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Thread: The Stealth Loot Nerf
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shfire
Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:02 am
#14
I would have to agree with the others on this. I do not believe thier is a change. Yes thier is a lot of stuff that look likr crap, but take this for example, something I looted yesterday: Level 10 shields 'Tam & Bak Eliete Shields' Front:2240 back: 1950 Mass: 55k Energy: something like 2400 (here is the good part) Recharge rate: 14.5. Now when I get all 10 shields for RE I bet most of them will have just 1 stat that is really good, but the shield that will come out of it will be awesome.
Maxila
Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:36 am
#15
shfire wrote:
I would have to agree with the others on this. I do not believe thier is a change. Yes thier is a lot of stuff that look likr crap, but take this for example, something I looted yesterday: Level 10 shields 'Tam & Bak Eliete Shields' Front:2240 back: 1950 Mass: 55k Energy: something like 2400 (here is the good part) Recharge rate: 14.5. Now when I get all 10 shields for RE I bet most of them will have just 1 stat that is really good, but the shield that will come out of it will be awesome.
The stat in that example is not good to me. I can make Level 9 shields witha 16 recharge and have looted level 10 shields with close to an 18 recharge and many more with 15 +.
The current RE'd shield I use has a recharge of 18.5, Front of 2800, back 2780, mass 42k and I forget he enegy use but it is real low.
So I'm wondering if other people's standards of what is good are lower then mine because they havent seen as much loot as I have?
Let me give you guys a few examples of some of the better stuff I've seen.
Level 8 engines speed 103 RE'd to about to 106 YPand R over 70
Level6 capacitors 42 to 46 recharge energy 1100 to 1300
Level 8 Guns uo tp 3800 max damage only 14 energy per shot .69 vs shields and armor
Level 10 guns over 4200 max damage .74 an .75 vs Shields and armor (RE'd them to .79 and about 4400 max damage)
Level 4 reactors 14 to 15 K energy generation
Particulary in the level 4 to 6 stuffI used to see more stuff drop with real super stats then I do now and I'm sure we all still get tier 5 ships sometimes dropping level 1 and 2 stuff. This just seems wrong but is getting off the post main topic.
_Reflex_
Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:55 am
#16
In addition to the loot nerf another really aspect of the loot system is getting Level 10 Certification items that are Reverse Engineering Level 3/5 and won't combine with 10/10 items.
Marzuk147
Fri Dec 31, 2004 10:38 am
#17
Meh people can one star away it doesnt bother me 
I do occasionally get a good chuckle out of what people choose to 1 star though.
I do occasionally get a good chuckle out of what people choose to 1 star though.
Wokka
Fri Dec 31, 2004 10:46 am
#18
Maxila wrote:
shfire wrote:I would have to agree with the others on this. I do not believe thier is a change. Yes thier is a lot of stuff that look likr crap, but take this for example, something I looted yesterday: Level 10 shields 'Tam & Bak Eliete Shields' Front:2240 back: 1950 Mass: 55k Energy: something like 2400 (here is the good part) Recharge rate: 14.5. Now when I get all 10 shields for RE I bet most of them will have just 1 stat that is really good, but the shield that will come out of it will be awesome.The stat in that example is not good to me. I can make Level 9 shields witha 16 recharge and have looted level 10 shields with close to an 18 recharge and many more with 15 +.
The current RE'd shield I use has a recharge of 18.5, Front of 2800, back 2780, mass 42k and I forget he enegy use but it is real low.
So I'm wondering if other people's standards of what is good are lower then mine because they havent seen as much loot as I have?
Let me give you guys a few examples of some of the better stuff I've seen.
Level 8 engines speed 103 RE'd to about to 106 YPand R over 70
Level6 capacitors 42 to 46 recharge energy 1100 to 1300
Level 8 Guns uo tp 3800 max damage only 14 energy per shot .69 vs shields and armor
Level 10 guns over 4200 max damage .74 an .75 vs Shields and armor (RE'd them to .79 and about 4400 max damage)
Level 4 reactors 14 to 15 K energy generation
Particulary in the level 4 to 6 stuffI used to see more stuff drop with real super stats then I do now and I'm sure we all still get tier 5 ships sometimes dropping level 1 and 2 stuff. This just seems wrong but is getting off the post main topic.
Well, after hearing this, I would say your perceptions have indeed changed. What is crap for you (due to an elitist change in thinking) is actually good for others. I think you may have just raised your bar to be higher than you yourself can accept.
Wokka-wokka
Maxila
Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:37 pm
#19
Marzuk FYI I did not 1 star you, I understood what you were saying and didn't think whoever did the 1 star should have.
Marzuk147
Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:28 pm
#20
"I too have 2 lvl8 guns doing 3600 damage and EPS in the 14's. I have seen several of those, but not lately."
This is the human perception part Im talking about. I NEVER! Found a weapon with 14 eps, I did however get them as a tier 4 quest reward. If you purchased one, a stupid person sold their quest reward. You did not however loot one. If you DO think you looted one, please post a picture of it PRE RE, so that we can see what it is.
