Jedi Archive

Last night while helping a guildie tune some crystals etc I found a bunch of old pre cu crytals and pearls in one of my storage houses and decided to try an experiement. I had just tuned 21 post CU "good" pearls and their range was 43-88. I had tuned a large number of the old pre cu "poor" crystals and what was very obvious from the outset is the chance range on the older was much wider than post CU.

Example:

Post Cu "good" crystals and pearls range (21 sampled):
43-88 Max Damage

Pre Cu "Poor" crystals (16 sampled):
16-91 Max Damage

Pre Cu "fair" crystals (3 sampled):
21-82 Max Damage

Pre CU "good" crystals (6 sampled):
34-100

I think is should be clear that the algorithm that is used to determine pearl tune values was fundamentally altered in the CU to limit pearl tune values to within a very narrow range of mediocrity. This means that while it may be theoretically possible to get a perfect tune (120 -9) from a "good" pearl, the odds of it actually happening are so remote as to be functionally impossible. It seems obvious that a major part of the CU's intent was to significantly reduce the power of jedi through nerfing pearl drops, adding action/mind costs to sabers, utterly ruining some of the saber strikes jedi relied upon Pre CU like dervish. These actions would drastically limit the power of newly unlocked jedi. They then attempted to remove ADK"S to destroy the power of the older jedi, but backed off that due to the huge outcry. It seems clear that my statements post CU have come true. We are no longer jedi but wizards from another game genre altogether, and next expansion we will even get flaming swords (how trite).

SWG DEV's I have a game design tip for you. If you want people to invest time and energy and money in building a life in the universe you are creating, then dont take from them all their hard work in a capricious way. Dont just wave your hand and make 2 years of work go away, people wont trust you, and they wont invest in your universe (hence the many cancelled subscriptions).

Tip # 2 : Dont lie. People dont like it, it breeds mistrust and leads to a total breakdown in the relationship between the gamers and you folks running the game. Tiggs, I am very disappointed in your patent lie about pearl drop changes being a "bug". It is not a bug and you know it and knew it when you made the statement. Pearl drops and tune changes were game design changes and were intended, and your lies were an obvious and cheap effort to try to soften the very obvious nerf. You are a parent, do you teach your children to lie to those around them? Why then would you lie to us? Dont do it. It is destructive and just plain stupid.


Shendrin
Sheridan'
Guild Leader
Noble Legends
Mayor
Valley of Legends
Naboo, Lowca

Tip #3:

LOL I'm no mathematician, but I'd think you would need to more samples than what you've done. You only tested 3 fair ctrystals and 6 good ones? Dude, seriously...

Yeah, try tuning about 100-200 then tell me if tuning has changed.

I have long held to the theory that tunes only reveal the stats assigned to a pearl/crystal when it is generated as loot after the death of the mob. The tune isnt the roll for stats...the roll is done when the loot drops.

The worst part of the CU for me was having 4 perfect pearls turn to crap after. The best after the CU was 84 damage...,the rest actually had basically the same damage mod as before the CU one turning to 48 max one to 55 one 67 and one 84. Talk about a kick in the junk...

Message Edited by Tripbacca on 09-07-2005 04:40 PM

This sampling is not big enough to tell anything, especially with the fairly small difference you describe pre and post CU.

I'm not convinced anything has changed....they just took the high end stuff out of the game.

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GinazResser wrote:
LOL I'm no mathematician, but I'd think you would need to more samples than what you've done. You only tested 3 fair ctrystals and 6 good ones? Dude, seriously...

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I have to agree with GinazResser on this one. Your sample size to Pre-cu fair and good is too small to be of much use and your data for Post-CU good and Pre-CU poor aren't very useful since you only included min and max values. Mean and standard deviation are also important. In fact it is likely that the mean and standard deviation are what differentiates that different grades of crystals.

I swearI don't mean this as a flame, but this makes no sense to me "Last night while helping a guildie tune some crystals". How do you help some one tune crystals? Once tuned only the tune'er can use them....you've gone and confused me dag nabit.

Hmm, it would be helpful if you read the post a little more carefully. There are in actuality 3 groups of pearls/crystals not just 2 as you stated from the pre cu variety. I did not have high enough numbers of items to be statistically as sound as I would like for this particular test, but none of us can go back and get any more pre cu tuneable items now can we? I used what I had and the results are noticeably different. And for those who do not know me, I tuned hundreds of pearls pre cu and catalogued lots of data from that time period to get the saber I currently have so I have a very good charting of what tuning used to be pre cu and what it is now from all of the tunes we have done post cu to help guildies with their sabers. The above experiment was a small snapshot of the results we have been seeing on a much larger scale.

I would also encourage you naysayers to read the legion other posts in this forum stating similar results to my own.

Shendrin
Sheridan'

Well Monday night I finally broke down and tuned ALL my crystals and pearls..some pre-cu, most post.

I went from worst quality to best in one sitting.

5 poors- ranged from 10-83 damage lowest -fc was 3

11 fairs- 33-78 damage, lowest -fc 5

27 goods- 24-91 damage, lowest -fc 7 (only -7 on pearls)

16 quality- 11-86 damage, lowest -fc 7 (also only -7 on pearls)

2 select crystals- 45/45 -7, 84/84 -4 (both pre-cu)

2 premium crystals- 56/56 -8, 77/77 -8 (both pre-cu)

2 premium pearls- 94/94 -9 and 120/120 -9 (both pre-cu)

Thats the 1st ever perfect tune for me, I about fell out of my chair as it was the very last tune.

Overall I see no changes, its all random. Only thing that I see is higher quality stuff gets you better -force cost. Now I am like a junkie with no fix. Having that sack of pearls/crystals was nice but I did make my saber way way better. All worked out in the end.

Hope that helps some..

OK, lets us look at the inverse then. To all of you who think tuning has not changed. Provide some statistics to the contrary. Let us see your data suppporting your contention that all is the same. Perhaps you are obvlivious to all the reports aside from my own reporting similar results. In the roughly 350 pearls my guild has tuned since the CU, there has not been a single, not one 120 -9. Not single one. What is more, there have only been 3 over 110 and those were from pre cu premiums and one pre cu flawless. Every other tune has been under 105. In the month prior to CU alone we had 11 perfect tunes in our guild. Now there are some who will argue that it is the quality of the pearls that is producing these variations, but I do not think that argument is tenable. If you look at a simple tuning range graph to establish your baseline of expectations your standard deviation can be established, and a clear pattern emerges. Before you dismiss this data, do your own experiements. If you have anything left from pre cu, plot your own graphs and you will see a very significant different in the width of range in tunes pre cu to post cu.

Shendrin
Sheridan'

As for helping a guildie tune pearls, everyone has their own theory as to what circumstances help tuning, last night I was talking the guildie through some different theories of what effects tunes, and offering suggestions once we were done with the experiment for things he could try to effect tuning outcomes, but the evidence for those theories is IMO inconclusive at best.

Shendrin
Sheridan'