Jedi Archive
Thread: The 2 things I think master Healer needs most to make it desirable
pizzathehut67 wrote:
my two cents:
jedi should not have rez... the ability was discussed once in the movies (said to have been in the hands of a SITH LORD... not a jedi) and was never used, revealed, shown, or discussed again.
Luke: "But master Yodayou cant die"
Yoda: "Strong am i with the force... but not that strong"
the all powerful most uber jedi of them all cant keep himself alive longer (that is remaining in a state of living) and you want a jedi to bring people back from the dead?
sorry... i dont buy it
the ranged heal... yes
the lower cost heal... yes
a heal that cures ALL and he means ALL states... hell no... doc has a chance to cure all states (and if im not mistaken the chance is determined for each individual state... not all at once) ... jedi should have the same.
So it makes sense for doctors and combat medics to be able to rez?
I'll bump a thread from a friend of mine who's master healer, has some pretty good ideas in it.
Noob, Yoda was talking about the fact that he'd had AI up and his force is drained, he recently popped a holocron and wasn't outside the reuse timer. Besides, Yoda has only 250 skill points to allot and didn't have room for Master Healer because he knows how borked the prof is. Get your facts straight.
pizzathehut67 wrote:
my two cents:
jedi should not have rez... the ability was discussed once in the movies (said to have been in the hands of a SITH LORD... not a jedi) and was never used, revealed, shown, or discussed again.
Luke: "But master Yodayou cant die"
Yoda: "Strong am i with the force... but not that strong"
the all powerful most uber jedi of them all cant keep himself alive longer (that is remaining in a state of living) and you want a jedi to bring people back from the dead?
sorry... i dont buy it
How about having a basic or improved version of total heal given in either a 3rd or 4th tier box. It would do 50% of the master level total heal and cost much less force and mind. I think I could live with that. I do think area heal is a must for healer though.
The only thing I can say about Healeris that unless total heal can fully heal a corpse, then rez is needed for jedi. What's the use of total heal if the jedi has an extreme high force/mind cost which forces the jedi healer to be nothing but a healer whereas a CM or Doc can both heal, fight and defendat the same time, then they can even rez.
As for the person who said that jedi healer shouldn't have everything that doc/cm has....I would only agree if it didn't take so much to become a jedi healer. You have to pay too much to be a jedi healer. You sacrifice nearly all of your combat skills (because healing as a jedi takes too much force / mind) and you suffer defensively as well (to be master healer means you either have to have no defense or take up a lot of defender which also means your stuck with a minimum of one line of sabers or powers. so either way,a master healer gives up a lot just to be master yet they are only good for a couple of minutes then after that, they are totally out of the fight due to no mind and no force left. They might as well be DB'd then.
So from a group pvp standpoint along with having to get 15 million xp (not including the FS grind) and using both force and mind, Master healer needs to be on par with CM/Doc or possibly a little bit better as the one of the concepts of being a jedi is that they have the potential to do everything on an enhanced level than normal beings. The fact that they use the force to enhance their abilities in which no non-jedi can reach the same potential tells me a jedi healer should not be less effective than a CM or Doc. All I'm saying is that for the price one pays to be a master healer, The whole healer discipline needs to be improved. There is a reason noone goes master healer (only do 4000) and it's the least played profession in the game. I think ID should be the least played profession, not Master healer.
Marrow wrote:
1. PvPing in a typical Theed battle - Winner M. Healer - Reasons
a. Total Heal can bring your incapped friend to full health in one shot. This is much better than trying to do a two hit heal because with the first hit the opposing force has the chance to re-incap the team member. Much better to hit them for 4k of health than 2k with a shot.
b. The fight never lasts longer than your force. Over 95% of pvp fights last only a few minutes and the desiding factor can often be how many friends you can get up off the ground before they are DB'ed.
c. From a mind management it is better to use one Total Heal than two of any other heal.
I disagree:
Because PvP happens beyond the Theed...