This is the human perception part Im talking about. I NEVER! Found a weapon with 14 eps, I did however get them as a tier 4 quest reward. If you purchased one, a stupid person sold their quest reward. You did not however loot one. If you DO think you looted one, please post a picture of it PRE RE, so that we can see what it is.
Spinnthrift
Fri Dec 31, 2004 7:07 pm
#21
Maxila wrote:
Wokka wrote:
Well, after hearing this, I would say your perceptions have indeed changed. What is crap for you (due to an elitist change in thinking) is actually good for others. I think you may have just raised your bar to be higher than you yourself can accept.
Wokka-wokka
Not elitist at all???? This is the kind of loot that used to drop much more often....Fact
My ships are already decked out with this stuff it's the newer players to JTL who's ships won't be as good as people who got the good loot before the nerf.
An elitist would be happy that they will continue to be more uber then other players, due to the fact that new player won't be able to get their ships as well equiped after the loot nerf.
In fact because my ships are well equiped I was RE'ing the loot and giving it to guildies to improve there ships, often for free or extremely cheap.
How can the reduced stats be good for others when older players like me will have better ships for PvE and PvP. As it is now when I'm hunting a spot and others come I get almost all the kills, credits and loot even when others players come in a group. If they send me a tell asking me to work something out so they can get some kills I will accomadate them. If they just try to beat me, by out damaging me or disabling the ships then I'll just do the same back and they usually leave after seeing they are wasting their time.
I don't see how nerfing the loot stats is good for up and comming pilots?
Yes - the loot nerf has happened. Stuff doesn't drop with *anywhere* near the same quantity or quality.
You're also right about the first players getting stuff, but this is SOE's solution.
If you find an exploit that gives you an advantage - exploit is hard and fast and keep your mouth shut. This is verified by the recent change on shields (Beofre anyone says anything - I don't have an RE'd shield, but I know several guys who do). The intelligent solution would have been to change the ship (npc) damage and raise all shield values up to counter the exploit, but as this takes work - the devs created a solution which made those who got there first benefit.
Items drop hardly near what they did, in quantity or quality- but Shipwrights *aren't* benefitting as people are starting to tire of paying the sums of money required to keep a ship maintained to combat worthiness. JTL is now reduced to a free and fast shuttle service because there's nothing else that warrants playing it.
Loot doesn't drop. Good loot drops even less.
The whiners won and space is barren. God bless the whiners.
Happy New Year everyone! 
P.S. For those wondering - I'm working on my third Master since launch - so I've earned a minimum of 10 mil exp so far. Not to mention toons on other servers.
Pseudopd
Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:53 pm
#22
Spinnthrift wrote:
Yes - the loot nerf has happened. Stuff doesn't drop with *anywhere* near the same quantity or quality.
Well, that is a personal opinion based on you're point of view. You might very well be right! And, You might also be very wrong. I guess i'm just pointing out that a stealth nerf might just be an unlucky roll.
If i bought a sandwich and Subway, and the meat was bad, i wouldn't make the conclusion that:
a) Subway hates me and did this on purpose to get me sick
b) ALL sandwich meats are bad. Eveywhere.
c) Maybe the Subway i went to had a bad batch of meat...
It's all a point of view. I could go with A or B, and a longshot would be one of those are right, but it's all just a guess...
I should also point out that in Beta JTL, the loot drops were tuned up WAY too high. The Devs said they would tone that down at launch. It could be that you experienced the just pre-toned down loot drop calculations, and the loot drop now was the way it was supposed to be?
But, yes, people who started JTL launch day would have the cool loot (i wound say uber). Just was there were once "pre-nerfed" Probe droids. An adjustment was made to what was envisioned? A stealth Nerf? Or, a predetermined fix? Who can say here?
But, like everything else, this is just an opinion, and you might have guess right after all...
...or maybe not.
Baz Pseudopod
Marzuk147
Fri Dec 31, 2004 9:24 pm
#23
Just a few days ago I looted parts to put together the best L10 blaster Ive seen. I looted a 46k mass RE10, a .79 sheilds .72 armor RE10, and one with 4450 max damage.
If loot truely has been nerfed, Id think there was much better out there, the question is, is there? Keep in mind Ive been flying TONS since release, and I havent seen better.
If loot truely has been nerfed, Id think there was much better out there, the question is, is there? Keep in mind Ive been flying TONS since release, and I havent seen better.
Spinnthrift
Fri Dec 31, 2004 10:25 pm
#24
Well, either loot isn't dropping anywhere near as frequently as it was in space (or on the ground for that matter)- or I'm the unluckiest person on the planet. I accept that I suck at looting on the ground - having pulled *nothing* from 7 Krayt today.. or was it 9...? And *nothing* from Krayt yesterday - and that was closer to 14, then a cargo pocket and 4k credits from a pair of Elders, so when I go into space and muck about up there for an hour killing tier 1's with my n00b toon on another server and loot *nothing* but credits I start to wonder. How many unlucky rolls canI get?
Pseudopd wrote:
Well, that is a personal opinion based on you're point of view. You might very well be right! And, You might also be very wrong. I guess i'm just pointing out that a stealth nerf might just be an unlucky roll.
