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Thread: What is wrong with weapons? 20 missiles into tier 4 tie only 20% sheild damage
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Ducimus
Tue Dec 07, 2004 10:49 am
#14
Overall i feel missles are just a huge disappointment in JTL.
They're just not that effictive most of the time, and they are anything but cost effective.
Unless its something like an MP ship, missles, most of the time, are just a waste of mass and reactor energy.
They're just not that effictive most of the time, and they are anything but cost effective.
Unless its something like an MP ship, missles, most of the time, are just a waste of mass and reactor energy.
Jyeoi
Tue Dec 07, 2004 5:15 pm
#15
Ever occured to you the NPCs might be using Countermeasures? The higher the tier, more more frequent and effective the usage. I noticed that if i fire a missle at long range it will most likely do no damage at all... due to the teim the NPC ship has to react. But if i fire one up close, 80 % of the time i get a good hit, 50% of the time the ship blows up. Test your missles on lower tiers you will see they work just fine. Lower tier pilots dunt know how to get out of a missles flight path.
HardwiredXMan
Tue Dec 07, 2004 8:35 pm
#16
Regardless to how effective people think the missiles are or if they are worth using.....to me I do not fear any npc missiles....they just don't do any significant damage.....they sure don't fire a lot of them at you, plus when they do you can easily turn on the boosters and turn and they miss you...no countermeasures needed......
In the situation that I'm doing the missile shooting at a npc ship....no matter what tier they are, missiles just simply don't have any advantage over using some good ole blasters.......
The cons with missiles.....they miss often, they have limited range, they can be evaded every single time, you can use countermeasures on them, when they do hit, the damage is barely noticeable....see all of these things are not cons for blasters and are all things that blasters don't do (like miss easily, be evaded easily or do very little damage etc.)......but the biggest thing to me is that blasters are a one time cost and don't need to spend 20k for a pack of limited ammo....unlimited energy baby!.........so why use a missile over a blaster....simply no advantage at all.
The pros with missiles......only good against larger ships (MP ships, corvette...etc.)...but then if you have a squadron of fighters in this situation.....you really don't need missiles anyway....so again, not all that great.
For some reason the devs nerfed missiles really really bad for live...because in beta missiles could actually kill targets....I remember when I would use up all my missiles first because they could kill targets faster than blasters...
In my opinion, the difference between missiles and blasters is that blasters should do less damage but fire at a very high rate....while missiles should be very slow and avoidable but when they do hit (even if they get close to the ship) they should do double the damage of any blaster, cannon, disrupter or turret.
I know JTL is not a simulation and is more of an arcade style game.....but one thing I think the devs could have implemented that could up the value actually buying and using missiles is that since they create a gigantic explosive that covers nearly 50 times the area that any energy weapon can.....when you let off a countermeasure and it's too close to your ship, the explosion should still do massive damage to your ship......see, the use of countermeasures have limitations too....you can't just let one of and the missile hits it 20 meters away from your ship and you take absolutely no damage....the blast radius and the power of that blast should be enough to do more damage to your ship than a energry weapon can.....for this reason you need to let off a countermeasure early enough so that the missile impacts the countermeasures far enough away from your ship.........This is how it is in Freelancer.....that game is a very good space game to me when it comes to the effectiveness of missiles and countermeasures...you only get a second or two before a counter measure is useless even if you successfully get it off before the missile hits you......it's like you hear the lock on, you get maybe 2 beeps, if you fire your CM on the third beep, you still take a lot of damage...not as much as a direct hit, but more than a blaster would have done......in JTL, you can literally let off a CM and it impacts a missile 2 meters away from you and your ship takes no damage at all....that's just not how it should be.
JTL just doesn't have a great missile system....missiles are supposed to pack a punch....in some cases missiles should totally disable shields not just chip off 2% of a shield while a blaster with less max damage cand chip of 10%.........The vs. shield and vs. armor rating on all missiles should not be lower than 90% (or .900)....I mean you most likely won't hit with them often enough for it to unbalance space combat.....and you get a very limited supply any way....if missiles were changed to be what they are supposed to be....then the cost and use would be justified....right now there simply isn't any justification to using missiles....and I'm not just talking about 1 kind of missile, I'm talking about every missile in the game...so those that say use space bombs....well that's only one ordinace that works...what about the rest of them?
