Jedi Archive

Good morning !

The current BH-Jedi system is causing "hatress in the playerbase" (O-words SoE).

Every side is constantly complaining.
Either the Jedis are to uber or the BHs are to strong.

Jedis got nerfed, BHs got pushed, chain rooting, Daze, Ganking 5:1, XP-loss, griefing, exploiting: These are all "keywords" whenever the unholy issue Jedi/BH comes up.

Besides Gizmos FRS vision, i want to suggest the following changes, to make this game what it should be again:
FUN !


Allowing customers to grief other customers
(XP loss is discomforting, intended discomforting is griefing). This is the bo boo No.1 of SoE:
Allowing/approving this.

BH hate Jedi, Jedi hate BHs, too many respec BH-kiddis, too many Respec-Exploit-Jedis.

The hate on the servers is on its zenith, the fun is gone, paranoic grindtimes are the daily business (not talking bout me, im full templated - and btw: I have a BH too, i know both sides).

I am suggesting these changes:

1. Remove the XP loss. There is no real meaning in it even (the "populationcntrol" of Jedis failed)
2. Bring BH himself on the term, when he fails his mission
3. Make Jedis uber
4. Forbid Jedis to attack players FIRST (except FRS toons)
5. Tone BH back comparable professions but give them sepcialmoves only affecting Jedis (like "forcesensitive feedbackshot")
6. Remove 5:1 - Make it 1:1


The above changes would grant:
Hatress gone. No Jedi get hard feeling anymore being killed. He clones (or REZ) and thats it. Everyone happy.

BHs would not be hatred cuz "unfairly loved by Devs due to loudest whining"

Jedis cant initate player-attack anymore, so their "uberness" is not affecting the gameplay for others. No baseraids anymore, no "Naboo Theed ganking" no "disturbance" in playerevents anymore.


The game would be fun again, the BY SOE ADVERTISED PROFESSION would not get punished every day for "only choosing it" and the BH/Jedi relation gets unstressed like never before.

You, SoE, you must face that there IS no balance for Jedis.
They ARE "uber", you CANT balance something "uber".

But you can build mechanisms to make the relationship to other professions FAIR.


PLEASE SoE, return the **FUN** into the game considering these changes.


/Oppinions
/sign
/flame

on....



@Mod / Jedi Correspondent:
When players agree: Sticky ?
When players disagree: Never mind :-P


So far:
Happy gameplay you all !

Message Edited by Swg-Addict on 07-04-2005 03:34 AM

some good points...but if it would be 1:1, that would mean your mission goes off terms once a BH has it...which means a jedi's alt can pick up the mission and hang on to it...look, no more BH until you finish template and your free to get vis

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silentjunior wrote:
some good points...but if it would be 1:1, that would mean your mission goes off terms once a BH has it...which means a jedi's alt can pick up the mission and hang on to it...look, no more BH until you finish template and your free to get vis

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Solution: The player that picks the mission has 4 hours to go through with it and it will "fall off" ( no punishment to BHer ) That person wont be able to take the same mission for XX hours again

i think removing names from the terms and just adding online status and faction would be good enough... that alone would stop a lot of ganking... just my opinion.

Good ideas here. Especially the idea that Jedi cannot attack any non-Jedi first, but can only attack back...first time I hear this one. That idea together with granting the BH's some special anti-Jedi skills are the counterbalance to making Jedi "uber". So a nicely balanced package of ideas, good post.

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Dairius wrote:

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silentjunior wrote:
some good points...but if it would be 1:1, that would mean your mission goes off terms once a BH has it...which means a jedi's alt can pick up the mission and hang on to it...look, no more BH until you finish template and your free to get vis

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But if you die to a BH in his changes, you don't lose XP, so it wouldn't matter. It would allow those who enjoy random PvP to have fun and those who just want PvE to enjoy the game also. I agree with the idea that the XP penalty makes the game less fun than it normally would be. After all, Jedi are the only ones who are threatened by it and that is one huge reason why I quit playing other SOE games like Everquest. No one likes to lose experience and it does develop some grief(ing). I also agree that it has not trimmed the Jedi population up as much as it was probably intended, and that if the Jedi population is to be trimmed, other possibilities should be looked into. I believe that if they want to penalize Jedi for dying to a BH, other alternatives could be found, such as having an XP penalty for a set amount of time after dying to a BH. Sure it would be uncomfortable, but the XP would continue to be positive, and considering how much XP we make as it is, this could still cause Jedi to try to stay hidden, yet not upset them so much when they die. The entire BH vs Jedi system should be looked at and tweaked somewhat to make the experience positive for both sides. As it is now, only the BHs are enjoying the hunt, and I believe the Jedi should enjoy it as well. I wouldn't mind being hunted if I knew that I would not be 'in the hole' for XP if I died, but if I knew I'd lose a percentage of all XP I gained after I died for a set amount of time, it would make me fight to not get that penalty.