But, like everything else, this is just an opinion, and you might have guess right after all...
...or maybe not.
Baz Pseudopod
#edit# You notice the posts about people complaining about grinding? Space grind, Jedi grind, loot grind etc...? I'm starting to think I'm not alone. I will concede that there are a lot of posts where people rave about how fantastic x or y or z item they looted was - but if we ever had a dev respond (not that that's likely to happen or that we can validate it's truth - see the Announce from Tiggs about fixing Chim - but it was *still* loading for hours after that post) - I'd be curious to see how they do things.
My post stated that instead of taking a hard work approach to SWG, the Devs have continuously taken an easy option out. Let me give you a *few* examples. In recent times - we have the Reward Engine nerf, because Shipwrights moaned that they couldn't make anything close, so instead of making it so Shipwrights could make comparable items, they bork the reward (note: removing fun and shiny thing for players), then instead of intelligently reworking the way Shipwright engines work - they stick a quick fix in to shush the bleeding hearts. Read the forums in Shipwright. How about another one - the exploited shield RE? Instead of reworking npc damage upwards and raising looted shield values while implementing the *fix* to the exploit - to not only allow a continuity in balance but as a side effect increasing PvP duration they fix the shields and the exploiters are now sitting there with fantastic tech'd components.
Would you like some ground based ones as well?
Commando had a way over powered fire DoT. I don't know if you were playing back then, but a Commando in PvP used to be quite hideous. While fixing the issue of the DoT, the Devs left *every* other weapon broken for how many months? Grenades are *still* broken unless you're grinding FS exp.
Creature Handler was overpowered - so instead of tweaking it to make it viable with other classes, they left it as the joke of the PvE world and well - when was the last time you used a rancor or CL >10 pet in a player vs player skirmish?
I could go on, but if you know your SWG history - you'll hopefully agree the position I've taken here.
I am not a casual player. I accept this. I accept that my day will revolve around killing the NM's and HNM's and then for a breather I take my firespray up and blast some random stuff for a while, or go log onto my Imp toon and shoot down some X-Wings and the like for a while... my "while"probably isas long as most casual gamer's sessions are, and when I see little to no reward - I'm guessing the casual's see even less. You're right, this is just my opinion, and opinion's *are* by their nature flawed - but the more I play - the more I see validity in this opinion.
One thing you cannot deny me however - the communication from our dear Dev's, those hardworking geniuses who have butchered this fine license, is lacking at best. The playerbase is left ill informed and hard done by because of this alone. #end edit#
Message Edited by Spinnthrift on 12-31-2004 09:50 PM
#Edit No. 2# I just took my Firespray up and hurt little tier ones for a while and looted some stuff - ranging from 2 - 7. Nothing worth keeping though. 
At least loot *does* drop for me again. #End edit#
Message Edited by Spinnthrift on 12-31-2004 10:56 PM
Maxila
Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:34 am
#25
Wokka wrote:
Well, after hearing this, I would say your perceptions have indeed changed. What is crap for you (due to an elitist change in thinking) is actually good for others. I think you may have just raised your bar to be higher than you yourself can accept.
Wokka-wokka
Not elitist at all???? This is the kind of loot that used to drop much more often....Fact
My ships are already decked out with this stuff it's the newer players to JTL who's ships won't be as good as people who got the good loot before the nerf.
An elitist would be happy that they will continue to be more uber then other players, due to the fact that new player won't be able to get their ships as well equiped after the loot nerf.
In fact because my ships are well equiped I was RE'ing the loot and giving it to guildies to improve there ships, often for free or extremely cheap.
How can the reduced stats be good for others when older players like me will have better ships for PvE and PvP. As it is now when I'm hunting a spot and others come I get almost all the kills, credits and loot even when others players come in a group. If they send me a tell asking me to work something out so they can get some kills I will accomadate them. If they just try to beat me, by out damaging me or disabling the ships then I'll just do the same back and they usually leave after seeing they are wasting their time.
I don't see how nerfing the loot stats is good for up and comming pilots?
Mirthain
Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:48 am
#26
I have to go with the original author on this,
Nerf is a bit strong, but reduction in the quality of loot I can agree on.
I spend quite a bit of time in space doing missions for my SW's to grind out Firespray parts, and I have noticed that gun stats in particular have gotten worse in general. I too have 2 lvl8 guns doing 3600 damage and EPS in the 14's. I have seen several of those, but not lately.
It was around the last patch I noticed it. It's not a huge thing, but subtle.
And we aren't "elite", perhaps we got exceptional loot more often, but it seems that the loot drops have shifted slightly to less quality loot.
Talen
Nerf is a bit strong, but reduction in the quality of loot I can agree on.
I spend quite a bit of time in space doing missions for my SW's to grind out Firespray parts, and I have noticed that gun stats in particular have gotten worse in general. I too have 2 lvl8 guns doing 3600 damage and EPS in the 14's. I have seen several of those, but not lately.
It was around the last patch I noticed it. It's not a huge thing, but subtle.
And we aren't "elite", perhaps we got exceptional loot more often, but it seems that the loot drops have shifted slightly to less quality loot.
Talen
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