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First off, Lesnar just detailed everything that is WRONG with Squad Leader. No punches were pulled and everyone here should read it.

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=squad_leader&message.id=2482

It's the comprehensive list of every way Squad Leader fails currently, and we really ought to sticky that. I want to do a complimentary thread here with what we can CHANGE about Squad Leader. Specificly, new skills that could be added to take the place of the lousy ones we have now. Shuyuhn made an outstanding list that I will repost below. I'm gladly inviting other concepts. I don't really want much commentary on the concepts here, let's just sort of throw out ideas, and when we get a good strong brew we might even be able to get a semi-finalized list. So, no criticism yet, just ideas. And the suggestions can be both specific skills you cast or just passive benefits. Let's be open to new ideas. But to get you started, here are a few things to consider about your skill suggestions.

1) Is it something that will genuinely benefit the group? In other words, just because it looks good on paper, would it function properly in combat?

2) Is it something that the Squad Leader could do that no one else could? If it's just a healing skill, there are Doctors and Medics that can already do that. It should be something that makes us unique.

3) Would it be worth the tradeoff? Does the cost of your suggestion pay off well enough that people would want to use it.

4) Is it a skill that would help your Squad achieve its goals? They don't ALL have to be combat-oriented skills. Squad Leaders should do more than just buff the team for combat.

Okay, okay, I'll go first.

Urgency: Increases the attack speedfor all group members. This one is self-explanitory, and I can't imagine ANYONE complaining about it.

Trick Shot: Allows group members to use specialtyattacks without cost to their HAM. It would have to be worth the cost to your own HAM to cast it, so should either have a moderate cost (say, the cost of 3-5 specialattacks of your own) or it should have a longer duration.

Embolden: All attacks have a chance to scare MOBs off. Obviously a PvE skill, it would be a lifesaver when trying to retreat.

Raise Spirits: When in camp, this skill reduces X% of the group's Battle Fatigue. 60 minute recharge before casting again. This would give the Squad Leader a UNIQUE ability in the game that could allow a Squad to work more efficiently in the field.

Mobilize: Removes all DOTs from your group (pets included) at a cost to self. This one is basically a replcement for Form Up, but one that might be useful in some way, shape or form.

Mission Paramters: Passive skill that makes the ACTIVE waypoints from anyone's datapad show up on the Squad Leader's map. This skill would cut mission run times in half, at least. That alone would be enough to welcome a Squad Leader to your group.

Close Quarters: Reduces the point blank penalty on all weapons for X number of seconds. This could be another lifesaver if you get pinned down by melee MOBs.

Weak point: Increases damage versusmonsters by .20% * The highest creature knowledge possessed by a group member. Increases damage versus players/humanoids by .20% * The highest medicine use possessed by a group member.

Injury empathy: Targeted group membertakes 40% less damage, that 40% is spread evenly among all the other players. Will not be split if it will kill a group member.

Shared Expertise (passive) : If another group member is getting the same kind of experience, any more experience of that type earned comes with a 4% bonus.

Long Distance march: Drains 100 action/minute from all group members, but increases running speed by 15%.

CoordinatedTreatment (passive): If a player is healed more than once in a timespan of 20 seconds, all healings after the first will have an increased 20% effectiveness.

Fully Assisted Recovery (only usable in camps): Players will recover 4 hp/sec for every medic in the group. Droids will heal2 hp/sec for every engineer in the group, and an additional5 hp/sec per droid engineer. Pets will heal 2 hp/sec for every medic in the group, plus 4 hp/sec for every Creature handler. 15-30 minute cooldown.

Hmm I should clear these up a little. A person with Maxed creature knowledge would be givinga 20% bonus vs creatures, and maxed medicine use would be giving a 20% bonus vs humanoids, in case that wasn't clear.

Shared expertise is when more than one person is getting the same exp type, i.e. when there are two pistoleers, the extra exp is from them learning from each other.

