Jedi Archive
Thread: MCM is being given break cloak!
Eme wrote:
>as it is right now, ruins game play
---------------------------------
ruins 'your' idea of gameplay, it doesnt ruin others that play the game differently to you, this nerf is going to force a limited style of play on people, its going to remove tactics and nuances and depth from the game.
Ok here goes.... Lets all work outside the box here....
Yes, and everyone doesn't play the game like you... maybe you can expand on that simple statement you made??
It isn't a nerf. Limited : Limited style of play is ... well cloaking and running, instead of dealing with the situation in a more interactive way . Hence ... adding more tactics,depth etc. I mean... how dare Sony make a change to encourage gameplay!!!
Message Edited by Ra-impi on 09-20-2005 04:39 PM
mauvros wrote:
I wouldn’t think of Cloak as an escape tool. Its abusable that way. Cloak is more like a first strike or surveillance tool.
They do need to fix the paralyze and stacking DOT's though. See my other post for that.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
That may be true for a player that took 0400, but it is not the same for a MWielder for the many reasons stated in all the other threads on this topic.
Buku
Naritus
TaranDraconise wrote:
Ra-impi wrote:
Have to agree, this is a step in the right direction. I play both proff and think cloak as it is right now, ruins game play. It's good to see a counter to a 'nerf' for once.
The only game play it ruins is the BH content. Once and for all I am a player not a bread crumb that makes up 50% of someone elses content. Remove the Jedi from the BH's terms or give Jedi a term to hunt BH's. I AM NOT SOME OTHER PLAYERS CONTENT.
Unfortunately you are. The sooner you realise this the better, otherwise you may need to consider a different proff.
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Personally I didn't use it to run away. I used it to regen force during an extended fight, and eat foods after a BH used his "Alpha Attack" and began the root/kite process with his ranged arms.
Chaneling wouldn't be such an important aspect of Cloak for Wielders if Force Powers and Sabers were on par for damage, speed and costs, but that is not the case. Until the game provides equitable compensation for the lower damage/speed, and higher force/action costs of Powers there is no way to compare a Wielders reliance on Cloak versus that of a dabbler.
Buku
Naritus
Message Edited by BukuJohnson on 09-20-2005 08:44 AM
INCREASED FC AND ADDED MIND COST FTF(For The Fix)
actions towards another player breaks cloak /improvedFix
ahood wrote:
Yes, thats right. If the proposed Cloak nerf goes live, MBH/MCM can kill cloaked Jedi easy.
How?
DoTs.
Deuterium Fire DoTs kill/incap players. Poison/bleeds only reduce you to 1 health. So, BH runs up, chucks the ol' petrol bomb on the Jedi and the Jedi can no longer cloak. If the Jedi does cloak, then he is;
a) Snared - so wont go from the spot he cloaked that fast. (plus atm you can see Fire Dot graphics to follow them)
b)The Jedi cant heal. Yep. The Fire Dot will tick for 350 a time, and if the jedi pops a stim or self heals, he uncloaks (as healing will be a combat action to break cloak). So BH starts shooting again.
c) Cone/AoE still hit the jedi, and the jedi can still be incapped and uncloaked. Since they cant heal, while cloaked, then just targetting weenie critters nearby and coning the area will kill many jedi quick.
If the BH is lucky enough to land a poison and a fire dot, then cloak wont get the jedi very far at all.
All the cloakers are moaning about the snare, but that doesnt matter because it only applies after you are cloaked. The real worry we should panic about is the inability to self heal after cloaking, because without this, cloaking means you will often be dead shortly.
Exceptions are if you can find a body of water fast (while snared!) or have 50-100fill left on both drink/food. But for most people, cloaking after this change = dead.
(sigh) here comes my nerf 
For the record I don't support any nerfs!
Jacella wrote:
Instead of trying to run...why not just kill the BH?
Some can, I hope that they do. However, flat out, I'm not that good. Be it skill or crap saber, I can't go long term against a MBH/MCM. As a policy, I no longer fight any MCM. They are overpowered as far as I'm concerned and it is my intention to deny them any fun or content.
I don't know why the devs can't add up the simple numbers but in the damage per second vs heal per second, it's pretty well stacked against most jedi. Some are good enough or have good enough equip to overcome that IMBALANCE (yeah I said it), I doubt most are.
Padawans aren't built as strong as some elite profession combinations. Just how it is, but it doesn't mean I have to commit suicide by sticking around to be burnt, poisoned, diseased, thryroid ruptured then completely out healed.
On the matter of cloaking. I have no cloak and it's not needed for escape. However, even as a non-cloaker I still believe that they shouldnt' add a snare, or break cloak on self heals. The looting and healing others can go away and I, for one, wouldn't mind. But this other stuff that we think is going to happen is uncalled for and will destroy any purpose for that skill.
Message Edited by Don_T_Shoot on 09-20-2005 12:05 PM
ahood wrote:
Yes, thats right. If the proposed Cloak nerf goes live, MBH/MCM can kill cloaked Jedi easy.
How?
DoTs.