Winnner Doctor or CM - Reasons
a. Ability of a doctor and combat medic to wear armor regardless of other profession it combines with can mitigate more incoming damage by wearing armor! A Force Healer would have to invest seriously more SP to have similiar capabilities of survival. It doesn't matter that a Jedi Healer can heal faster, because he won't be standing long enough.
b. With only mind to limit them a Doctor or CM will provide healing much longer than a Jedi will.
c. In large battles a Doctor and CM can drag to safetey and revive fellow combatants.
d. PvP for Jediincludes BH missions... and most of those are won by running the Jedi out of force.
Message Edited by Ciscero on 09-28-2005 02:01 PM
GrigsOnia wrote:
From everyone's posts it seems a major complaint is the force cost of healing abilities. Maybe slash the costs a bit to make them more effective? Personally I think comparing them to doc/cm as they are right now is not a good idea, because in my personal opinion docs/cms are overpowered. It seems to be the only class that everyone has in some form or another, that should be a sign of poor balance. I don't think that jedi should get a res. I don't want to see jedi become able to do everything, that will just remove the need for having non jedi professions in the game.
How many Jedi do you know that do not have some amount of Healer? If you use the logic that if folks have it then it must be overpowered then you would say that 4xxx healer is over powered since 90% of Jedi have it.
The main issue is that to go from 4xxx healer to master gains you very little. Total Heal and Sap are about the only things worthing of sp costs.
Where I disagree:
Marrow1 wrote:
1. PvPing in a typical Theed battle - Winner M. Healer - Reasons
a. Total Heal can bring your incapped friend to full health in one shot. This is much better than trying to do a two hit heal because with the first hit the opposing force has the chance to re-incap the team member. Much better to hit them for 4k of health than 2k with a shot.
b. The fight never lasts longer than your force. Over 95% of pvp fights last only a few minutes and the desiding factor can often be how many friends you can get up off the ground before they are DB'ed.
c. From a mind management it is better to use one Total Heal than two of any other heal.
I would have to agree with most of the posts here, expecially regarding rez and group rez as a former master healer i found it annoying that Doc's healing and buffing abilities might as well be force abilities because they do not have to carry anything in thier iventories to support these abilities, DOCs should have to carry BUFF packs, Rez Packs to perform thier abilities, then atleast they wont seem like mystical force abilities and it would give the BE something else to make LOL
Message Edited by _Cicero_ on 09-28-2005 05:22 PM
Ciscero wrote:
I so love watching people who have not played a Master Healer comment on how effective it is.
btw I have one if not the oldest active Doctor on the Starsider server.
My main is a M. Healer, M. LS, and a 4040 defender and I play him a few times a week. I also play Doc and a 4000 cm.
In any given situation one prof is better than the other. Here are some examples:
1. PvPing in a typical Theed battle - Winner M. Healer - Reasons
a. Total Heal can bring your incapped friend to full health in one shot. This is much better than trying to do a two hit heal because with the first hit the opposing force has the chance to re-incap the team member. Much better to hit them for 4k of health than 2k with a shot.
b. The fight never lasts longer than your force. Over 95% of pvp fights last only a few minutes and the desiding factor can often be how many friends you can get up off the ground before they are DB'ed.
c. From a mind management it is better to use one Total Heal than two of any other heal.
2. Solo PvE hunting - Doc - Reasons:
a. solo hunting takes a long time and mind and force management become issues. Doc has no force and mind cost is the least.
3. Group PvE hunting - CM - Reasons:
a. Area heal and ranged. In a group you can take a break and let your mind heal (area heal cost 15%).
Now, if your asking is M. Healer where it should be, IMO, no. Many of the skills are near useless making getting that one useful skill very costly.
If I had my wish I would:
A. add another line to healer that decreased the mind cost
B. add another line to healer that increased the speed.
C. Add in a unique buff such as a force regen buff. It would be costly to the healer to use so that it could not be spammed.
D. Fix the root issue when healing others.
E. Remove the assist healing feature (man I hate it). This is where your targeting a mob and attempt to heal yourself but instead heal some other group member. Yes, I know you can use a macro command but then you have to have two version of each heal which is a pain.
F. Add a healing eff buff what would allow person to heal for a bit more than normal with FH.
I would not add Rez. I dont think that Jedi should have every skill allotted to non-Jedi and this is one that Jedi have never had and should not have, IMO.