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agreed, the xp lose is just insane and the fact that the BH has absolutly no penilty should he/she fail the mission is just as insane, all xp debt has done is gotten to group of players fighting and haterd abounds, SOE need to rethink this instead of implementing half baked ideas as fixs or patchs that futher bork a already severly borked set of circumstances.

I personally will think twice about purchaseing any other SOE MMORPG that may surface in the future after haveing experinced the hatebetween two classes that that have apparently encouraged in this one. I dont want to hate people in a game I dont want to be forced to hate and or fear them cause of my choices in a imaginary world and I should not be forced into this set of circumstances, its a game and the fun needs to come back. I am on the verge of leaving the game cause Ireally have to push my self to push that link to SWG as I know my online time will be nothing but hate tells from theBH I dont wish to fight while they follow my cloaked self all over the game. I had one the other day follow me 4k across talus, into space and across corellia toall the vendors I was going tothe entire time sending hate tells and nasty messages. to me its not worth my time as I know with healsnerfed and that if I did fight it would lead to certain death no fun in going into a fight you know youll lose. I went into jedi knowing and accepting the risk but at the time there was the possiblity of actually winning the fight you might have now the possiblity is gone and I find my self playing other games entirely where I dont have imature BH following me around being rude.

Message Edited by tezzla on 07-05-2005 01:47 AM

This is a very valid point, even SoE admitted it already, worded like "The BH/Jedi relationship is causing hatress under the players" (osr something like that).

Well, we are so happy you can see this finally, SoE....but only TALKING about it is not changing anything, we need to DO something.

I mean, handling Jedis as the "hated child" in the game, is such a very wrong attitude in my oppinion, an attitude SoE keeps up.

Lets rewind the tape quick and listen to the first verse again...it was a bit ago:

SoE had NO Jedis (Player Jedis) in the game, and ALWAYS stated, there will be no Playerjedi (do you write it in one or two words ? hmm) in the game ever.

LUCAS was the one, changing this finally. SoE HAD to bring in Jedi when Lucas were ordering it, simple.

The Devs are "allowed" to programm this game and to make sure (by design) it is working, fair and starwarsy-feel.

Neither Lucas or the customer is ASKING SoE for oppinions, you have to understand this, SoE:
You are a payed contracted "Realizing and Operating instrument". This is not "your" game, this is property and Trademark of Lucas Art.

And we, as the upholding (due to payment) paying customer are either satisfied (game=gaining money) or displeased (=cancelling accounts=Devs lose jobs=Devs are seen at the drive-in counter at Wendys soon....or screwing up other titles, fresh bought from Warner (eg.Matrix online)).

This is no offense SoE, but you need to change your attitude. Your are not the "Kindergarten teacher" telling us puree-slobbering babys directions and pre-chewed content.

There are guidelines, storylines and mechanisms working or not....and im sorry, but the past (and the CU mostly) is prooving, your ideas are NOT working.

It is time to pull the head....and start listening.

The story is easy:
You dont wanted Jedi, Lucas wants.

Its not your product (Star Wars ® by Lucas), you are paid to realize the visions of Lucas.

Lucas say "Make Jedis", you do!

And not halfhearted with "resistance" and hidden "spoil mechanisms".

Either you HAVE Jedis...or you have NOT.

But WHEN you have Jedis, then do it fullhearted, and stop punishing them every day/patch and screwing the whole balance.

I do not want to sound rude, nor respectless, but please scroll up and take some advises of cleaning up the mess we have these days.

Or are YOU not interessted in ANY way giving your customers a game which is FUN to play for EVERY1 who shoots u 15 bux a month... ?

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tezzla wrote:

agreed, the xp lose is just insane and the fact that the BH has absolutly no penilty should he/she fail the mission is just as insane, all xp debt has done is gotten to group of players fighting and haterd abounds, SOE need to rethink this instead of implementing half baked ideas as fixs or patchs that futher bork a already severly borked set of circumstances.

I personally will think twice about purchaseing any other SOE MMORPG that may surface in the future after haveing experinced the hatebetween two classes that that have apparently encouraged in this one. I dont want to hate people in a game I dont want to be forced to hate and or fear them cause of my choices in a imaginary world and I should not be forced into this set of circumstances, its a game and the fun needs to come back. I am on the verge of leaving the game cause Ireally have to push my self to push that link to SWG as I know my online time will be nothing but hate tells from theBH I dont wish to fight while they follow my cloaked self all over the game. I had one the other day follow me 4k across talus, into space and across corellia toall the vendors I was going tothe entire time sending hate tells and nasty messages. to me its not worth my time as I know with healsnerfed and that if I did fight it would lead to certain death no fun in going into a fight you know youll lose. I went into jedi knowing and accepting the risk but at the time there was the possiblity of actually winning the fight you might have now the possiblity is gone and I find my self playing other games entirely where I dont have imature BH following me around being rude.