Deuterium Fire DoTs kill/incap players. Poison/bleeds only reduce you to 1 health. So, BH runs up, chucks the ol' petrol bomb on the Jedi and the Jedi can no longer cloak. If the Jedi does cloak, then he is;
a) Snared - so wont go from the spot he cloaked that fast. (plus atm you can see Fire Dot graphics to follow them)
b)The Jedi cant heal. Yep. The Fire Dot will tick for 350 a time, and if the jedi pops a stim or self heals, he uncloaks (as healing will be a combat action to break cloak). So BH starts shooting again.
c) Cone/AoE still hit the jedi, and the jedi can still be incapped and uncloaked. Since they cant heal, while cloaked, then just targetting weenie critters nearby and coning the area will kill many jedi quick.
If the BH is lucky enough to land a poison and a fire dot, then cloak wont get the jedi very far at all.
All the cloakers are moaning about the snare, but that doesnt matter because it only applies after you are cloaked. The real worry we should panic about is the inability to self heal after cloaking, because without this, cloaking means you will often be dead shortly.
Exceptions are if you can find a body of water fast (while snared!) or have 50-100fill left on both drink/food. But for most people, cloaking after this change = dead.
(sigh) here comes my nerf
For the record I don't support any nerfs!
Drazharr wrote:
cloudwalker1 wrote:
Drazharr wrote:
Actually, Jess, Wook and I are basing are speculation on the facts, while you are basing your speculation on wishful thinking.
JessieJames19 wrote:
Drazharr wrote:
JessieJames19 wrote:
WookieOgre wrote:
JessieJames19 wrote:
Appearantly, you can turn on FR before cloaking. ( and attacking might turn it off which may be really nice) and FR 2 + snare is doable getting into range for an alph attack
What do you mean apparantly, the devs have spoken and said anything that will allow you to escape will not work with Cloak. That means you have FR/BurstRun going there will more than likely be a message saying you can not cloak until you stop running.
Why is this so hard to understand? You will not be able to buff/heal/run at all while you are cloaked, if you read the description from the devs. Essentially that means you have to crawl to your victims inorder to hit them.....assuming you have force left after you crawl past everything.
i know what was said.
Said that some buffs cant be done while cloaked
Said also that some buffs will be undone when uncloaking
what does what? a dev has not yet said.. so spare me
You just believe what you want to believe, don't ya' Jesse? It doesn't matter when facts are presented to you, you just ignore them, bro.
Those are not facts. its speculation. Nobody can find where the devs said it will be like that.Only test center for the win. Also though it says that doign soem actions cloaked WILL reveal you. There is no fact that sayingyou can not activate fr then cloak. Its its own buff till you turn it off. I understand where is speculation comes from though. Jus liek force speed. last 15 min and you can turn it on before cloaking. Hence the chance of lossing buffs when you uncloak
you cant medidate while cloaked anyways usles you use the cloak bug, this way they get rid of it regardless
actually you are not using any facts here is the ruleset tht will apply to cloak/camoflauge
The Rifleman's Cover ability and a Jedi's Force Cloak now adhere to a common rule-set that falls in line with the new hiding/stealth system introduced with the Ranger revamp.
Here are some rules common to all types of buffs that remove you from sight (including Force Cloak):
1. Taking any offensive action reveals you instantly (currently the only exception is the Rifleman's ability Conceal Shot).
2. Interacting with some objects in the world instantly reveals you (could be switches, terminals, containers, etc)
3. Some commands cannot be executed and require you to reveal yourself before executing the command
4. All of these buffs can be "toggled off" at any time you wish to become view-able by others
5. Some non-combat actions can also reveal you (like healing for instance)
6. You are afflicted with a movement snare when you are stealthy (rooted when just camouflaged)
this implies using a skill after cloaked will de cloak you. no were does it say that having it activated before you cloak will stop you from cloaking or strip the buff away from you
I think #3 and #4 say that.
My question would be "Why would they give the counter to MCM when it iis BH's who hunt Jedi?" Identifying a "Cloaked" Jedi is a combat skill for Jedi hunters, not a medical/chemical skill. Unless of course it is SOE's intent for MBH to have MCM as a secondary. Makes you wonder where their thought processes are. I own a business and I can tell you that I wonder how they stay in business with their boneheaded developement decisions. I figure it wont be long before someone else comes out with a Star Wars MMPORG. Maybe they will make more sensible decisions.
/Rant on
People say Jedi are a PVP class and as such dictates they should be able to be hunted by other players. I feel it boils down to plain 'ol player griefing when they are the only ones that can be hunted. BH is a PvP class, CM is a PvP class, as is Commando. Why not make it so ANY player can find themselves on the terms? If their reasoning is because it would allow for player griefing, then they are contradicting themselves and are authorizing player griefing of Jedi. The Jedi profession should be a tough role to play, but so should BH and any combat class. I also feel that there should be a way to attack another player without going through the whole \Duel thing. Maybe have an option to be fulltime PvP. Many would not like to see anything suggested here but I would bet good money they are the same ones who take Jedi missions daily. And yes, I have a Jedi toon and a BH toon. And no...I havent been killed by a BH for quite some time. Just my opinions here whether you agree or not. Everyone has one.
/Rant off