1- /SYSGROUP should be a larger font or a different color (I would recommend RED) then the rest of the info that uses the same space. I.E. experince, rewards, etc. This would allow people to be able to discern the commands SLs give in very hectic situations or in very large groups.

2- PMCS (Prventive Maintenance Checks and Services)- this ability allows a SL to take a weapon or a piece of armor that has fallen to 0 durability (either from no artisan being present or someone messing up on a repair) and temporarily return the item back to a mission capable status. Would only work one time and only for a duration (30 min-1 hour preferably but that would probably not fly). After the duration had faded the item in question would be destroyed.

3- DIG IN- this ability would be used to bolster the defenses of the squad's camp. Be it the actual defensevalue of the camp (I.E. the ranger's field base) or that the SL's defensive abilities increased while in a camp. Instead of +10 to defense could be +15, but only while in his squad's camp. This ability would be able to affect anyone's camp in thesquad not just the SL's personal camps.

4- RECON- allow the Novice SL to have a farther range of detection on his radar. This ability would increase with the skill of the SL. Thus allowing a SL of higher level to be able to observe a larger portion of the battlefield and command his squad accordingly. Also allowing him/her to find danger spots earlier and move his squad through areas more safely.

5- Squadleader Mission Terminals- similiar to that of the bounty hunter but the mission is determined from the capability of the group as a whole and only a SL would be able to access it. Unlike the the BH terminal this would be like the reb/imp missions. For example a squadleader could be given a mission to take his squad into enemie territory and hinder a supply line that is heavily guarded, or detsroy a armored assault vehicle that is said to house important comunication gear. This would be similiar to how missions are done now (the weapon you use currently effects the level of your missions) but using the overall ability of your squad/group to determine the difficulty of the mission. It might be easier to allow SL to just be able to access a SL only mission info screen from the reb/imp terminals though this would be restrict those who do not wish to declare a faction.

6- Give some kind of ability mod or benefit to a SL who has also attained higher factional rank. Using the idea above (#5) a Staff Sergeant squadleader could access a rebel terminal and attain a good mission for his squad but get paid a higher reward then a Lance Corporal squadleader.

I just want to say that I love this thread, it is one of the few that I have read that has a goodmomentum. I really hope some of the good ideas from this thread reaches the DEV ears and they do something. Until then I will keep on pluggin away.

Wow, I am seeing some nice suggestions across the board here so far. And yes, while it's probable that the Devs already have some ideas in mind for Squad Leader, I don't think we will be in the same boat as Ranger. Ranger just sort of got Super-Scout skills. That was the basis for their character. The Squad Leader got Super-Suck skills. It kind of indicates to me that the Devs like the concept of Squad Leader a whole lot more than the design and execution. Besides, we haven't even seen a "We're working on it!" post. So they might not have turned their attention to it at all. Hopefully threads like these, that offer suggestions for improvment instead of just skill bashing, will show the Devs that the Squad Leader community WANTS to play and WANTS to make the game better. My experience on this board and in the Beta board is that they DO respect that. So keep 'em coming! I'm already imaginging a "Master List" for my dream Squad Leader build. Heh.

heres a few

avenging angel: The squad leader is able to incap himself, and breathe fresh lif einto downed squad members. He gives an equal share of his HAM to every incappe dmember of the squad at the cost of incapping himself AND losing every HAM he has......when he gets back up he wont be doing much. SO for instance if u have 2 peopel down, he uses Avenging Angel and each member gets hal fof his HAM, he incaps but doe snot die....3 people, each get a third, etc

similar to retreat except you do not die and it allows for a small renewal to downe dmembers.

Hold Ground: SL refuses to yield any ground to advancing enemy. ALl group members may not move for 30 seconds to one minute, except for posture change. During this time all member armor ratings ar eimproved by 1, and all defense modifers are DOUBLED. Would cost 400 or so health and half of that mind and action, showing the SL controlling his men and physically straining himself, the willpower to issue an order like this, and the action to runa round and bolster the line.