Message Edited by HardwiredXMan on 12-07-2004 10:38 PM
Message Edited by HardwiredXMan on 12-07-2004 10:43 PM
atat9619
Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:40 am
#17
Missles aren't as crapy as you think.So this player in a a-wing was impossible hit.I had to let it fly far away so I could get a misslelock.Then well the a-wing got blown up in one shot at 100% shields,armor,chassis,and systems
Vicotnik
Wed Dec 08, 2004 4:49 am
#18
atat9619 wrote:
Missles aren't as crapy as you think.So this player in a a-wing was impossible hit.I had to let it fly far away so I could get a misslelock.Then well the a-wing got blown up in one shot at 100% shields,armor,chassis,and systems
PvP and PvE are two different things all together. Missiles are very useful in PvP (perhaps too much of a "I win" button), while they are almost useless in PvE.
PetaByte32
Wed Dec 08, 2004 6:18 am
#19
Depending on how you set them up in the Manage screen and how they are fired will make a big deal in the outcome of the missle salvo launched.
I fly an oppressor with launchers. First one is a Conc, second is a Proton, and third is a Space Bomb. If I fire them in that order I get an instant on almost all the Tier 5 fighters and even some gunboats. Took out the Dark Eclipse in two passes.
But you have to watch the order they hit. You hit with the Conc first knocking out shields by about 25-30%. Then the Proton missle drops it to 50%. Finally you hit with the space bomb that blows everything else all to heck. But if I fire and the space bomb hits first it will do almost nothing if anything.
Tyranus
truewildman
Wed Dec 08, 2004 12:26 pm
#20
Vicotnik wrote:
atat9619 wrote:
Missles aren't as crapy as you think.So this player in a a-wing was impossible hit.I had to let it fly far away so I could get a misslelock.Then well the a-wing got blown up in one shot at 100% shields,armor,chassis,and systems
PvP and PvE are two different things all together. Missiles are very useful in PvP (perhaps too much of a "I win" button), while they are almost useless in PvE.
*Makes note to self to load chaff launcher prior to PvPing*
Amuro0079
Thu Dec 09, 2004 12:29 am
#22
LOL, I never put any missile launcher on my PVP ships--don't have enough mass to accommodate, but I do keep a chaff launcher at all times just in case no-aimmers lauch one at me.
Pand
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:37 am
#23
Ok I am tring to say there is a bug with the missles. They use to shoot 2 at a time when grouped they don't anymore. Only one comes out of my ship yet the total qty of both tubes goes down. I have two sbomb tubes in my ship that do 21k max dam each and are 95% to shields and armor. The problem is now both don't fire but both are used. Why give us the ability to group them if they both don't fire. Before they did that update I would see two come out of my ship and hit the target.
truewildman
Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:49 am
#25
Pand wrote:
Ok I am tring to say there is a bug with the missles. They use to shoot 2 at a time when grouped they don't anymore. Only one comes out of my ship yet the total qty of both tubes goes down. I have two sbomb tubes in my ship that do 21k max dam each and are 95% to shields and armor. The problem is now both don't fire but both are used. Why give us the ability to group them if they both don't fire. Before they did that update I would see two come out of my ship and hit the target.
Are they just not firing visually for you? Although you may not see it, it's still doing the damage it should, right?
Vicotnik
Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:30 pm
#26
PetaByte32 wrote:
Depending on how you set them up in the Manage screen and how they are fired will make a big deal in the outcome of the missle salvo launched.
I fly an oppressor with launchers. First one is a Conc, second is a Proton, and third is a Space Bomb. If I fire them in that order I get an instant on almost all the Tier 5 fighters and even some gunboats. Took out the Dark Eclipse in two passes.
But you have to watch the order they hit. You hit with the Conc first knocking out shields by about 25-30%. Then the Proton missle drops it to 50%. Finally you hit with the space bomb that blows everything else all to heck. But if I fire and the space bomb hits first it will do almost nothing if anything.
Tyranus
Yes, but consider the cost per kill on that setup. It's not quite feasible to use missiles in this way in the long run, unless you could care less about resource and credit cost. Missiles are just not worth it if you consider the cost per shot, effect per shot and compare that with the cost per shot and effect per shot on your average blasters...
Besides, very few ships have three launchers. Only ones I know of is the Nova, Decimator and Oppressor. 
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