont use these to allow us to help create the game content. They use them to help moderate what doesnt work and how many people feel that way. After that, they go and do their own agenda to handle the problem. Thats why I am so bold right now, to say the things I say about them. If they actually read it, then I would expect someone from SOE or Lucasarts to reply to this. But they dont read it so what does any of it matter in the first place. Just wait and see ifthey reply. If they do I take back this entire paragraph. And really, if they did reply, Id be inclined to think someone tipped them off to take notice what I have written just for spite.

Ivewritten so many things on these forums of howI think some ideaswould affect the game for the better, and I havent seen them happen in even the slightestways. And this isnt just a personal note, this iseverything Ive read from other players. The Jedi scenario is a perfect example. How many people do you think posted meraculously ingenius ideas about how it would be better? Granted, there were some really lame ideas too. All those posts, and its still a grind!!!!??? I want to meet the person(s) who play(s) this game that said they would like to see an experience grind as the revised system. I want to meet the person(s) so I can slap them, not just for my grief, but everyone else's that feels the same way, whoever they are.

I know itsnoteasy to makegames, and I know thatwith talented programmers and the right tools, its not so irritatitingly impossible as there seems to be a serious misconception of. The hardest part isnt actually making what you want to make, its trying to think of what it is you want to make. These guys are all artists, and Iof all people know what its like to have artists block. The devs arent struggling tocome up with ideas to put into the game, theyre sturggling with how to actually make it work in a game. Not to be confused with putting it in the game, just simply trying to come up with how they can make it fit and work. I do it all the time. Ill start getting into something, and before I know it, I realise its a lot bigger than what I had previously scoped, and I run into unforseen conflicts. This is totally acceptable. That was never my arguement, and I never intended it to be as such. But, maybe somewhere I lost track. All I ever wanted to point out was that SOE and Lucasarts as a combined team, have made some poor choices in the development of this game, and to display and show how these choices have led us to what we have now.

There were seriously seriously poor choices made in the development of this game, and moneywas the real deciding factor in those decisions, not the wellfare of the game. I dont care how you slice it, or what anyone says. The bottom line was which decisionswould bring the most profit. This game has been constructed with that in mind. These developers and marketers and officials will never convince me that SWG was ready to launch when it did. They will never convince me that people needed to have a warm up time before everything else was put into the game. They will never convince me that Jedi revamp (althoughI agree is important) was more important than a combat revamp. Ill just never believe any of that because that doesnt make any sense from a business perspective.

What they HAVE done to the game has been been executed very well and Ill never say they arent talented programmers and marketers. What I will say though is that designing the best game they can according to people enjoying it was not their only or most important motivating factor..... Clearification -The developers probably did in fact want to make the most awesome game... but the marketers are boss, and what they say goes, and the marketers may care about the product, but they care about the money they make moreso. How do I know this? Because thats their job. I mean its SONY for crying out loud. Theyve already said their mission is to be the company you have to go to to get the best entertainment value. I cant remember exactly where I read that, so feel free to discredit that statementthat as you wish as I cant defend it with proof.

I do think into thesematters too much, but its only because Ill recieve some peice of information, and another, add the two together, get the result, and then it just snowballs, and then wonder how everyone else doesnt get it. And admitedly, the firstreply towards you wasnt exactly in the nicest tone either. I worte it a little upset at you, and really, I dont even know why I got upset at you, because I usually dont care what people say about me (even if you werent talking directly about me, I percieved it as such). But being caught in the moment, I let my mouth run off. At any rate, I apologise for being so pissy towards you.

Bottom line is though, that SOE has a lot of upset customers right now.What really urks me about it is when they turn to us and tell us that our complaining isnt helping matters. Well, heres another news flash to them, had they listened to us in the beginning, they wouldnt be feeling all the heatright now. So they are getting what they deserved as far as Im concened.But, Im a reasonable man, and I am contempt when I see there is justiceserved throughouta conflict, whether it works my way or not. I feel that I have been very calmand very patient with the whole subject, and even so in my writing. But, allI was doing was writing what appears to be the truth in whats really going on here. What can I say? The truth hurts.

You know that saying that if you collected all the hot air you breath out from all the talking from your entire life you'd be able to heat a cup of coffee? I think if you read all his posts, just in this one thread, out loud you'd come close to heating that very same cup ...

Tommas 8-)

Fleet Admiral Tommas Equinox
Talusian Elite Force Royal Navy
TEF - Alpha Squadron
Talus, Eclipse

no way, i say its enough to melt lead.

well... this was 2 hrs of my life ill never get back... i think i have to go take my eyes out and soak them in cold water...

mind you i do agree with the initial post (i think... honestly dont remember...)

Lucious Paladin - Jedi Padawan(NeXuS Magnet)
Roberto Paladin - Master Bounty Hunter Carbineer

Hrmmm now where is it ....

/searchforrelevantsigqoute

Oh! There it is .... Here Col .... i think you deserve this more then i do

/HandColsigqoute"Why say something with one word when you can say it with twenty?"

*walks off mumbling ... need to find and new gig i guess

" Nice place, What are we gonna blow up first"

/Sigh Life is good

Why say something with one word when you can say it with twenty?

I wrote the original post just after the Jedi Revamp. Alot of the disscussion that went on you wont be able to see because it was also posted in the JTL forums ..... talking bout the ones that were pre JTL beta and all that .... Now that CU is out and folks have settled down into the major changes i would like to hear their thoughts about how the devs are doing

" Nice place, What are we gonna blow up first"

/Sigh Life is good

Why say something with one word when you can say it with twenty?