FORMATIONS:

i think novice and master squad leaders should get FORMATIONS to use. The Formatiosn would move as one with the squad leader, every move he makes the members mimic it. It allows for VERY precise and controlled squa dmovement management.....which i feel is needed for advanced gameplay

formations would allow the SL to set up a specific type of squad formation with set parameters. Eveyr memebr is X paces away from another, this is what teh shape of the formation is, etc. The formation is not broken unless released by the SL. Using a simple tool the SL could designate each group member a NUMBER...and that number would fall into a pre-designated generic formation template.

For example in line formation you would have

member9,7,5,3, 1, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10 number 1 would be the SL with all othe rmembers branching out.

therefore when the SL formed a group he just assigns a number to each player, and whenever he calls a formation the computer automatically sees who is what number an dplaces them in formation according to what the template says...... SL's would get a small 2D interface with the novice ability to look at what the formations look like...or maybe some added pagebook on this site.

i know it sound sconfusing but its not really.... all im saying is the devs create a generic template numbering each "space" in the formation so that when u assign a number to a squad member, the comp can automatically place them when formation is called.

at novice a SL gets Column, single line, double line,and route step.

on to the abilities:

in column the SL designates a 2 man wide and up to 10 man long double column formation. Each member is soemhting liek 2 or 3 meters away, front back, side to side. This allows for everyoen to stick close together for close-order marching and would be highly effective at long distance trips thru territory with lots of enemies about.

1, 2

3, 4

5, 6,

7, 8

9, 10

in single line the SL can form a singleline the extends with him at the center, and then members flanking him to either side to form a line of combatants. This creates a wall of evenly spaced and resilient enemies advancing or retreating together.

9, 7, 5, 3, 1, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10

double line is the same except the SL forms a double line..if the SL is smart he puts melee in front and ranged in the rear.

10, 8, 6, 1, 2, 4

9, 7, 5, 3

route step: breaks formation and allows for normal movement and freedom.

at MASTER a SL gets skirmish line, square, and parade rest

in skirmish the squad gets an additional +10 terrain negotiaion and 10% bonus to movement speed in general. The squad has bene place din skirmish status..they ar ein the front vanguard of an army, flankers for an armoy, scouting thru the woods, or otherwise in a hunting and more alerted advancing posture. The formation would be similar to a double line, except it would be staggered

10 8 6 1 3

9 7 52 4

square- further gives a +5 melee and ranged defense bonus...or perhaps an AR rating increase, or a 10% extra resist to all attack types. The SL has realized he is outnumbered, outgunned, surrounded or whatever...he forms his men up in a square to give it one last stand, back to back.

10 12

95

8 76

parade rest: essentially just a organized route step. Can only be used in a town or camp. increases the regen rate of group members by X%

as i said i know the formation thing can seem kinda confusing but is quite simple. I think this alone would give a tremendous UNIQUE ability to squad leaders and allow for more ffective command issuance and mobility. Being able to have members locke din formation and move as one whole unit instea dof off willy-nilly as you please alone would make squad leader effective.

oh parade rest would also lower battle fatigue

an SL should also have highly attuned alert status for lal group members...in fact

readiness: at the onset of any engagement in which the squad is atatcked FIRST.....the SL is able to realize the danger and warn the squad. Every squad member is able to auto-dodge the first attack or 2 aime dat them reflecting this

i also think that SL's should ahve soem sort of ability...liek that trick shoot one....where they can give up maybe 3 rounds of combat and a little HAM to allow their members to fire HAM free for a round or 2

i'd like to see one, of course i may get flamed for this but here goes

/inspire - this command would give every group member a HAM enhancement on their red and green bars, much like master doctors are able to do, but would only last half the time, would be great for bolstering morale before a big battle.....opinions??

alot of these ideas are good but alot of them cut into other professions

like the increased HAM bar and the healing of BF in camp

i dont like that......

Zal'hanan Sniper/SL

who else heals BF in camp?

entertainers?

thats broke, remember