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Use /addignore to get rid of your stalkers, there are poor sports in every profession.

As for the other points, sorry if it sounds harsh but adapt or, if you can't,leave, what's the point of playing a game which frustrates you ? You're playing a game with thousands of other people, who have different views and take fun in different ways, so it's a bit selfish to say "change that because I'm not having fun". I know there are others with the same view, probably lots, but if it was so bad, they'd change it. SOE won't shoot itself in the foot by inflicting continous pain on their paying customers if they knew customer satisfaction is under some quota.

good idea, but i think u shdu add 1 more thing, increase bh rewards. 256k isnt worththefabled extinct jedi.

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jalexu wrote:

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tezzla wrote:

agreed, the xp lose is just insane and the fact that the BH has absolutly no penilty should he/she fail the mission is just as insane, all xp debt has done is gotten to group of players fighting and haterd abounds, SOE need to rethink this instead of implementing half baked ideas as fixs or patchs that futher bork a already severly borked set of circumstances.

I personally will think twice about purchaseing any other SOE MMORPG that may surface in the future after haveing experinced the hatebetween two classes that that have apparently encouraged in this one. I dont want to hate people in a game I dont want to be forced to hate and or fear them cause of my choices in a imaginary world and I should not be forced into this set of circumstances, its a game and the fun needs to come back. I am on the verge of leaving the game cause Ireally have to push my self to push that link to SWG as I know my online time will be nothing but hate tells from theBH I dont wish to fight while they follow my cloaked self all over the game. I had one the other day follow me 4k across talus, into space and across corellia toall the vendors I was going tothe entire time sending hate tells and nasty messages. to me its not worth my time as I know with healsnerfed and that if I did fight it would lead to certain death no fun in going into a fight you know youll lose. I went into jedi knowing and accepting the risk but at the time there was the possiblity of actually winning the fight you might have now the possiblity is gone and I find my self playing other games entirely where I dont have imature BH following me around being rude.

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Use /addignore to get rid of your stalkers, there are poor sports in every profession.

As for the other points, sorry if it sounds harsh but adapt or, if you can't,leave, what's the point of playing a game which frustrates you ? You're playing a game with thousands of other people, who have different views and take fun in different ways, so it's a bit selfish to say "change that because I'm not having fun". I know there are others with the same view, probably lots, but if it was so bad, they'd change it. SOE won't shoot itself in the foot by inflicting continous pain on their paying customers if they knew customer satisfaction is under some quota.

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This would be valid if there was a second MMORPG "Star Wars Galaxies", operated by another company as an alternativ.

I do not like the "If you dont like then leave" argument because it is no.

If you buy a car and the brakes are broken, you wont hear "if you dont like, drive volkswagen" from the Ford Dealer, you would answer "But i like your car, IF IT WOULD WORK"-and now fix it-i making use of demanding you fulfilment of the contracted delivery.

This is what we are doing:
We have a contract with SoE (every1 of us has).

SWG was fun when it wasnt that buggy and unbalanced (yes, the CU does more imbalance the pre-CU - see my signature).

It is still fun but has majorbugs and misdesigns which are fixable without pulling a leg.

I love SWG, thats why i dont start playing SIMS, i demand the fulfilment of contracted flawless delivery of gamecontent/mechanisms.

I wonder sometimes, if this is an EUROPEAN/USA "culture problem".

If we want something which was promissed and isnt delivered as contracted, we dont buy elsewhere, we kick booty of originin contractpartner.

Makes life more exciting btw, try it... :-P

Message Edited by Swg-Addict on 07-05-2005 02:43 AM

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jalexu wrote:

Use /addignore to get rid of your stalkers, there are poor sports in every profession.

As for the other points, sorry if it sounds harsh but adapt or, if you can't,leave, what's the point of playing a game which frustrates you ? You're playing a game with thousands of other people, who have different views and take fun in different ways, so it's a bit selfish to say "change that because I'm not having fun". I know there are others with the same view, probably lots, but if it was so bad, they'd change it. SOE won't shoot itself in the foot by inflicting continous pain on their paying customers if they knew customer satisfaction is under some quota.

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Please refer to my post: http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=jedi&message.id=1047910

Message Edited by Dairius on 07-05-2005 04:49 AM